5 ms·
Some context for people who haven’t followed the full loop: Shazeer was a long-time Google researcher, joined Google in 2000, and was one of the co-authors of “
by gzer0 4mo ago
Some context for people who haven’t followed the full loop: Shazeer was a long-time Google researcher, joined Google in 2000, and was one of the co-authors of “Attention Is All You Need.”
He left Google in 2021 to co-found Character.AI. In 2024, Google brought him and some Character.AI researchers back via a licensing/talent deal with Character.AI (reportedly around $2.7B). He was then made a Gemini co-lead.
Now he’s leaving Google again for OpenAI.
Exciting times!
- ddmma 4mo agoHopefully will get to the conclusion that "Hopfield Networks is All You Need"
- tomalbrc 4mo ago[flagged]
- rvnx 4mo ago[flagged]
- diegolas 4mo agotalent poaching is something pretty common in tech, google knows something like this can and will happen, so does openAI also "empty handed" is just unnecesarily dramatic, he left all the knwoledge base he helped build, that's google's IP and is worth m(b?)illions
- DroneBetter 4mo agoI think it becomes somewhat more defensible when considering that the alternative was operatiny Google's policy (before the advent of competition) of "these models would bring unknown dangers in the hands of the public, we shouldn't release them until we better understand the implications" (or perhaps more selfishly "these effectively nullify all our detectors of generated text, if released they would instantly lose us the war on SEO"). (recall that OpenAI thought GPT-2 was too powerful to release for approximately tantamount reasons)
- artninja1988 4mo agoCompanies are not your friend who you need to be loyal to. There's a reason noncompetes are illegal in California.
- rvnx 4mo agoThink of it like if this: Novo Nordisk hired you to find a cure for obesity. - This is your full time job, and this is what you are paid for. The company also invests in a lab, in machines, in other employees, etc, so all of you together can figure out. You find Wegovy, and poof, you run away with the recipe and sell the product on your own. - Yes, you just scammed your boss, you made him believe that you were working for him, but actually you were using the company resources to your sole benefit. It's not about loyalty, it's about integrity. It's the same type of people whom you hire and pay to develop a platform, and then they steal the code, and never deliver this platform to you. Terrible business practices, but isn't it how Facebook happened too ?
- QuesnayJr 4mo agoThis is not at all what happened. They did deliver, in the form of the "Attention Is All You Need" paper, which Google made public. They took nothing from Google that wasn't already public. Unless you think that employees are like indentured servants, and Novo Nordisk owns not only Wegovy but the people who work on it.
- fragmede 4mo agoThe original traitorous eight who left Shockley to found Fairchild semiconductor are what literally gave Silicon Valley its name. You want to keep valuable employees, you got to treat them really well. Given the number of tech giants coming out of silicon valley, there's something to that being a cornerstone of its culture. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Traitorous_eight https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Traitorous_eight
- cma 4mo agoYou do realize Google received a patent on the transformer right?
- 4mo ago
- john_strinlai 4mo agoi dont keep up on this stuff so maybe i am missing some context. should he have been obligated to stay at google for the rest of his career?
- HarHarVeryFunny 4mo agoGoogle essentially (but not exactly) aqui-hired Shazeer from character.ai in a deal that cost them $2.7B, with Shazeer personally making something in the region of $1B from it. Presumably there was some sort of retention period specified in the contract (you are not going to pay $2.7B to hire someone, then let them leave with no penalty the next day), but in the event Shazeer only stayed for 22 months before now leaving. Maybe he paid some penalty for leaving, but if so presumably more than compensated for by OpenAI.
- Jtarii 4mo agoOh no, he wasn't loyal to the soulless trillion dollar mega corp :( what a terrible person
- georgemcbay 4mo ago> Well in terms of employers loyalty I have no dog in this race as I'm not fond of either OpenAI or Google.... but employees not being loyal to their big tech employers is a wild thing to be concerned about in 2026 when year after year many large tech companies (Google very prominently among them) continually post record profits and still lay people off by the thousands.
- raincole 4mo agoWhat a crazy take lol. Even by HN's standard this is crazy. First of all the idea that an employee should be loyal is bad enough. And the following statements are only getting worse. Leaving Google empty-handed? How do you think corporations work? Google chose to publish their research results, not him.
- btian 4mo agoWhat are you talking about? The Attention is all you need paper has Google logo, not character.ai
- sandeepkd 4mo agoNot sure what kind of take is that in the light of so many layoffs done by companies despite making profits. It was at-will employment, its over and people moved on. If there is/was any wrong doing then the companies have enough resources to pursue individuals.
- sieabahlpark 4mo ago[dead]
- ur-whale 4mo ago> Sounds like yet another Scam Altman, perfect match indeed. Not really. Altman couldn't code his way out of a wet paper bag. Noam is OTOH and IIUC the real deal.
