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OpenAI also has this kind of check. What is especially bad is that if you fail the verification process, they won’t let you retry – you are permanently locked o
by JimDabell 4mo ago
OpenAI also has this kind of check. What is especially bad is that if you fail the verification process, they won’t let you retry – you are permanently locked out from the top models. They aren’t clear about this upfront during the process, so make sure the lighting is good when you scan your ID!
https://help.openai.com/en/articles/10910291-api-organization-verification https://help.openai.com/en/articles/10910291-api-organizatio...
- inigyou 4mo agoOr make a new account?
- tartoran 4mo agoYou risk being silenly flagged and get nerfed responses. Somehting like shadow dumbed down.
- stingraycharles 4mo agoThat’s quite a claim. What’s your source for this?
- 0123456789ABCDE 4mo agoFable's model card provides the following as a relevant reference https://xcancel.com/ClaudeDevs/status/2064949876463645026 https://xcancel.com/ClaudeDevs/status/2064949876463645026
- stingraycharles 4mo agoThat’s totally unrelated. The post I was replying to claimed that if you create a new account with OpenAI and that gets detected, your whole account gets silently “nerfed”. That is not in any way related to Fable (visibly) being switched to a less strong model if you’re trying to discuss certain topics.
- 0123456789ABCDE 4mo ago> That’s totally unrelated. i disagree, but it seems clear, from how you put it, that there's no point explaining the why
- mlyle 4mo ago> That is not in any way related to Fable (visibly) being switched to a less strong model if you’re trying to discuss certain topics. We're talking about it being invisibly moved to a weaker model if it looks like you're distilling (which is best detected through something that is at least partially a reputational / account metric). Now, Anthropic stepped away from this, but it highlights one more kind of systemic risk you're exposed to when you're not running the model yourself.
- preg_match 4mo agoIt demonstrates that: 1. Anthropic certainly has the ability. 2. They’re willing to use it silently.
- anamexis 4mo agoAnd this thread is about OpenAI.
- handoflixue 4mo agoThey already reversed course on that decision a couple of days later. Trivial to find a source, but Fable is also rather notably not available to the public right now, so it's not actually a relevant threat.
- 0123456789ABCDE 4mo agoexcuse me but, is this trivial source you're referring to the url included in the post you're responding to, or did they reverse back to the original intent of keeping refusals quiet?
- shevy-java 4mo agoSo ... like reddit! :) Thankfully I don't depend on any of such services. It would make me rather angry.
- inigyou 4mo agoHN also has shadowbans. If your preferences have showdead=yes, you might see some.
- eimrine 4mo agoThat's a decent moderation, shadowban is a totally different thing. AFAIK, your karma is enough to vouch that Flagged topics or comments and return that piece into a regular displaying.
- inigyou 4mo agoThere's no difference between shadowban and moderation, shadowban is a moderation tool.
- eimrine 4mo agoShadowban and community-driven moderation are different poles. Former is a tool of shallow narcisses, latter is the best moderation strategy possible in the clearnet. Come on, commenter.
- qingcharles 4mo agoReddit is the only platform that actually tells you that you are shadowbanned, so at least they are upfront about it, but their appeal system sucks. My friend just appealed every day for just over 600 days and finally got their account un-shadowbanned.
- inigyou 4mo agoReddit doesn't tell you you're shadowbanned. You are thinking of regular banned.
- gentooflux 4mo agoThat is an inherent and unavoidable risk regardless, as things stand if you want access to frontier models you are at the mercy of their providers.
- JimDabell 4mo agoThe whole point of an identity check is that they know exactly who you are. If you tell them who you are and you fail the identity check, you can’t simply create a new account because when you go through the identity check for a second time you’ll still need to tell them exactly who you are, at which point they can match the new account to the original failure.
- polack 4mo agoSo I’ll just automate failed verifications for everyone I want to lock out?
- handoflixue 4mo agoAn empty account and an account with a year of history have very different weights in this - most people already have an account tied to their legal name, paid for with a credit card in that same legal name. Throw in some geo-location, browser fingerprinting, etc. to disambiguate the surprisingly rare case of two customers with the exact same name. For a paid product, it's really not that hard to already have a fairly solid idea of what's going on - this just ensures that a responsible adult has gone through a clear process of signing off on the identity for this specific service, rather than a kid with their parent's credit card.
