5 ms·

It's impossible to prove in either direction. AI benchmarks suck. Personally, I like using Claude (for the things I'm able to make it do, and not for the thing

It's impossible to prove in either direction. AI benchmarks suck. Personally, I like using Claude (for the things I'm able to make it do, and not for the things I can't), and I don't really care whether anyone else does.

AstroBen 10mo ago
I'd just like to see a live coding session from one of these 10x AI devs Like genuinely. I want to get stuff done 10x as fast too
- neal_jones 10mo ago
  I’d really like to see a 10x ai dev vs a 10x analog dev
  - rootnod3 10mo ago
    And an added "6 months" later to see which delivered result didn't blow up in their face down the road.
- lordnacho 10mo ago
  But the benefit might not be speed, it might be economy of attention. I can code with Claude when my mind isn't fresh. That adds several hours of time I can schedule, where previously I had to do fiddly things when I was fresh. What I can attest is that I used to have a backlog of things I wanted to fix, but hadn't gotten around to. That's now gone, and it vanished a lot faster than the half a year I had thought it would take.
  - llmslave2 10mo ago
    Doesn't that mean you're less likely to catch bugs and other issues that the AI spits out?
    - mpyne 10mo ago
      Code you never ship doesn't have bugs by definition, but never shipping is usually a worse state to be in.
      - ponector 10mo ago
        I'm sure people from Knight Capital don't think so.
        mpyne 10mo ago
        Even there, they made a lot of money before they went bust. Like if you want an example you'd be better of picking Therac-25, as ancient an example as it is.
    - gregoryl 10mo ago
      nah, you rely on your coworkers to review your slop!
      - jennyholzer4 10mo ago
        [flagged]
    - lordnacho 10mo ago
      No, you are spending less time on fixing little things, so you have more time on things like making sure all the potential errors are checked.
    - duskdozer 10mo ago
      Not a problem! Just ask the AI to verify its output and make test cases!
- lifetimerubyist 10mo ago
  Theo the YouTuber who also runs T3.chat always makes videos about how great coding agents are and he’ll try to do something on stream and it ALWAYS fails massively and he’s always like “well it wasn’t like this when I did it earlier.” Sure buddy.
  - llmslave2 10mo ago
    Theo is the type of programmer where you don't care when he boos you, because you know what makes him cheer.
- deleted 10mo ago
  [deleted]
- godelski 10mo ago
  > I'd just like to see a live coding session from one of these 10x AI devs I'd also like to see how it compares to their coding without AI. I mean I really need to understand what the "x" is in 10x. If their x is <0.1 then who gives a shit. But if their x is >2 then holy fuck I want to know. Who doesn't want to be faster? But it's not like x is the same for everybody.
  - llmslave2 10mo ago
    Yeah this is the key point. Part of me wonders if it's just 0.1x devs somehow reaching 1.0x productivity...
    - bonesss 10mo ago
      Also the terrible code bases and orgs that are out there… the amount of churn bad JavaScript solutions with eight frontend frameworks might necessitate and how tight systems code works are very different.
      - nosianu 10mo ago
