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Remember people marry later if at all so you break the cohort developments of growing up and adulting. I helped lead my local little league. It’s different tha

Remember people marry later if at all so you break the cohort developments of growing up and adulting. I helped lead my local little league. It’s different than it used to be - it’s pretty typical to have tball parents in their 40s. A group of parents from 20s to 50s aren’t going to hang out, they don’t relate. I’m a late genx, most of my friends parents were in their 30s when I was a little leaguer. The demise of old line churches is similar. We did CYO basketball in the same parish my wife did. It’s the last of what was 8-10 catholic parishes in my city. And unlike in my youth where you had good mix multigenerational parishioners… the parish survives based on the beneficence of 5-10 people in their late 60s and 70s, with few people rising to behind them. Mainline Protestant parishes are similar. The only growth in religious communities are independent Baptists, which are great but integrate into the broader community differently, because each church mostly stands alone and isn’t part of a bigger system.

frogperson 3mo ago
Church groups, or at least an awful lot of them, were co-opted by groups like the Council For National Policy (parent group of the Heritage Foundation). I think a lot of younger folks see through the BS and don't want to send their time listening to hate speech discussed as gospel. These churches chose thier path, and so did their parishioners.
- antonymoose 3mo ago
  What church(es) are you thinking of here exactly? I’ve never heard of any such group in my entire independent Southern Baptist life. On the contrary, most folks in the 20-40 range are tired of “cafeteria Christian” denominations that pick and chose which parts of scripture to stand by and which go ignore based on ever shifting social trends, whether it be so-called woke churches hosting drag performers or Boomer-tier Endtimes preachers that can’t stop talking about their all expense paid Israeli “pilgrimage.”
  - beardyw 3mo ago
    > pick and chose which parts of scripture to stand by OK. Next time you read the parable of the good Samaritan I want you to reframe it as "The Good Drag Queen". That's how you are meant to see it.
    - antonymoose 3mo ago
      I read it as a take encouraging me to render aid to anyone in a dire emergency regardless of their background.
      - dpark 3mo ago
        That’s a very narrow reading. The parable was in response to the question “who’s my neighbor” in the “love thy neighbor” statement and Jesus basically said “even those you hate”(i.e. the Samaritans).
        antonymoose 3mo ago
        I can love you and still disagree with the things you do and not endorse them. These are not in conflict.
        dpark 3mo ago
        This claim hinges on the idea that homosexuality is a thing you do and not a part of who you are. You can love someone while hating a thing they do. You cannot love someone while hating who they are. The conservative Christian notion that homosexuality is a choice to is honestly super weird to me because I certainly never chose heterosexuality. It’s one of those things that only makes sense while you’re in it and it’s constantly being beat into you, and with some distance you see that it’s ridiculous.
        antonymoose 3mo ago
        You’re free to believe whatever it is you like - that’s your belief system. I didn’t intend to start a theological debate ultimately. Only highlight as a counterpoint to the GP that going to church in the modern era really feels like you have to pick one side or another and that it’s simply an extension of politics rather than an higher-order thing.
- YinglingHeavy 3mo ago
  As a Nietzschean it is amusing, this argument that Christianity is losing favor because it is...not moral enough! Truly our institutions are post-Christianity. The herd morality has out survived Christianity itself. Nietzsche's nightmare
  - mjevans 3mo ago
    The nightmare is not outgrowing the child version of 'how to morality'. It's moving past it without reaching the enlightenment of being moral because it's the best large scale and long term strategy. Instead the grown psychopathic children all move for instant gratification and rewards in the now, damn the cost of society and civilization long term. I want to reach Orville / Star Trek, thank you!
    - inigyou 3mo ago
      When you say you want to reach Orville, are you referring to the episode where everyone wears an upvote counter badge? Because I can see that one coming true.
  - PsylentKnight 3mo ago
    It’s losing favor because it’s lacking in a lot of ways. The most exhorted virtue in the church is faith, which is just another word for irrationality. So the church often ends up in conflict with reality or even its own doctrine Its more difficult to maintain this when everyone has a device in their pocket that allows them to access information and people outside their church bubble
Timwi 3mo ago
Not sure how to feel about your implication that unmarried people are neither grown up nor adults.
- yoyohello13 3mo ago
  They are obviously Christian. Christians tend to have a dim view of anyone that doesn't marry and have children (unless they join the clergy).
  - znpy 3mo ago
    Most religions do. For example I don’t think islam has a much better view of unmarried and kidless people.
    - yoyohello13 3mo ago
      The abrahamic ones for sure.
- nradov 3mo ago
  I'm not religious but just looking around it's pretty obvious that many unmarried adults act quite immature (delayed adolescence). Which way the causality runs is harder to determine, but when you're responsible for and accountable to a spouse that forces you to grow up a bit.
  - robocat 3mo ago
    > accountable to a spouse that forces you to grow up a bit Having children forces you, and ~10% of married people don't have kids. In New Zealand, about 50% of kids are born to the unmarried. As you say, correlation and causation are hard to pick given the selection biases of who chooses to be married, and who your peer group is if you are married.
mghackerlady 3mo ago
I don't know where you are, but at least where I am (and from what I remember, it's been a while since I've felt welcome in a place of worship) the church is oftentimes the only place you can find young families. I was raised and mostly interact with Lutherans though, so maybe it's different for other denominations

