12 ms·

Why Is Europe Burning?

21 points by littlexsparkee 3mo ago

wewewedxfgdf 3mo ago
It's not climate change/global warming of course - that's a hoax, a con job and a scam - world leaders tell us so.
- clipsy 3mo ago
  That's not fair, there are also a lot of world leaders that pay lip service to concern about global warming while defending corporate interests at all costs!
- goatlover 3mo ago
  World leaders paying back fossil fuel companies who helped them get elected.
  - gregdaniels421 3mo ago
    Indeed buddy, what is the point? the GP noted the corruption, you also have issue with corruption. The current admin(in the US) thinks corruption is legal.So why split hairs?
    - goatlover 3mo ago
      Just pointing out where the root of the denialism comes from. Fossil fuel companies knew about climate change in the 1970s because their scientists told them, and they covered it up, then later began a campaign to discredit climate science as it became obvious the Earth was warming.
      - gregdaniels421 3mo ago
        Totally agree, the issue is what does anyone DO?
- ls612 3mo ago
  In this particular case it was literally arson.
  - abound 3mo ago
    Arson may be the original source, as may campfires, downed power lines, sparks from powered tools, etc, but the fact that these fires grow much larger than in the past is because of climate change. If it wasn't humans, it'd be lightning strikes and other natural phenomena.
- Robotbeat 3mo ago
  I kinda feel like this is mostly irrelevant. Europe can stop fossil fuel emissions entirely right now and it’d have very little effect. Doesn’t mean they shouldn’t decarbonize! But… Europe needs to act. Global Warming is real, it’s happening, and it going to continue happening for decades regardless. So mitigations must be done. Improve fire fighting capabilities. Prepare for changing weather patterns and sea level rise. And yes, even install air conditioning to prevent the elderly and disabled from dying very preventable deaths. Letting the misfortunate die by under-resourcing climate mitigations isn’t going to help reduce climate change by any measurable degree.
  - herbst 3mo ago
    At least in Switzerland all of that is done and discussed publicly.
    - Robotbeat 3mo ago
      Some Cantons require all sorts of hoops to jump through in order to get an air conditioner.
- jryle70 3mo ago
  Any Europe leaders saying so? If not, and Europe agree climate change is the cause of the extreme weather, what have Europe done? Why does fire seem more extreme in Europe? Maybe Europe haven't done enough?
  - expedition32 3mo ago
    Fire is not more extreme in Europe it's just that when half of Canada burns nobody notices. Europe is a very densely populated continent.
  - herbst 3mo ago
    No, Europe in general is very aware of global warming and it's an active discussion how we move on with that.
- jmpz 3mo ago
  Source?
delichon 3mo ago
Overall global fire emissions are on a downward trend. https://bsky.app/profile/mparrington.bsky.social/post/3md3w3kakek2m https://bsky.app/profile/mparrington.bsky.social/post/3md3w3...
zkmon 3mo ago
Two issues with the title. Global warming is not specific to Europe (it is "global"). And the "why" can't be meaningfully answered unless you specify how far you want to go along the cause-and-effect chain (Feynman on magnetism - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MO0r930Sn_8 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MO0r930Sn_8). Let me look at cause-and-effect chain for the past 100 years. It is the unbridled industrialisation, captial markets, business push, desire to dominate other countries, vote-bank democracies, exploitation of natural resources and so on. It is not something caused by single person or policy over past few years or decades.
- noduerme 3mo ago
  That sounds like a lot of generic, hand-wavey hot takes about why the world is a mess that are taught in higher ed. Here's a take: The world was a mess when drought led to the collapse of the Mayan empire. It was a mess when foreign invasion (now known as mass migration) caused the end of the Roman empire. You want to funnel the causes and effects into a political or economic framework that suits your ideology, but humans were great at ruining their polities and destroying their ecosystems long before industrialization or capitalism existed. What industrialization and capitalism have done is to triple the life expectancy and quarter the infant mortality rate in most countries, as well as provide things like, idk, refrigeration and rapid transportation. Doomers are getting closer and closer to outright Luddite ideas. But the practical consequences of doing away with modern capitalism or industry, the things which have led us to environmental danger, would be the mass extermination by starvation or violence of most of humanity. If that's cool with you, if that's what it takes to save us from capitalist driven climate change, then you're not really much of a humanist. We are consigned to this road. We are the residue of many empires. We produce a lot of waste and heat and carbon. We also produce life-saving medications and air conditioning and the highest standard of living of any society in history, even in the poorest places in the world. The alternative to this system would incur mass death for most of the population on the planet. And yet so many privileged people think that would be alright if it fixes their pet political issues. Think about how anti-human that actually is.
  - bluefirebrand 3mo ago
jmorenoamor 3mo ago
Climate conditions raise the probability of wild fires, dryer plants, deyer aquifers and wetlands. Abandoned rural areas mean less "organic housekeeping" of them. Pastures and forests are no longer maintained by local population. As I ser it it's a matter of higher risk plus lower boundaries for the fires when they start.
jmpz 3mo ago
http://archive.today/iH0S8 http://archive.today/iH0S8
readthenotes1 3mo ago
I read recently that something like 90% of the fires in France are man-made with 30% of them being made maliciously. After the Palisades fire in Los Angeles, maliciously man-made, it's hard to blame just global climate change...

