7 ms·

Treasures found on HS2 route

119 points by breve 9mo ago

hardlianotion 9mo ago
What is the HS2 route these days? Difficult for a casual to keep track?
- quink 9mo ago
  Get any satellite imagery of the UK, like on Google Earth. Even at a very zoomed out level, with London and Birmingham but an inch apart, you'll instantly spot the bit of HS2 they're building.
  - Normal_gaussian 9mo ago
    To this point; if you look at google maps satellite view and zoom in/out repeatedly over the UK the yellow line 'road' that doesn't disappear and reload is the construction site of HS2. If you want confirmation, the easiest bits to "check" are Aylesbury and Coventry. London and Birmingham are too big for the features to stand out. Here is the official HS2 map: https://www.hs2.org.uk/map/?mapView=9_52.0744_-1.8347 https://www.hs2.org.uk/map/?mapView=9_52.0744_-1.8347
    - tonyedgecombe 9mo ago
      Wow, it really is easy to find. It reminds you of the scale of this project.
      - kruador 9mo ago
        To be clear, it is currently really easy to find because major earthworks are being done, and that requires space to move in the equipment to do it, along with new roads to get to points that were previously inaccessible, being the middle of nowhere. To see what it will look like afterwards, try to find High Speed 1, aka the Channel Tunnel Rail Link, now that it's had nearly 20 years to be landscaped and vegetation to grow back. If you don't know what you're looking for, you won't see it.
crossroadsguy 9mo ago
> a hand axe that may be more than 40,000 years old As opposed to a foot axe I assume > and 19th Century gold dentures Ah, them classy 19th Centurians!
- Podrod 9mo ago
  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hand_axe https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hand_axe
  - hinkley 9mo ago
    Those have always looked so unwieldy to me. What an excellent way to lose a limb.
- jetrink 9mo ago
  FTA > Hand axes were held in the palm rather than attached to a wooden handle.
- Normal_gaussian 9mo ago
  In modern times a hand axe is opposed to full axes, hatchets, felling axes, wood splitting axes etc. Depending on where you are in the world you will have different axe categories, but a 'hand axe' is typically present as an axe wielded in a single hand. However, some significant distinction should be made for what is actually meant here. For such historic finds "hand axe" often means a stone tool with two faces and shaped like a tear drop / round-bottomed triangle. With the 'bottom' face shaped to a crude blade, and the 'top' 'sides' made into a grip. Note there is no shaft, and the way it is used is speculative and likely very varied, as few other tools existed. The proto-axe if you will.
- foldr 9mo ago
  It’s a hand axe, Mark, not a felling axe.
- MisterTea 9mo ago
  I'm sorry your attempt at humor was completely missed by several pedants.
troad 9mo ago
Contrapoint to the naysayers: building infrastructure is good actually, and in this specific case, has had the added side benefit of unearthing these cool artifacts that would otherwise still be decaying in some peat bog. British NIMBYs seem unusually strong, even in a world of NIMBYism. Best wishes to the British in defeating the Midsomer Historical Society of Bat-Loving Cranks, which apparently controls the deep state over there.
- ggm 9mo ago
  Sir, this is wimpy's - the confusion of naming cheap housing construction firm, the same as a very old burger chain in the UK which predates Wendy's or McDonald's in the UK by many decades being most apposite.
- techterrier 9mo ago
  On behalf of the Midsomer Historical Society of Bat-Loving Cranks, i'd like to extend a cordial invitation to our Wickerman Festival this year. Perhaps on perusing our good works, you might be persuaded of their merits. Kind regards, Nigel.
- globular-toast 9mo ago
  UK is so densely populated that something like this affects a LOT of people. Also people's "back yards" are tiny enough as it is. Small changes have a big impact and people living in such cramped spaces are living in constant fear of that. If you happen to come across any part of HS2 in some random village you've never heard of it's quite incredible the impact it's having on the locals. Locals who live miles away from the nearest station and therefore unable to use the line, by the way. We also have very little wildlife left and we don't really want to live in concrete jungles. Suffice to say, it's not difficult to see why it's like this in the UK if you actually come and see.
  - energy123 9mo ago
    The taller the concrete jungle, the more spare land there is for people like you outside of it.
barkingcat 9mo ago
the indiana jones warehouse.
- ggm 9mo ago
  Arguably the science museum London already had one. They lost a bit of donated science bits over many years due to lack of maintenance and records management.
- 6stringmerc 9mo ago
  TOP men…
zhivota 9mo ago
This should be the gameplay in Civilization, instead of the thing where you train and archaeologist who goes to excavate magically known locations. Excavation of tunnels and such should just come with a chance of finding artifacts, but it only materializes with the right culture tech unlocked (before some point, buried treasures were just scrapped or sold, not put into museums).
- SenHeng 9mo ago
  My little village is built on the site of some ancient Japanese village [0] and any construction that involves digging up dirt often also unearths some kind of archaeological find that stops all work for half a year while the archaeologists do their stuff, if they can even be bothered to come. It’s happened often enough that it’s a wink and a nod that nothing was found. Foremen and anyone ‘in-charge’ will not be on site until any kind of digging is complete. [0]: https://kanko-omachi.gr.jp/spot/wappara/ https://kanko-omachi.gr.jp/spot/wappara/
6stringmerc 9mo ago
I want to print this article and take it with me when asking permission to use my pro-grade Garrett metal detector on unused, abandoned but owned / to be redeveloped property. I’m old enough and studied enough to know where I live people in the Great Depression stashed loot in jars and buried it. Who knows what all could be in the occasional backyard recovery. History tells lots of things, not many listen. Utility can be limited in scope.
sarreph 9mo ago
I recall comments about this last week on the BBC website where people made the points that: 1. Surely the long term plan is to not keep these relics in a gargantuan warehouse but instead to put them in a museum(s) — with free entry no less — so that the tax paying public can enjoy them. 2. Further, collections of relics that relate to the site of each station on the line could be displayed in each.
- pjc50 9mo ago
  > museum(s) — with free entry no less The tax paying public aren't going to pay for that. The existing collections can just about barely justify free entry. Most museums have a vast secondary collection that's not on display already. These items are going in a warehouse because there isn't enough money to do archaeology on them any time soon, let alone prep them for display.
  - Angostura 9mo ago
    Or do what the V&A has done in Docklands - make its warehouse available for the public to visit. Pretty cool day out. https://www.vam.ac.uk/east/storehouse/visit https://www.vam.ac.uk/east/storehouse/visit
    - OJFord 9mo ago
      Second that, it's really good. You can only really see a small fraction of it still, just because of the nature of it (it's like a central viewing space completely surrounded by warehouse shelving) but really interesting, from the meta perspective of seeing how they store and tend to pieces too. For example, there's a bunch of swords 'on display' (such as it is) and then you can sort of just about see an entire sword storage/curation room off to one side, with many times more than are actually visible in some detail.
    - notahacker 9mo ago
      Science Museum opens its warehouse in Swindon to the public too Highly recommended for people with an interest in vehicles, but there's a lot of other stuff from twentieth century consumer goods to the contents of Stephen Hawkings office on shelves there and document archives too.
8bitsrule 9mo ago
Yet another demonstration of the fact that much of archeology is a result of adding a scientific veneer to simple treasure-hunting. 'Artifacts', 'culture' and 'history' notwithstanding. Once 'discovered' and shaken down, many 'sites' have been roughly 'repaired' for the benefit of tourists.

