5 ms·

How Golden Is Silence, Actually?

76 points by tintinnabula 3mo ago

https://archive.is/8GB36 https://archive.is/8GB36

herodoturtle 2mo ago
Article is behind a paywall for me. Odd that it’s on HN front page :-/
- EGreg 2mo ago
  That’s how much their silence was able to accomplish!
- moritzwarhier 2mo ago
  It annoys me too, but is not unusual for journalism submissions here. HN sometimes likes to discuss texts that weren't published as a free contribution on some blog by a dev with lots of time on their hand. It's not forbidden to post paywalled links on HN, AFAIK. I also struggle to see an alternative when it comes to professional journalism. Maybe a kind soul will be able to share a gift link.
  - tomhow 2mo ago
    I've added the archive.is link to the thread header. > It's not forbidden to post paywalled links on HN, AFAIK. The FAQ states that it's fine to post paywalled links as long as there is a workaround that everyone can easily access.
    - deleted 2mo ago
      [deleted]
- pmontra 2mo ago
  Reader mode bypasses it. It's only a JS layer on top of content that's already inside the HTML doc. Disabling first party JS works too, using umatrix or similar tools. The site works perfectly without JS. Edit: because of all of that, of course view source bypasses the paywall too and reveals tons of inlined CSS.
  - rdevilla 2mo ago
    [dead]
  - sam1r 2mo ago
    This. Comment. ^ is going to change my life. Thank you!! I had no idea, and this is such an elegant fix.
    - sam1r 2mo ago
      “Refresh, and quickly just click the reader button as the page loads slow on mobile, anyways”
      - kalleboo 2mo ago
        In Safari (on iOS and macOS), you can go into site settings and choose "use reader mode when available" and it automatically opens straight into it. After doing that for a while, you'll have it on for the most common news sites you get linked to.
    - pmontra 2mo ago
      There are many paywalls that send all the content in the html and then hide it with a script. However there are many more properly implemented paywalls that send only a few lines of content and you don't find the content even on the archive sites. There are several variations of those schemes. Sometimes there is text but not images. Sometimes the first party js is fine and you have to block some of the third party js. Sometimes the content is in a JSON blob. Sometimes the reader mode trick works but only for a short while before the js paywall removes it (the sibling comment hints about it.) You have to experiment with each site.
  - cuoder 2mo ago
    Wow ok I needed to know this ages ago
- sltkr 2mo ago
  https://archive.is/8GB36 https://archive.is/8GB36 I agree with you though, it's obnoxious to share paywalled articles on Hacker News.
  - tomhow 2mo ago
    Please don't post snarky comments like this on HN. We've wrestled with this for a long time and have settled on the least worst solution: paywalled articles are only allowable if there's an easy workaround that everyone access, like Archive.is, which you've helpfully shared. It's annoying that we have to deal with this issue but we're still better off with the articles than not. We can do without mean words like “obnoxious” for people contributing interesting articles for the community to read. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
TormentNexusAI 2mo ago
[flagged]
Ylano 2mo ago
If almost every absence can count as silence, it becomes very easy to find the theme everywhere
deleted 2mo ago
[deleted]
jordwest 2mo ago
I’ve been on several silent retreats now and one of the most surprising discoveries was just how much speaking is unnecessary. Without the pressure to speak amongst others, it became clear that I often said things out of anxiety - fear of looking weird or of making the other person uncomfortable. Nowadays I rarely speak when I feel that pressure and paradoxically it has led to far deeper relationships and more interesting conversations. It seems that the topics that come up when theres a pressure to fill the silence are the most mundane. Deeper connection seems to happen in the silences, or rather mutual comfort with silence. Another way I could describe it is it feels almost as if there’s a fear of really being seen in silence that the surface level conversation manages to keep at bay.
- tithe 2mo ago
  > Without the pressure to speak amongst others, it became clear that I often said things out of anxiety I can't go probably 100 words without saying something stupid or flat out contradictory. I'll think back to the conversation, realize I don't actually think or believe what I said, and wonder just what possessed me to say that and how many people I've alienated with words that I don't even believe or hold to be true! Silence is one way to avoid making those mistakes, but that's me avoiding the problem, not actually solving it (and it would be nice to speak all the time in truth, with coherence, and consistent with what I believe), despite not having much to say in the first place, unless: - to clear misunderstanding / requests ("Excuse me, but I think this is my seat.") - to prevent harm / danger ("Look out!") - civics / politeness ("Excuse me", "Good morning", "I'm fine, thank you.")
  - bko 2mo ago
    > I'll think back to the conversation, realize I don't actually think or believe what I said, and wonder just what possessed me to say that and how many people I've alienated with words that I don't even believe or hold to be true! I too think back on past blunders or embarrassing moments, even from decades ago. What cured me of over-reflecting on this is to try to identify similar blunders from others. Surely over the years I can think of insensitive blunders of others and I can rarely do so. So if I can't think anything anyone has ever blundered, apart from maybe a handful of instances, others likely can't recall my blunders. I've even brought up cringe moments to friend and they have no recollection. In short, no one cares about what you say. Maybe at the moment they might cringe or immediately after, but your words have pretty much no impact on anyone. Except my wife. She remembers everything offensive I have said.
doublerabbit 2mo ago
I live in a apartment with a courtyard, it's taken me 10 years of knocking on folks doors. Normally it's new tenants who don't know how much noise they make and I have to ask them nicely if they could turn down their devices and show consideration. There have groans, feuds and aggressiveness towards me for asking for peace. I'm not unreasonable. If you wish to have a party, do it adult without DJs blaring till 3am. Most of the time, it's that they didn't realise. But it's had aggressive moments where it's turned to "It's my apartment ..."; and I get it. Folk don't like being told to show consideration for their neighbours and only when the noise effects them do they realise how disrupting noise is. The courtyard too has seagulls and at 5am it turns in to a hellish frenzy. So luckily this has taught folk a lot about how peaceful quiet actually is and on cases have made others move out. And too the courtyard faces the back of a couple of restaurants which are were the exhaust fans for their ovens stand. What I presume is due to lack of calibration as these whirl sometimes up until 2am even though their restaurants close at 11pm. You can really feel the level of atmospheric vibration drop when they shut off. It's a sigh of relief when they do. I've plead, and the local council is useless so I have put up with it. 3am is really the only time I can actually relax my ears in to a slumber because having hyper audio sensory really sucks. Peace is nice and I wish others would value it more. But with peace, folk don't know what to do. It scares them at first because it's rare to encounter in this day and age.
- dnemmers 2mo ago
  Even though the restaurant closes at 11, doesn't meant there isn't plenty of cleaning and 'closing' still left to do by the staff, often into the 'wee' hours.
  - doublerabbit 2mo ago
    These restaurants are locked with shutters down at 11. What I presume is that the cool down is on a uncalibrated timing like unfair traffic lights but you can't really demonstrate this as they just shrug and tell you it's not their problem.
- nradov 2mo ago
  Other HN users keep telling us that we should support dense housing development. I think those people have never lived in an apartment complex with trashy neighbors.
deleted 2mo ago
[deleted]
domeinhornMOT 2mo ago
[flagged]

