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I really hope we stop using the term "Chinese models". It has this air of Negative connotation. It's the equivalent of calling cars Japanese, which people used
by dcreater 4mo ago
I really hope we stop using the term "Chinese models". It has this air of Negative connotation. It's the equivalent of calling cars Japanese, which people used to do but now is almost entirely meaningless. You just call them Toyota, Honda, Lexus etc.
- jdw64 4mo agoYou are right. I agree.It may seem like a kind of bias, but I hadn't thought of that part. Thank you for pointing out my bias.
- theanonymousone 4mo ago"You're absolutely right"?
- jdw64 4mo ago"You hit the nail on the head" LOL
- esafak 4mo agoI don't think "Chinese" is pejorative in this context any more than "American" is. They are one of the two ecosystems. What's wrong with saying "Japanese cars" today?
- dcreater 4mo agoSadly there is a pejorative context. The constant us, the free world vs China, the evil Soviets rhetoric from every major news establishment and executive creates that negative view
- fuck_google 4mo agoOn the other hand the Trump administration has successfully managed to make Chinese seem better than American, so there might not be that much of a pejorative context any more..
- antonvs 4mo agoYou're right, but the bias in the US certainly persists. "China = bad" is an assumption that many people still make without any self-reflection about the ways in which the US is now at least as bad.
- kennywinker 4mo ago> What's wrong with saying "Japanese cars" today? Only that it’s a fairly meaningless grouping. When japan first entered the car market in north america there might have been some commonality, but now what characteristics do they share that some american cars don’t have? They’re not even imported a lot of the time. Given that, it does start to feel tinged with racism if someone insists on grouping things together that don’t really belong together. As for Chinese LLMs, the term doesn’t “feel” pejorative to me - but i also don’t see a totally clear set of attributes they share. Not all are open-weight. Some are small and can be run on consumer hardware, some are huge. They even have a variety of answers to what happened june 3rd 1989
- Brendinooo 4mo ago> now what characteristics do they share that some american cars don’t have? Typically the answer is "reliability", which is a positive trait, which makes the original callout about negative connotations very odd to me.
- overfeed 4mo agoChinese AI models also share a positive trait: they offer more bang for the buck.
- antonvs 4mo ago> but now what characteristics do they share that some american cars don’t have? Better overall design?
- kube-system 4mo ago> When japan first entered the car market in north america there might have been some commonality, but now what characteristics do they share that some american cars don’t have? They're unique in that they even make a regular passenger car. American manufacturers only make SUVs and a couple of sports/luxury cars. They basically gave up because the Camry/Corolla/Accord/Civic ate their lunch. The cheapest sedan you can get from an American brand is the Cadillac CT4.
- 3mo ago
- WarmWash 4mo ago[flagged]
- well_ackshually 4mo agoyes, yes, the spectre of communism, BYD is the CCP, Alibaba is the CCP, stealing your children and eating them for Mao, bla bla bla. I have a feeling you'd be slightly salty at people saying "Google and Tesla are making CIA models"
- Terretta 4mo agoI mean... Since its development, IQT has invested in over 750 startups spanning diverse technological sectors, including: - Artificial Intelligence - Space Technologies - Microelectronics and Quantum Computing - Life Sciences - Cybersecurity - Hardware - Energy This broad portfolio has enabled IQT to address a wide array of national security challenges while supporting the growth of innovative startups… https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/In-Q-Tel https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/In-Q-Tel https://www.npr.org/sections/alltechconsidered/2012/07/16/156839153/in-q-tel-the-cias-tax-funded-player-in-silicon-valley https://www.npr.org/sections/alltechconsidered/2012/07/16/15... https://www.cgai.ca/th_bn_iqt https://www.cgai.ca/th_bn_iqt
- well_ackshually 4mo agoI know, but it's far too fun to bait the parent into revealing how ignorant they are.
- WarmWash 4mo agoGoogle and Tesla making products to sell to the government is different than the government funding the government to make products for the government. In China it's all one entity with these mock facades of privatization. Trump cannot instruct Google to put picture of dogs on their homepage. If Xi wakes up and wants dogs on Alibaba's homepage, give it 30 minutes. It's wholly ignorant or dishonest to make the comparison.
- greenavocado 4mo ago[flagged]
- unethical_ban 4mo agoNo thanks. The term seems to have the connotation of "competitive at 1/10 the price of Claude", so I don't see the problem. It's not Harbor Freight Chinese (and heck even they have decent stuff sometimes now too). You don't think people still talk about Japanese cars as a distinction in quality from US or European ones?
- sroerick 4mo agoI don't know, I tried using one of the Chinese models and it was VERY quick to scan my entire home dir, so maybe your threat surface is a little different than mine
- fooker 4mo agoModels can't scan anything. They return instructions for you to do something, and you or a script you permit chooses to execute what the model tells you and return the result to the model.
- deleted 4mo ago[deleted]
- odiroot 4mo agoJapanese cars is actually a positive qualifier. I'd say anything Japanese motor-powered.
- ffsm8 4mo agoMaybe he's just from an alternative universe. Chinese model isn't negative either after all.
- hootz 4mo agoFor me, it has a positive connotation! In my experience, Chinese Model means cheaper, but still quite effective model you can use for millions of tokens without burning your entire wallet in seconds. That's why I get more excited over a Chinese model release over American models.