119 points by breve 9mo ago

hardlianotion 9mo ago

What is the HS2 route these days? Difficult for a casual to keep track?

quink 9mo ago
Get any satellite imagery of the UK, like on Google Earth. Even at a very zoomed out level, with London and Birmingham but an inch apart, you'll instantly spot the bit of HS2 they're building.
- Normal_gaussian 9mo ago
  To this point; if you look at google maps satellite view and zoom in/out repeatedly over the UK the yellow line 'road' that doesn't disappear and reload is the construction site of HS2. If you want confirmation, the easiest bits to "check" are Aylesbury and Coventry. London and Birmingham are too big for the features to stand out. Here is the official HS2 map: https://www.hs2.org.uk/map/?mapView=9_52.0744_-1.8347 https://www.hs2.org.uk/map/?mapView=9_52.0744_-1.8347
  - tonyedgecombe 9mo ago
    Wow, it really is easy to find. It reminds you of the scale of this project.
    - kruador 9mo ago
      To be clear, it is currently really easy to find because major earthworks are being done, and that requires space to move in the equipment to do it, along with new roads to get to points that were previously inaccessible, being the middle of nowhere. To see what it will look like afterwards, try to find High Speed 1, aka the Channel Tunnel Rail Link, now that it's had nearly 20 years to be landscaped and vegetation to grow back. If you don't know what you're looking for, you won't see it.

crossroadsguy 9mo ago

> a hand axe that may be more than 40,000 years old As opposed to a foot axe I assume > and 19th Century gold dentures Ah, them classy 19th Centurians!

Podrod 9mo ago
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hand_axe https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hand_axe
- hinkley 9mo ago
  Those have always looked so unwieldy to me. What an excellent way to lose a limb.
jetrink 9mo ago
FTA > Hand axes were held in the palm rather than attached to a wooden handle.
Normal_gaussian 9mo ago
In modern times a hand axe is opposed to full axes, hatchets, felling axes, wood splitting axes etc. Depending on where you are in the world you will have different axe categories, but a 'hand axe' is typically present as an axe wielded in a single hand. However, some significant distinction should be made for what is actually meant here. For such historic finds "hand axe" often means a stone tool with two faces and shaped like a tear drop / round-bottomed triangle. With the 'bottom' face shaped to a crude blade, and the 'top' 'sides' made into a grip. Note there is no shaft, and the way it is used is speculative and likely very varied, as few other tools existed. The proto-axe if you will.
foldr 9mo ago
It’s a hand axe, Mark, not a felling axe.
MisterTea 9mo ago
I'm sorry your attempt at humor was completely missed by several pedants.