frogperson 3mo ago

Church groups, or at least an awful lot of them, were co-opted by groups like the Council For National Policy (parent group of the Heritage Foundation). I think a lot of younger folks see through the BS and don't want to send their time listening to hate speech discussed as gospel. These churches chose thier path, and so did their parishioners.

antonymoose 3mo ago
What church(es) are you thinking of here exactly? I’ve never heard of any such group in my entire independent Southern Baptist life. On the contrary, most folks in the 20-40 range are tired of “cafeteria Christian” denominations that pick and chose which parts of scripture to stand by and which go ignore based on ever shifting social trends, whether it be so-called woke churches hosting drag performers or Boomer-tier Endtimes preachers that can’t stop talking about their all expense paid Israeli “pilgrimage.”
- beardyw 3mo ago
  > pick and chose which parts of scripture to stand by OK. Next time you read the parable of the good Samaritan I want you to reframe it as "The Good Drag Queen". That's how you are meant to see it.
  - antonymoose 3mo ago
    I read it as a take encouraging me to render aid to anyone in a dire emergency regardless of their background.
    - dpark 3mo ago
      That’s a very narrow reading. The parable was in response to the question “who’s my neighbor” in the “love thy neighbor” statement and Jesus basically said “even those you hate”(i.e. the Samaritans).
      - antonymoose 3mo ago
        I can love you and still disagree with the things you do and not endorse them. These are not in conflict.
        dpark 3mo ago
        This claim hinges on the idea that homosexuality is a thing you do and not a part of who you are. You can love someone while hating a thing they do. You cannot love someone while hating who they are. The conservative Christian notion that homosexuality is a choice to is honestly super weird to me because I certainly never chose heterosexuality. It’s one of those things that only makes sense while you’re in it and it’s constantly being beat into you, and with some distance you see that it’s ridiculous.
        antonymoose 3mo ago
        You’re free to believe whatever it is you like - that’s your belief system. I didn’t intend to start a theological debate ultimately. Only highlight as a counterpoint to the GP that going to church in the modern era really feels like you have to pick one side or another and that it’s simply an extension of politics rather than an higher-order thing.
YinglingHeavy 3mo ago
As a Nietzschean it is amusing, this argument that Christianity is losing favor because it is...not moral enough! Truly our institutions are post-Christianity. The herd morality has out survived Christianity itself. Nietzsche's nightmare
- mjevans 3mo ago
  The nightmare is not outgrowing the child version of 'how to morality'. It's moving past it without reaching the enlightenment of being moral because it's the best large scale and long term strategy. Instead the grown psychopathic children all move for instant gratification and rewards in the now, damn the cost of society and civilization long term. I want to reach Orville / Star Trek, thank you!
  - inigyou 3mo ago
    When you say you want to reach Orville, are you referring to the episode where everyone wears an upvote counter badge? Because I can see that one coming true.
- PsylentKnight 3mo ago
  It’s losing favor because it’s lacking in a lot of ways. The most exhorted virtue in the church is faith, which is just another word for irrationality. So the church often ends up in conflict with reality or even its own doctrine Its more difficult to maintain this when everyone has a device in their pocket that allows them to access information and people outside their church bubble

Timwi 3mo ago

Not sure how to feel about your implication that unmarried people are neither grown up nor adults.

yoyohello13 3mo ago
They are obviously Christian. Christians tend to have a dim view of anyone that doesn't marry and have children (unless they join the clergy).
- znpy 3mo ago
  Most religions do. For example I don’t think islam has a much better view of unmarried and kidless people.
  - yoyohello13 3mo ago
    The abrahamic ones for sure.
nradov 3mo ago
I'm not religious but just looking around it's pretty obvious that many unmarried adults act quite immature (delayed adolescence). Which way the causality runs is harder to determine, but when you're responsible for and accountable to a spouse that forces you to grow up a bit.
- robocat 3mo ago
  > accountable to a spouse that forces you to grow up a bit Having children forces you, and ~10% of married people don't have kids. In New Zealand, about 50% of kids are born to the unmarried. As you say, correlation and causation are hard to pick given the selection biases of who chooses to be married, and who your peer group is if you are married.

mghackerlady 3mo ago

I don't know where you are, but at least where I am (and from what I remember, it's been a while since I've felt welcome in a place of worship) the church is oftentimes the only place you can find young families. I was raised and mostly interact with Lutherans though, so maybe it's different for other denominations