- caymanjim 4mo ago> to disambiguate the surprisingly rare case of two customers with the exact same name I see you have an uncommon name. My first+last are shared by about 20,000 people in the US. From 2005-2020 I was unable to check-in for airlines online or even at the kiosk at the airport. I had to wait on line for baggage check-in despite never checking a bag, and they'd take my ID into the back room and delay me for 15 minutes and whisper and glare at me the whole time. Thankfully I can finally fly like a normal person again. When I worked at a large company, there were four other people with the same first name, middle initial, and last name. There is nothing surprising or rare about two customers having the same name.
- trashface 4mo agoYep this is what caused me to switch to Anthropic from OpenAI a few months back, couldn't use any model newer than GPT-4 even if I paid for credits, unless I did a biometric check. I guess I'll move to perplexity or deepseek or something if anthropic flags me for the same.
- cassianoleal 4mo agoGLM-5.2 has been very good
- arikrahman 4mo agoThe cost on Deepseek is so low, it's no wonder it's the top on open router. You can even use it from other vendors like cloudflare.
- haeseong 4mo ago[dead]
- maxloh 4mo agoThat is a really terrible design. I dealt with a few instances of online ID verification recently, and in my experience, they don't close your application when your photo is not clear. They mark it as "awaiting customer response" and kindly ask you to upload again.
- nottorp 4mo agoClaude couldn't vibe code that loop.
- bathory 4mo agoAnthropic claim that if you have a verification issue, they will give you support; remains to be seen what that will actually come down to
- MarkMarine 4mo agoIf you haven’t talked to Anthropic support yet you’re in for a surprise. I’m an engineer at a company with an enterprise contract, Anthropic people in our slack and it took me a month to get a response on my support request, I just decided it wasn’t worth it and bought a second phone number rather than wait.
- weezing 4mo ago[flagged]
- SpicyLemonZest 4mo agoControl over... my government ID? I understand why someone might oppose this on systemic grounds if they don't believe that frontier models have dangerous capabilities, but I don't understand what the personal risk to me of ID verification is supposed to be. Unlike Discord, Anthropic has my credit card info, so they already know who I am.
- weezing 4mo agoIf you are comfortable with your ID scans sitting who knows where then I guess you are their target. Real fun starts when you identity gets stolen tho.
- SpicyLemonZest 4mo agoI'm not comfortable with it, but I've already had to verify my ID in the past to people I trust substantially less to handle the images securely. I can understand why someone who's never previously generated a digital photo of their ID might be more worried.
- niels8472 4mo agoFor one you have to send your info to Persona, who will no doubt at some point start abusing the info they have on you. If they don't start doing it immediately that is...
- slim 4mo agoor you can scan you retina using sam altmans device and get access immediately /s
- halJordan 4mo agoThat's almost certainly just bad engineering/bad business. Not to say it wasn't an active choice, I'm sure it was. It just shows how extreme the power imbalance is between end users and big business that they have 0 desire to do things correctly and end users have 0 impact on correcting that thinking.
- LPisGood 4mo agoOpenAI has notoriously terrible engineering. Look no further than the numerous Reddit threads and YouTube videos about people trying to give them money for their services and being denied. Users routinely have to try a number of credit cards, a number of web browsers, a number of devices, and a number of physical locations. I’m not talking about sketchy prepaid cards from weird banks on a VPN in a country the United States doesn’t do business with. I’m talking about Americans getting their Chase cards rejected on their home wifi in Ithaca. When this initially happened to me, I assumed it was a one off thing, but I was shocked to have found out that it’s been going on for at least six months, probably longer.
- coldtea 4mo ago>OpenAI has notoriously terrible engineering. Wasn't AI supposed to solve this? /s
- nekusar 4mo agoThey dogfooded. Turns out it wasn't dogfood. https://stonetoss.com/comic/recycling/ https://stonetoss.com/comic/recycling/
- fluidcruft 4mo agoAnthropic is no better if the yardstick is complaints about these topics on reddit. The main thing Anthropic seems to add above and beyond OpenAI is overbilling (that also gets the talk-to-the-hand treatment).