troad 9mo ago

Contrapoint to the naysayers: building infrastructure is good actually, and in this specific case, has had the added side benefit of unearthing these cool artifacts that would otherwise still be decaying in some peat bog. British NIMBYs seem unusually strong, even in a world of NIMBYism. Best wishes to the British in defeating the Midsomer Historical Society of Bat-Loving Cranks, which apparently controls the deep state over there.

ggm 9mo ago
Sir, this is wimpy's - the confusion of naming cheap housing construction firm, the same as a very old burger chain in the UK which predates Wendy's or McDonald's in the UK by many decades being most apposite.
techterrier 9mo ago
On behalf of the Midsomer Historical Society of Bat-Loving Cranks, i'd like to extend a cordial invitation to our Wickerman Festival this year. Perhaps on perusing our good works, you might be persuaded of their merits. Kind regards, Nigel.
globular-toast 9mo ago
UK is so densely populated that something like this affects a LOT of people. Also people's "back yards" are tiny enough as it is. Small changes have a big impact and people living in such cramped spaces are living in constant fear of that. If you happen to come across any part of HS2 in some random village you've never heard of it's quite incredible the impact it's having on the locals. Locals who live miles away from the nearest station and therefore unable to use the line, by the way. We also have very little wildlife left and we don't really want to live in concrete jungles. Suffice to say, it's not difficult to see why it's like this in the UK if you actually come and see.
- energy123 9mo ago
  The taller the concrete jungle, the more spare land there is for people like you outside of it.

barkingcat 9mo ago

the indiana jones warehouse.

ggm 9mo ago
Arguably the science museum London already had one. They lost a bit of donated science bits over many years due to lack of maintenance and records management.
6stringmerc 9mo ago
TOP men…

zhivota 9mo ago

This should be the gameplay in Civilization, instead of the thing where you train and archaeologist who goes to excavate magically known locations. Excavation of tunnels and such should just come with a chance of finding artifacts, but it only materializes with the right culture tech unlocked (before some point, buried treasures were just scrapped or sold, not put into museums).

SenHeng 9mo ago
My little village is built on the site of some ancient Japanese village [0] and any construction that involves digging up dirt often also unearths some kind of archaeological find that stops all work for half a year while the archaeologists do their stuff, if they can even be bothered to come. It’s happened often enough that it’s a wink and a nod that nothing was found. Foremen and anyone ‘in-charge’ will not be on site until any kind of digging is complete. [0]: https://kanko-omachi.gr.jp/spot/wappara/ https://kanko-omachi.gr.jp/spot/wappara/

6stringmerc 9mo ago

I want to print this article and take it with me when asking permission to use my pro-grade Garrett metal detector on unused, abandoned but owned / to be redeveloped property. I’m old enough and studied enough to know where I live people in the Great Depression stashed loot in jars and buried it. Who knows what all could be in the occasional backyard recovery. History tells lots of things, not many listen. Utility can be limited in scope.

sarreph 9mo ago

I recall comments about this last week on the BBC website where people made the points that: 1. Surely the long term plan is to not keep these relics in a gargantuan warehouse but instead to put them in a museum(s) — with free entry no less — so that the tax paying public can enjoy them. 2. Further, collections of relics that relate to the site of each station on the line could be displayed in each.

pjc50 9mo ago
> museum(s) — with free entry no less The tax paying public aren't going to pay for that. The existing collections can just about barely justify free entry. Most museums have a vast secondary collection that's not on display already. These items are going in a warehouse because there isn't enough money to do archaeology on them any time soon, let alone prep them for display.
- Angostura 9mo ago
  Or do what the V&A has done in Docklands - make its warehouse available for the public to visit. Pretty cool day out. https://www.vam.ac.uk/east/storehouse/visit https://www.vam.ac.uk/east/storehouse/visit
  - OJFord 9mo ago
    Second that, it's really good. You can only really see a small fraction of it still, just because of the nature of it (it's like a central viewing space completely surrounded by warehouse shelving) but really interesting, from the meta perspective of seeing how they store and tend to pieces too. For example, there's a bunch of swords 'on display' (such as it is) and then you can sort of just about see an entire sword storage/curation room off to one side, with many times more than are actually visible in some detail.
  - notahacker 9mo ago
    Science Museum opens its warehouse in Swindon to the public too Highly recommended for people with an interest in vehicles, but there's a lot of other stuff from twentieth century consumer goods to the contents of Stephen Hawkings office on shelves there and document archives too.

8bitsrule 9mo ago

Yet another demonstration of the fact that much of archeology is a result of adding a scientific veneer to simple treasure-hunting. 'Artifacts', 'culture' and 'history' notwithstanding. Once 'discovered' and shaken down, many 'sites' have been roughly 'repaired' for the benefit of tourists.