76 points by tintinnabula 3mo ago

https://archive.is/8GB36 https://archive.is/8GB36

herodoturtle 2mo ago

Article is behind a paywall for me. Odd that it’s on HN front page :-/

EGreg 2mo ago
That’s how much their silence was able to accomplish!
moritzwarhier 2mo ago
It annoys me too, but is not unusual for journalism submissions here. HN sometimes likes to discuss texts that weren't published as a free contribution on some blog by a dev with lots of time on their hand. It's not forbidden to post paywalled links on HN, AFAIK. I also struggle to see an alternative when it comes to professional journalism. Maybe a kind soul will be able to share a gift link.
- tomhow 2mo ago
  I've added the archive.is link to the thread header. > It's not forbidden to post paywalled links on HN, AFAIK. The FAQ states that it's fine to post paywalled links as long as there is a workaround that everyone can easily access.
  - deleted 2mo ago
    [deleted]
pmontra 2mo ago
Reader mode bypasses it. It's only a JS layer on top of content that's already inside the HTML doc. Disabling first party JS works too, using umatrix or similar tools. The site works perfectly without JS. Edit: because of all of that, of course view source bypasses the paywall too and reveals tons of inlined CSS.
- rdevilla 2mo ago
  [dead]
- sam1r 2mo ago
  This. Comment. ^ is going to change my life. Thank you!! I had no idea, and this is such an elegant fix.
  - sam1r 2mo ago
    “Refresh, and quickly just click the reader button as the page loads slow on mobile, anyways”
    - kalleboo 2mo ago
      In Safari (on iOS and macOS), you can go into site settings and choose "use reader mode when available" and it automatically opens straight into it. After doing that for a while, you'll have it on for the most common news sites you get linked to.
  - pmontra 2mo ago
    There are many paywalls that send all the content in the html and then hide it with a script. However there are many more properly implemented paywalls that send only a few lines of content and you don't find the content even on the archive sites. There are several variations of those schemes. Sometimes there is text but not images. Sometimes the first party js is fine and you have to block some of the third party js. Sometimes the content is in a JSON blob. Sometimes the reader mode trick works but only for a short while before the js paywall removes it (the sibling comment hints about it.) You have to experiment with each site.
- cuoder 2mo ago
  Wow ok I needed to know this ages ago
sltkr 2mo ago
https://archive.is/8GB36 https://archive.is/8GB36 I agree with you though, it's obnoxious to share paywalled articles on Hacker News.
- tomhow 2mo ago
  Please don't post snarky comments like this on HN. We've wrestled with this for a long time and have settled on the least worst solution: paywalled articles are only allowable if there's an easy workaround that everyone access, like Archive.is, which you've helpfully shared. It's annoying that we have to deal with this issue but we're still better off with the articles than not. We can do without mean words like “obnoxious” for people contributing interesting articles for the community to read. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