- Natfan 4mo agothis character.ai? https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/ce3xgwyywe4o https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/ce3xgwyywe4o
- applfanboysbgon 4mo ago[flagged]
- freejazz 4mo agoWhy shouldn't the court entertain it? If Character is innocent, shouldn't they have the opportunity to have the accusations disproven?
- applfanboysbgon 4mo agoThe case is so blatantly frivolous it should have been thrown out. Nobody should have to spend legal fees defending claims that they're responsible for somebody killing themselves over saying "come home to me".
- swader999 4mo agoWon't they get those fees back if dismissed or if the plaintiff doesn't prevail?
- applfanboysbgon 4mo agoMy understanding is that this is generally not the case in the US.
- swader999 4mo agoThat would explain much. I'm not a USA citizen.
- freejazz 4mo ago
- shimman 4mo ago[flagged]
- zeusk 4mo agowhat's the context behind this?
- fartcoin67 4mo ago[flagged]
- SiempreViernes 4mo agohttps://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/ce3xgwyywe4o https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/ce3xgwyywe4o
- dilyevsky 4mo agoThe context is AI made some knowledge work less cushy so now some folks are trying to point out random imaginary flaws (e.g TP or "water usage") when they're not busy trying to convince everyone AI doesn't work.
- shimman 4mo ago[flagged]
- CamperBob2 4mo agoAnd when you file the edges off of every tool in your house, what will you do when you need to cut your steak^H^H^H^H^H celery sticks?
- shimman 4mo ago[flagged]
- bethekidyouwant 4mo ago
- paulmist 4mo agoI first saw Noam on Dwarkesh’s podcast together with Jeff Dean. Recommend if you want a taste of what’s Google’s folks take on things. https://youtu.be/v0gjI__RyCY?is=nz77XP4KiJy7L1AX https://youtu.be/v0gjI__RyCY?is=nz77XP4KiJy7L1AX
- cubefox 4mo ago> Exciting times! What is exiting about this?
- dude250711 4mo agoMaybe he figured out a good way to short AI companies?
- kkotak 4mo agoRight?! Unless you think this move is going to generate general excitement in our lives, it's just another rich guy moving from one high paying job to another.
- rhipitr 4mo agoAt this point is it even pay that’s tempting or is it more about what they get to do? I would assume Google could easily pay them what openAI can, unless as an older company it’s harder for Google to match something really out there
- p1necone 4mo agoYeah my current feeling is that once I had double digit millions earning further money would be pretty meaningless to me, and the difference between 'large salary' and 'even larger salary' would be even more meaningless, but who knows maybe it really would change me. I kind of assume people like this are primarily chasing the most interesting/impactful work though.
- nrds 4mo agoThe problem with this belief is that it implies that all of bigtech is massively overpaying for top talent who would happily stay on for pennies. While bigtech overpaying talent is more plausible than any other bigcorp doing so, it's still rather unlikely.
- chaos_emergent 4mo agoI think money’s marginal utility just changes from a vehicle for material comfort to a way to keep score.
- gwern 4mo agoOnly if there was a cartel which would agree to never outbid each other, of course... You can ask Steve Jobs about that one.
- zaat 4mo agoIt gets to the point where what you do is the main question while payment is barely a minor concern way earlier than that point, at least in my experience. You don't need to be in the top AI research tier for that.
- dudus 4mo agoHow can an acquired dude leave after less than 2 years?
- mikeyouse 4mo agoOpenAI pays for the earn out he would’ve otherwise received at Google + a new comp package. Made up numbers, if Google still owed him $10M for lasting the full two years, OpenAI can just pay him market rate +$10M.
- deadbabe 4mo agoYes, but what about the audacity of it? Get paid a lot to join a company but then decide to get up and leave again 2 years later? He just wants to be passed around?
- mikeyouse 4mo agoYou can have character and be loyal to Google (lol) or make $xx million… I’m not surprised when people choose the latter.
- quantumink 4mo agoI would argue its not the millions though, but rather that sweet rare compute - OpenAI has more of it for his interests than anyone - it is understandable why an exceptional mind would prioritize access to greater capabilities above all else
- drevil-v2 4mo agoOh my goodness think of the poor multi-trillion dollar company!! No honour among thieves these days...
- mlmonkey 4mo agoThere's a possibility that he lost out in internal political battles, and things weren't going his way. Google is full of battle-hardened political warriors who will do anything (subterfuge, sabotage, etc.) to win battles. It is possible that a guy who just wants to build cool shit would feel like a misfit in such an environment.
- nl 4mo agoFor context, the reason he left Google the first time was because Google wouldn't ship the chatbot-type products that he saw were possible. Google bought him back (with lots of money) and made him one of the leads of Gemini.