5 ms·

I think a core problem is "HR" departments with absolutely no understanding of the positions they are supposed to be hiring for, even for technology companies w

by enko 14y ago

I think a core problem is "HR" departments with absolutely no understanding of the positions they are supposed to be hiring for, even for technology companies where technology is supposed to be a core competency. The only thing stopping me from calling out HR departments in general as a sign of organisational cancer, since I am yet to encounter one that pulls even a tenth of its weight, is that they tend to be comprised of the only cute girls in the whole company. Even on Friday (2 days ago) I was out drinking with a bunch of tech guys and a single cute HR girl. That is pretty much the sole reason I would oppose eliminating HR as we know it from all technology companies.

eshvk 14y ago
Nice, very classy of you. Tell me again, how does it feel to time travel here from the fifties?
- enko 14y ago
  Why, did they tell the truth in the fifties or something? I assume "classy" is your stand-in word for politically correct. I can see that no-one likes what I said but I assure you it's my honest feeling. HR departments' best contribution to an organisation is cute HR girls. You can deny this truth, or perhaps try to change the way of things. Clicking to downvote me, of course, changes absolutely nothing.
- pinaceae 14y ago
  well, it is a correct observation that HR (and marketing) departments have the highest female ratio in pretty much any company. let's look at famous examples: Carly Fiorina? Marketing. Brigitte Ederer (Siemens)? HR. Meg Whitman? Marketing (started as a Brand Manager) the cute moniker is unnecessary, I agree. the overall observation is correct. i agree in particular with the fact that once HR takes over hiring from the team-leaders, the company has jumped the shark. one of the core tasks for a manager is hiring, ensuring his/her team is correctly staffed and has enough fresh blood to ensure senior people can move upward or away without disruption. if you don't, the Peter principle is in play. overzelous HR is the ruin of a company because by definition HR has no clue about the core competencies of a company, no feeling for its customers nor products/services.
  - eshvk 14y ago
    You are missing the point and flailing at straw men. I don't care about the female ratio (Neither I think does any one who downvoted the OP). I am not going to discuss the utility of the HR department, the issue here is that they are human beings whom no one has the right to reduce as being mere eye-candy (which is particularly freaking sexist).
    - enko 14y ago
      > I am not going to discuss the utility of the HR department, the issue here is that they are human beings whom no one has the right to reduce as being mere eye-candy this attitude, to me, is unbelievable. Of course they are human beings. What else would they be? If you're going to make a claim about HR, make it on its merits. I have said they're nothing but a bunch of good looking girls. They have zero understanding about any of the roles they're hiring for, and no incentive to learn. Care to contradict me?
      - wazoox 14y ago
        I've been interviewed at a few large tech companies in the past 15 years, and the HR guys were... well, guys. And not remarkably good looking. I'm afraid that your opinion is just that, your opinion. And it's a sexist one with that.
        enko 14y ago
        > your opinion is just that, your opinion And I never claimed otherwise. But I really resent your accusation of sexism, since I believe I am extremely fair to both sexes. It is a plain fact that the attitude towards HR departments here is mostly negative. It is another plain fact that those departments are mostly female. If these facts are sexist, then reality is sexist. Oh, and the all-male "IT department" is also richly deserving of criticism, though not by me since I jumped that ship long ago. I look forward to your devout claims of sexism when such a criticism does occur, however. It boils down to this: if you put the wrong people in charge of very important stuff, then (long term) you are fucked.
- deleted 14y ago
  [deleted]
- skrebbel 14y ago
  Time travel from the fifties, learn computers, and make an HN account. That's pretty damn cool if you ask me.
- sunstone 14y ago
  When I took an MBA from a world top 15 school several years ago they directly advised companies to abolish the HR department. (Yes I know I'm hell banned.)
ucee054 14y ago
they tend to be comprised of the only cute girls in the whole company Why's that a reason not to fire the lot of them? You have a harridan making your life miserable with stupid policies but she looks cute? You call that a good trade? You know companies could employ competent ladies in place of those cute ladies. Like a lady I knew who could write a whole network stack in assembler.
- cousin_it 14y ago
  Would a good programmer (female or otherwise) want to work in HR instead of programming?
  - ucee054 14y ago
    I was implying hiring them as programmers and shrinking the HR dept.
- EliRivers 14y ago
  "You have a harridan making your life miserable with stupid policies but she looks cute? You call that a good trade?" It's the basis of my marriage. :)
kabdib 14y ago
++ on "HR doesn't understand the tech" I had a phone interview once where the person on the other side was (the hiring side) was trying to suss out my skills. "Do you know real-time object-oriented programming?" they asked. "Well, I know object-oriented programming, and I've done a lot of real time stuff, so: Sure." "No, I think you're trying to fool me. Please answer truthfully, do you know _real-time object-oriented programming_?" "Yes." "I don't believe you." Things went downhill from there. The interviewer clearly had no idea what they were actually asking, and it was impossible to express any competence other than to repeat buzzwords. Bottom-line is: That company missed out on a great employee. They utterly blew it. [Yeah, I know you only have my word for this. Suffice to say that I have enough objective evidence from subsequent projects and employment that I know I'm not Dunning-Krugering myself.]
- jimbokun 14y ago
  I had a phone interview once where the person on the other side was (the hiring side) was trying to suss out my skills. "Do you know real-time object-oriented programming?" they asked. I would be so tempted to reply "Do you?"