TormentNexusAI 2mo ago

[flagged]

Ylano 2mo ago

If almost every absence can count as silence, it becomes very easy to find the theme everywhere

deleted 2mo ago

[deleted]

jordwest 2mo ago

I’ve been on several silent retreats now and one of the most surprising discoveries was just how much speaking is unnecessary. Without the pressure to speak amongst others, it became clear that I often said things out of anxiety - fear of looking weird or of making the other person uncomfortable. Nowadays I rarely speak when I feel that pressure and paradoxically it has led to far deeper relationships and more interesting conversations. It seems that the topics that come up when theres a pressure to fill the silence are the most mundane. Deeper connection seems to happen in the silences, or rather mutual comfort with silence. Another way I could describe it is it feels almost as if there’s a fear of really being seen in silence that the surface level conversation manages to keep at bay.

tithe 2mo ago
> Without the pressure to speak amongst others, it became clear that I often said things out of anxiety I can't go probably 100 words without saying something stupid or flat out contradictory. I'll think back to the conversation, realize I don't actually think or believe what I said, and wonder just what possessed me to say that and how many people I've alienated with words that I don't even believe or hold to be true! Silence is one way to avoid making those mistakes, but that's me avoiding the problem, not actually solving it (and it would be nice to speak all the time in truth, with coherence, and consistent with what I believe), despite not having much to say in the first place, unless: - to clear misunderstanding / requests ("Excuse me, but I think this is my seat.") - to prevent harm / danger ("Look out!") - civics / politeness ("Excuse me", "Good morning", "I'm fine, thank you.")
- bko 2mo ago
  > I'll think back to the conversation, realize I don't actually think or believe what I said, and wonder just what possessed me to say that and how many people I've alienated with words that I don't even believe or hold to be true! I too think back on past blunders or embarrassing moments, even from decades ago. What cured me of over-reflecting on this is to try to identify similar blunders from others. Surely over the years I can think of insensitive blunders of others and I can rarely do so. So if I can't think anything anyone has ever blundered, apart from maybe a handful of instances, others likely can't recall my blunders. I've even brought up cringe moments to friend and they have no recollection. In short, no one cares about what you say. Maybe at the moment they might cringe or immediately after, but your words have pretty much no impact on anyone. Except my wife. She remembers everything offensive I have said.

doublerabbit 2mo ago

I live in a apartment with a courtyard, it's taken me 10 years of knocking on folks doors. Normally it's new tenants who don't know how much noise they make and I have to ask them nicely if they could turn down their devices and show consideration. There have groans, feuds and aggressiveness towards me for asking for peace. I'm not unreasonable. If you wish to have a party, do it adult without DJs blaring till 3am. Most of the time, it's that they didn't realise. But it's had aggressive moments where it's turned to "It's my apartment ..."; and I get it. Folk don't like being told to show consideration for their neighbours and only when the noise effects them do they realise how disrupting noise is. The courtyard too has seagulls and at 5am it turns in to a hellish frenzy. So luckily this has taught folk a lot about how peaceful quiet actually is and on cases have made others move out. And too the courtyard faces the back of a couple of restaurants which are were the exhaust fans for their ovens stand. What I presume is due to lack of calibration as these whirl sometimes up until 2am even though their restaurants close at 11pm. You can really feel the level of atmospheric vibration drop when they shut off. It's a sigh of relief when they do. I've plead, and the local council is useless so I have put up with it. 3am is really the only time I can actually relax my ears in to a slumber because having hyper audio sensory really sucks. Peace is nice and I wish others would value it more. But with peace, folk don't know what to do. It scares them at first because it's rare to encounter in this day and age.

dnemmers 2mo ago
Even though the restaurant closes at 11, doesn't meant there isn't plenty of cleaning and 'closing' still left to do by the staff, often into the 'wee' hours.
- doublerabbit 2mo ago
  These restaurants are locked with shutters down at 11. What I presume is that the cool down is on a uncalibrated timing like unfair traffic lights but you can't really demonstrate this as they just shrug and tell you it's not their problem.
nradov 2mo ago
Other HN users keep telling us that we should support dense housing development. I think those people have never lived in an apartment complex with trashy neighbors.

deleted 2mo ago

[deleted]

domeinhornMOT 2mo ago

[flagged]