It's not climate change/global warming of course - that's a hoax, a con job and a scam - world leaders tell us so.

clipsy 3mo ago
That's not fair, there are also a lot of world leaders that pay lip service to concern about global warming while defending corporate interests at all costs!
goatlover 3mo ago
World leaders paying back fossil fuel companies who helped them get elected.
- gregdaniels421 3mo ago
  Indeed buddy, what is the point? the GP noted the corruption, you also have issue with corruption. The current admin(in the US) thinks corruption is legal.So why split hairs?
  - goatlover 3mo ago
    Just pointing out where the root of the denialism comes from. Fossil fuel companies knew about climate change in the 1970s because their scientists told them, and they covered it up, then later began a campaign to discredit climate science as it became obvious the Earth was warming.
    - gregdaniels421 3mo ago
      Totally agree, the issue is what does anyone DO?
ls612 3mo ago
In this particular case it was literally arson.
- abound 3mo ago
  Arson may be the original source, as may campfires, downed power lines, sparks from powered tools, etc, but the fact that these fires grow much larger than in the past is because of climate change. If it wasn't humans, it'd be lightning strikes and other natural phenomena.
Robotbeat 3mo ago
I kinda feel like this is mostly irrelevant. Europe can stop fossil fuel emissions entirely right now and it’d have very little effect. Doesn’t mean they shouldn’t decarbonize! But… Europe needs to act. Global Warming is real, it’s happening, and it going to continue happening for decades regardless. So mitigations must be done. Improve fire fighting capabilities. Prepare for changing weather patterns and sea level rise. And yes, even install air conditioning to prevent the elderly and disabled from dying very preventable deaths. Letting the misfortunate die by under-resourcing climate mitigations isn’t going to help reduce climate change by any measurable degree.
- herbst 3mo ago
  At least in Switzerland all of that is done and discussed publicly.
  - Robotbeat 3mo ago
    Some Cantons require all sorts of hoops to jump through in order to get an air conditioner.
jryle70 3mo ago
Any Europe leaders saying so? If not, and Europe agree climate change is the cause of the extreme weather, what have Europe done? Why does fire seem more extreme in Europe? Maybe Europe haven't done enough?
- expedition32 3mo ago
  Fire is not more extreme in Europe it's just that when half of Canada burns nobody notices. Europe is a very densely populated continent.
- herbst 3mo ago
  No, Europe in general is very aware of global warming and it's an active discussion how we move on with that.
jmpz 3mo ago
Source?

Overall global fire emissions are on a downward trend. https://bsky.app/profile/mparrington.bsky.social/post/3md3w3kakek2m https://bsky.app/profile/mparrington.bsky.social/post/3md3w3...

zkmon 3mo ago

Two issues with the title. Global warming is not specific to Europe (it is "global"). And the "why" can't be meaningfully answered unless you specify how far you want to go along the cause-and-effect chain (Feynman on magnetism - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MO0r930Sn_8 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MO0r930Sn_8). Let me look at cause-and-effect chain for the past 100 years. It is the unbridled industrialisation, captial markets, business push, desire to dominate other countries, vote-bank democracies, exploitation of natural resources and so on. It is not something caused by single person or policy over past few years or decades.

noduerme 3mo ago
That sounds like a lot of generic, hand-wavey hot takes about why the world is a mess that are taught in higher ed. Here's a take: The world was a mess when drought led to the collapse of the Mayan empire. It was a mess when foreign invasion (now known as mass migration) caused the end of the Roman empire. You want to funnel the causes and effects into a political or economic framework that suits your ideology, but humans were great at ruining their polities and destroying their ecosystems long before industrialization or capitalism existed. What industrialization and capitalism have done is to triple the life expectancy and quarter the infant mortality rate in most countries, as well as provide things like, idk, refrigeration and rapid transportation. Doomers are getting closer and closer to outright Luddite ideas. But the practical consequences of doing away with modern capitalism or industry, the things which have led us to environmental danger, would be the mass extermination by starvation or violence of most of humanity. If that's cool with you, if that's what it takes to save us from capitalist driven climate change, then you're not really much of a humanist. We are consigned to this road. We are the residue of many empires. We produce a lot of waste and heat and carbon. We also produce life-saving medications and air conditioning and the highest standard of living of any society in history, even in the poorest places in the world. The alternative to this system would incur mass death for most of the population on the planet. And yet so many privileged people think that would be alright if it fixes their pet political issues. Think about how anti-human that actually is.
- bluefirebrand 3mo ago

jmorenoamor 3mo ago

Climate conditions raise the probability of wild fires, dryer plants, deyer aquifers and wetlands. Abandoned rural areas mean less "organic housekeeping" of them. Pastures and forests are no longer maintained by local population. As I ser it it's a matter of higher risk plus lower boundaries for the fires when they start.

jmpz 3mo ago

http://archive.today/iH0S8 http://archive.today/iH0S8

readthenotes1 3mo ago

I read recently that something like 90% of the fires in France are man-made with 30% of them being made maliciously. After the Palisades fire in Los Angeles, maliciously man-made, it's hard to blame just global climate change...