by enko 14y ago

eshvk 14y ago

Nice, very classy of you. Tell me again, how does it feel to time travel here from the fifties?

enko 14y ago
Why, did they tell the truth in the fifties or something? I assume "classy" is your stand-in word for politically correct. I can see that no-one likes what I said but I assure you it's my honest feeling. HR departments' best contribution to an organisation is cute HR girls. You can deny this truth, or perhaps try to change the way of things. Clicking to downvote me, of course, changes absolutely nothing.
pinaceae 14y ago
well, it is a correct observation that HR (and marketing) departments have the highest female ratio in pretty much any company. let's look at famous examples: Carly Fiorina? Marketing. Brigitte Ederer (Siemens)? HR. Meg Whitman? Marketing (started as a Brand Manager) the cute moniker is unnecessary, I agree. the overall observation is correct. i agree in particular with the fact that once HR takes over hiring from the team-leaders, the company has jumped the shark. one of the core tasks for a manager is hiring, ensuring his/her team is correctly staffed and has enough fresh blood to ensure senior people can move upward or away without disruption. if you don't, the Peter principle is in play. overzelous HR is the ruin of a company because by definition HR has no clue about the core competencies of a company, no feeling for its customers nor products/services.
- eshvk 14y ago
  You are missing the point and flailing at straw men. I don't care about the female ratio (Neither I think does any one who downvoted the OP). I am not going to discuss the utility of the HR department, the issue here is that they are human beings whom no one has the right to reduce as being mere eye-candy (which is particularly freaking sexist).
  - enko 14y ago
    > I am not going to discuss the utility of the HR department, the issue here is that they are human beings whom no one has the right to reduce as being mere eye-candy this attitude, to me, is unbelievable. Of course they are human beings. What else would they be? If you're going to make a claim about HR, make it on its merits. I have said they're nothing but a bunch of good looking girls. They have zero understanding about any of the roles they're hiring for, and no incentive to learn. Care to contradict me?
    - wazoox 14y ago
      I've been interviewed at a few large tech companies in the past 15 years, and the HR guys were... well, guys. And not remarkably good looking. I'm afraid that your opinion is just that, your opinion. And it's a sexist one with that.
      - enko 14y ago
        > your opinion is just that, your opinion And I never claimed otherwise. But I really resent your accusation of sexism, since I believe I am extremely fair to both sexes. It is a plain fact that the attitude towards HR departments here is mostly negative. It is another plain fact that those departments are mostly female. If these facts are sexist, then reality is sexist. Oh, and the all-male "IT department" is also richly deserving of criticism, though not by me since I jumped that ship long ago. I look forward to your devout claims of sexism when such a criticism does occur, however. It boils down to this: if you put the wrong people in charge of very important stuff, then (long term) you are fucked.
deleted 14y ago
[deleted]
skrebbel 14y ago
Time travel from the fifties, learn computers, and make an HN account. That's pretty damn cool if you ask me.
sunstone 14y ago
When I took an MBA from a world top 15 school several years ago they directly advised companies to abolish the HR department. (Yes I know I'm hell banned.)

ucee054 14y ago

they tend to be comprised of the only cute girls in the whole company Why's that a reason not to fire the lot of them? You have a harridan making your life miserable with stupid policies but she looks cute? You call that a good trade? You know companies could employ competent ladies in place of those cute ladies. Like a lady I knew who could write a whole network stack in assembler.

cousin_it 14y ago
Would a good programmer (female or otherwise) want to work in HR instead of programming?
- ucee054 14y ago
  I was implying hiring them as programmers and shrinking the HR dept.
EliRivers 14y ago
"You have a harridan making your life miserable with stupid policies but she looks cute? You call that a good trade?" It's the basis of my marriage. :)

kabdib 14y ago

++ on "HR doesn't understand the tech" I had a phone interview once where the person on the other side was (the hiring side) was trying to suss out my skills. "Do you know real-time object-oriented programming?" they asked. "Well, I know object-oriented programming, and I've done a lot of real time stuff, so: Sure." "No, I think you're trying to fool me. Please answer truthfully, do you know _real-time object-oriented programming_?" "Yes." "I don't believe you." Things went downhill from there. The interviewer clearly had no idea what they were actually asking, and it was impossible to express any competence other than to repeat buzzwords. Bottom-line is: That company missed out on a great employee. They utterly blew it. [Yeah, I know you only have my word for this. Suffice to say that I have enough objective evidence from subsequent projects and employment that I know I'm not Dunning-Krugering myself.]

jimbokun 14y ago
I had a phone interview once where the person on the other side was (the hiring side) was trying to suss out my skills. "Do you know real-time object-oriented programming?" they asked. I would be so tempted to reply "Do you?"