- gre 4mo agoI changed my macos system password and haven't been able to log into the macos chatgpt app since. It cant save the auth to wherever it tries. So bad.
- AnonEM00se 4mo agoI got an email from OpenAI letting me know I won’t be a teenager anymore next week. It’s so exciting to have AI roll back my age by more than half! I then looked at their age verification and it used that problematic company so I cancelled out.
- chasil 4mo agoAnthropic does not allow... "Digital or mobile IDs." Why on earth not?
- fpoling 4mo agoMany such IDs are designed for local physical verification, like proof that the mobile phone owner is above certain age or has a valid driving license, they are not designed for remote verification.
- objclxt 4mo ago> Many such IDs are designed for local physical verification, like proof that the mobile phone owner is above certain age or has a valid driving license, they are not designed for remote verification. This is incorrect, the Digital Credentials API[1] is designed so that identity information can be remotely verified in a cryptographically secure manner. There is no reason Anthropic could not use the DC API for this in countries and states that support digital identity, I assume they simply aren't because they threw this together at the last minute and simply out-sourced it to Persona. [1]: https://www.w3.org/TR/digital-credentials/ https://www.w3.org/TR/digital-credentials/
- selcuka 4mo ago> they threw this together at the last minute and simply out-sourced it to Persona. They could have vibe-coded their own verification system that uses DC APIs. It shouldn't take long, assuming that Anthropic still has access to Fable. /s
- DocTomoe 4mo agoAs a relatively enthusiastic OpenAI user ... what did you do to trigger a verification process?
- miki123211 4mo agoThey require verification to access the more capable models through their API. It's not required for "consumer" usage, which also includes things like the Codex CLI authenticated via oAuth.
- ai_fry_ur_brain 4mo agoYes it is, they will trigger it over security related questions.
- RobMurray 4mo agoIt can trigger it's self, when it decides it needs to try lots of different options to get clicks into an installer running as admin. There's basically nothing you can do to prevent it.
- stressback 4mo agoIt's frustrating that I can't find docs that even pretend to answer this question. Maybe it's my fault, maybe I overlooked it? I hope so. To me, without documented use cases where you might/likely/certainly trigger identity verification, how can I properly limit my curiosity as someone who will gladly stay on the safe side for SOTA cloud model use? I'll happily stay away from these topics if I'm informed on what they are, even if the docs are vague. Does anyone have insight into the answer to this? What API calls? What user behavior? What topics should I let go unanswered (or converse about with local LLMs) if I want to avoid losing access to the tooling? The thought that they don't/won't publish this document should scare everyone. That leads to "because I said so" service refusal that is a very slippery slope. I do understand that all businesses are allowed to refuse service to me in the USA, from food trucks to AWS, and that's fine with me. But at least tell me your rules and extra verification trigger criteria so I have a chance of not using your service in a way that concerns you.
- miki123211 4mo agoThankfully, OpenAI's check is not required if you use their models through OpenRouter! This didn't use to be the case (OpenRouter's OpenAI access used to be bring-your-own-key), but they've reached some sort of deal with them a couple months ago, and now you can access all the GPT-5 series models on OR with no verification at all.
- ai_fry_ur_brain 4mo agoWhy did you provide an ID to use an LLM... You're a mark
- pbgcp2026 4mo agoThis is downvoted unfairly - "this guys fucks" :-) Indeed you attracted attention.
- deleted 4mo ago[deleted]
- dotancohen 4mo agoFrom that page: > At this time, retries are not supported. You can continue using OpenAI’s platform with your existing access. That's ridiculous, especially as their list of reasons that verifications can fail include "There was a technical issue during submission".
- varispeed 4mo agoLooks like they don't want unlucky people on their platform.
- RobMurray 4mo agoI didn't know this. Looks like I dodged a bullet - being totally blind meant the chance of issues was high but luckily it worked. It triggered the id check while trying to get computer use to work for an installer running as admin on windows. Actual reverse engineering I got it to do in the past didn't trigger it.
- egorfine 4mo ago> they won’t let you retry Why would they care about _you_ when they have just a bit short of a billion users and they are up for a huge IPO? Of course they won't even bother implementing a retry.
- BeetleB 4mo ago> OpenAI also has this kind of check. Indeed, that's what motivated me to get an OpenRouter account!