        This has nothing to do with JS! I wish that idea would die. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18442941 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18442941 It's not just about them (link, Oracle), there is terrible code all over the place. Games, business software, everything. It has nothing to do with the language! Anyone who claims that may be part of the problem, since they don't understand the problem and concentrate on superficial things. Also, what looks terrible may not be so. I once had to work on an in-house JS app (for internal cost reporting and control). It used two GUI frameworks - because they had started switching to another one, but then stopped the transition. Sounds bad, yes? But, I worked on the code of the company I linked above, and that "terrible" JS app was easy mode all the way! Even if it used two GUI frameworks at once, understanding the code, adding new features, debugging, everything was still very easy and doable with just half a brain active. I never had to ask my predecessor anything either, everything was clear with one look at the code. Because everything was well isolated and modular, among other things. Making changes did not affect other places in unexpected ways (as is common in biology). I found some enlightenment - what seems to be very bad at first glance may not actually matter nearly as much as deeper things.
- tonyedgecombe 10mo ago
  > I want to get stuff done 10x as fast too I don’t. I mean I like being productive but by doing the right thing rather than churning out ten times as much code.
- topocite 10mo ago
  Obviously, there has to be huge variability between people based on initial starting conditions. It is like if someone says they are losing weight eating 2500 calories a day and someone else says that is impossible because they started eating 2500 calories and gained weight. Neither are making anything up or being untruthful. What is strange to me is that smart people can't see something this obvious.
- LinXitoW 10mo ago
  I don't think any serious dev has claimed 10x as a general statement. Obviously, no true scotsman and all that, so even my statement about makers of anecdotal statements is anecdotal. Even as a slight fan, I'd never claim more than 10-20% all together. I could maybe see 5x for some specific typing heavy usages. Like adding a basic CRUD stuff for a basic entity into an already existing Spring app.
- Kerrick 10mo ago
  My wife used to be a professional streamer so I know how distracting it can be to try and entertain an audience. So when I attempted to become one of these 10x AI devs over my Christmas vacation I did not live stream. But I did make a bunch of atomic commits and push them up to soucrcehut. Perhaps you'll find that helpful? Just Christmas Vacation (12-18h days): https://git.sr.ht/~kerrick/ratatui_ruby/log/v0.8.0 https://git.sr.ht/~kerrick/ratatui_ruby/log/v0.8.0 Lastest (slowed down by job & real life): https://git.sr.ht/~kerrick/ratatui_ruby/log/trunk https://git.sr.ht/~kerrick/ratatui_ruby/log/trunk and https://git.sr.ht/~kerrick/ratatui_ruby-wiki/log/wiki https://git.sr.ht/~kerrick/ratatui_ruby-wiki/log/wiki and https://git.sr.ht/~kerrick/ratatui_ruby-tea/log/trunk https://git.sr.ht/~kerrick/ratatui_ruby-tea/log/trunk
9h1L0509h3R 10mo ago
[dead]
mbesto 10mo ago
> AI benchmarks suck. Not only do they suck, but it's an essentially an impossible task since there is no frame of reference on what "good code" looks like.

