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Maybe I’m reading this wrong, but commercial use of comments is prohibited by the HN Privacy and data Policy. So is creating derivative works (so technically a
by isodev 11mo ago
Maybe I’m reading this wrong, but commercial use of comments is prohibited by the HN Privacy and data Policy. So is creating derivative works (so technically a vector representation)
- hammock 11mo agoSomeone better go tell Open AI
- isodev 11mo agoI think a number of lawsuits are in progress of teaching them that particular lesson.
- lazide 11mo agoStill waiting for anything resembling a penalty, been a long time now. 5 years?
- verdverm 11mo agoMost of the time they are hardly penalties and look more like rounding errors to these companies
- sfn42 11mo agoI'm just wondering what gives HN, Reddit etc the right to our comments? If anyone owns this comment it's me IMO. So I don't see any reason why HN should be able to sue anyone for using this freely available information.
- handfuloflight 11mo agoWith Reddit, at least it's the legal agreement you enter into them by creating an account and using it.
- sfn42 11mo agoSo they own my comments because they said so.
- lazide 11mo agoAnd they own the platform. And then you came to the platform (with those rules), and wrote your comment on it. So you agreed to the rules. At least that is what the TOS usually says. You can always get around that by making your own service or the like. Think of it like visiting a foreign country. Like it or not, their rules apply one way or another. If they can enforce them, anyway.
- sfn42 11mo agoYeah I get it. I just don't understand the public outrage. Why is everyone so worried about this? I write stuff knowing it's publicly available, and I don't give a crap about HN or Reddit or whomever's claims to my writings. As far as I'm concerned it's all public domain, so what if OpenAI trains on it? Why should that bother me? I just don't understand, it really just feels like a witch hunt, like everyone just wants to hate AI companies and they'll jump on any bandwagon that's against them no matter how nonsensical it is.
- lazide 11mo agoIf you got replaced at the job you needed by ‘AI’, isn’t it salt in the wound that they used your comments that you wrote without it in mind (in part) to do it? Why wouldn’t someone be mad about that?
- gkbrk 10mo agoNo, they own it because you said so. You "provide them with a global, non-revocable license to do things with the content you submit" as per the agreement you accepted. You're not required to enter into this agreement, this was a totally optional thing you opted to do.
- gunalx 11mo ago
- deleted 11mo ago[deleted]
- noitpmeder 11mo agoNot sure it's clear they will learn anything.... My impression was they were winning or settling these suits
- isodev 11mo agoBut is that a reason to keep doing it? Is the penalty the only reason people hold back on doing bad stuff?
- fortyseven 11mo agoDoes profit outweigh the penalty?
- pessimizer 11mo ago(Violation of HN Terms & Conditions || Violation of copyright) != "bad stuff" (Violation of HN Terms & Conditions || Violation of copyright) = Potential penalty
- dylan604 11mo ago(Violation of HN Terms & Conditions || Violation of copyright) - Potential penalty = Unsane Profits So the equation still balances for them to not give a damn
- pseudosavant 11mo agoIsn’t that basically how societies work? Different penalties, but some kind of penalties enforcing the boundaries of that society?
- nomdep 11mo agoNot everyone agree over some things being bad
- deleted 11mo ago[deleted]
- delichon 11mo agoCertainly it is literally derivative. But so are my memories of my time on the site. And in fact I do intend to make commercial use of some of those derivations. I believe it should be a right to make an external prosthesis for those memories in the form of a vector database.
- deleted 11mo ago[deleted]
- isodev 11mo agoThat’s not the same as using it to build models. You as an individual have the right to access this content as this is the purpose of this website. The content becoming the core of some model is not.
- delichon 11mo agoIf it's OK to encode it in your natural neural net, why is it not OK to put it in your artificial one?
- BHSPitMonkey 11mo agoIt's the same distinction as making a backup copy of a movie to your hard drive vs. redistributing it to other parties.
- delichon 11mo agoYou mean like free speech for concepts and ideas? It's OK to think them but not to tell other people about them? LLMs are another media of thought exchange, in some ways worse and others better. Of course it's out of bounds from them to produce literal copies of copyrighted work. But as with a human brain it should be OK for artificial neural nets to learn from them and generate new work.
- godelski 11mo agoLet's talk after you've read all hacker news comments. Meet back here in a thousand years?
- chasd00 11mo agoHa I was about to ask for all my comments to be removed as a joke. I guess I don’t have to.
- dylan604 11mo agoTo think that any company anywhere actually removes all data upon request is a bit naive to me. Sure, maybe I'm too pessimistic, but there's just not enough evidence these deletes are not soft deletes. The data is just too valuable to them.
- integralid 11mo agoData of the few users that are privacy aware and go through the hoops to request GDPR-compliant data deletion is not work risking GDPR fines. Data of non-european users who just click the "delete" button in their user profile? Completely different beast.
- dylan604 11mo agoBut see, the requires two totally different workflows. It would just be easier to soft delete for everything and tell everyone that it's a hard delete. I've never been convinced that my data will be deleted from any long term backups. There's nothing preventing them from periodically restoring data from a previous backup and not doing any kind of due diligence to ensure hard delete data is deleted again. Who in the EU is actually going in and auditing hard deletes? If you log in and can no longer see the data because the soft delete flag prevents it from being displayed and/or if any "give me a report of data you have on me" reports empty because of soft delete flag, how does anyone prove their data was not soft deleted only?
- franciscop 11mo agoWhat would a company that does that, hypothetically, then tell a user that requests their data held by the company reply? With their soft-deleted data, or would they say they have no data?
- araes 11mo agoFrom Legal | Y Combinator | Terms of Use | Conditions of Use [1] [1] https://www.ycombinator.com/legal/#tou https://www.ycombinator.com/legal/#tou > Commercial Use: Unless otherwise expressly authorized herein or in the Site, you agree not to display, distribute, license, perform, publish, reproduce, duplicate, copy, create derivative works from, modify, sell, resell, exploit, transfer or upload for any commercial purposes, any portion of the Site, use of the Site, or access to the Site. > The buying, exchanging, selling and/or promotion (commercial or otherwise) of upvotes, comments, submissions, accounts (or any aspect of your account or any other account), karma, and/or content is strictly prohibited, constitutes a material breach of these Terms of Use, and could result in legal liability. From [1] Terms of Use | Intellectual Property Rights: > Except as expressly authorized by Y Combinator, you agree not to modify, copy, frame, scrape, rent, lease, loan, sell, distribute or create derivative works based on the Site or the Site Content, in whole or in part, except that the foregoing does not apply to your own User Content (as defined below) that you legally upload to the Site. > In connection with your use of the Site you will not engage in or use any data mining, robots, scraping or similar data gathering or extraction methods.
- adrianwaj 11mo agoI wonder if it'd be okay to do an AirDropped coin based on them? Does one exist? Maybe as a YC startup idea?