AstroBen 10mo ago

I'd just like to see a live coding session from one of these 10x AI devs Like genuinely. I want to get stuff done 10x as fast too

neal_jones 10mo ago
I’d really like to see a 10x ai dev vs a 10x analog dev
- rootnod3 10mo ago
  And an added "6 months" later to see which delivered result didn't blow up in their face down the road.
lordnacho 10mo ago
But the benefit might not be speed, it might be economy of attention. I can code with Claude when my mind isn't fresh. That adds several hours of time I can schedule, where previously I had to do fiddly things when I was fresh. What I can attest is that I used to have a backlog of things I wanted to fix, but hadn't gotten around to. That's now gone, and it vanished a lot faster than the half a year I had thought it would take.
- llmslave2 10mo ago
  Doesn't that mean you're less likely to catch bugs and other issues that the AI spits out?
  - mpyne 10mo ago
    Code you never ship doesn't have bugs by definition, but never shipping is usually a worse state to be in.
    - ponector 10mo ago
      I'm sure people from Knight Capital don't think so.
      - mpyne 10mo ago
        Even there, they made a lot of money before they went bust. Like if you want an example you'd be better of picking Therac-25, as ancient an example as it is.
  - gregoryl 10mo ago
    nah, you rely on your coworkers to review your slop!
    - jennyholzer4 10mo ago
      [flagged]
  - lordnacho 10mo ago
    No, you are spending less time on fixing little things, so you have more time on things like making sure all the potential errors are checked.
  - duskdozer 10mo ago
    Not a problem! Just ask the AI to verify its output and make test cases!
lifetimerubyist 10mo ago
Theo the YouTuber who also runs T3.chat always makes videos about how great coding agents are and he’ll try to do something on stream and it ALWAYS fails massively and he’s always like “well it wasn’t like this when I did it earlier.” Sure buddy.
- llmslave2 10mo ago
  Theo is the type of programmer where you don't care when he boos you, because you know what makes him cheer.
deleted 10mo ago
[deleted]
godelski 10mo ago
> I'd just like to see a live coding session from one of these 10x AI devs I'd also like to see how it compares to their coding without AI. I mean I really need to understand what the "x" is in 10x. If their x is <0.1 then who gives a shit. But if their x is >2 then holy fuck I want to know. Who doesn't want to be faster? But it's not like x is the same for everybody.
- llmslave2 10mo ago
  Yeah this is the key point. Part of me wonders if it's just 0.1x devs somehow reaching 1.0x productivity...
  - bonesss 10mo ago
    Also the terrible code bases and orgs that are out there… the amount of churn bad JavaScript solutions with eight frontend frameworks might necessitate and how tight systems code works are very different.
    - nosianu 10mo ago
      This has nothing to do with JS! I wish that idea would die. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18442941 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18442941 It's not just about them (link, Oracle), there is terrible code all over the place. Games, business software, everything. It has nothing to do with the language! Anyone who claims that may be part of the problem, since they don't understand the problem and concentrate on superficial things. Also, what looks terrible may not be so. I once had to work on an in-house JS app (for internal cost reporting and control). It used two GUI frameworks - because they had started switching to another one, but then stopped the transition. Sounds bad, yes? But, I worked on the code of the company I linked above, and that "terrible" JS app was easy mode all the way! Even if it used two GUI frameworks at once, understanding the code, adding new features, debugging, everything was still very easy and doable with just half a brain active. I never had to ask my predecessor anything either, everything was clear with one look at the code. Because everything was well isolated and modular, among other things. Making changes did not affect other places in unexpected ways (as is common in biology). I found some enlightenment - what seems to be very bad at first glance may not actually matter nearly as much as deeper things.
tonyedgecombe 10mo ago
> I want to get stuff done 10x as fast too I don’t. I mean I like being productive but by doing the right thing rather than churning out ten times as much code.
topocite 10mo ago
Obviously, there has to be huge variability between people based on initial starting conditions. It is like if someone says they are losing weight eating 2500 calories a day and someone else says that is impossible because they started eating 2500 calories and gained weight. Neither are making anything up or being untruthful. What is strange to me is that smart people can't see something this obvious.
LinXitoW 10mo ago
I don't think any serious dev has claimed 10x as a general statement. Obviously, no true scotsman and all that, so even my statement about makers of anecdotal statements is anecdotal. Even as a slight fan, I'd never claim more than 10-20% all together. I could maybe see 5x for some specific typing heavy usages. Like adding a basic CRUD stuff for a basic entity into an already existing Spring app.
Kerrick 10mo ago
My wife used to be a professional streamer so I know how distracting it can be to try and entertain an audience. So when I attempted to become one of these 10x AI devs over my Christmas vacation I did not live stream. But I did make a bunch of atomic commits and push them up to soucrcehut. Perhaps you'll find that helpful? Just Christmas Vacation (12-18h days): https://git.sr.ht/~kerrick/ratatui_ruby/log/v0.8.0 https://git.sr.ht/~kerrick/ratatui_ruby/log/v0.8.0 Lastest (slowed down by job & real life): https://git.sr.ht/~kerrick/ratatui_ruby/log/trunk https://git.sr.ht/~kerrick/ratatui_ruby/log/trunk and https://git.sr.ht/~kerrick/ratatui_ruby-wiki/log/wiki https://git.sr.ht/~kerrick/ratatui_ruby-wiki/log/wiki and https://git.sr.ht/~kerrick/ratatui_ruby-tea/log/trunk https://git.sr.ht/~kerrick/ratatui_ruby-tea/log/trunk

9h1L0509h3R 10mo ago

[dead]

mbesto 10mo ago

> AI benchmarks suck. Not only do they suck, but it's an essentially an impossible task since there is no frame of reference on what "good code" looks like.