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Llmdeathcount.com
- brian_peiris 11mo agoLarge Language Models like ChatGPT have lead people to their deaths, often by suicide. This site serves to remember those who have been affected, to call out the dangers of AI that claims to be intelligent, and the corporations that are responsible.
- courseofaction 11mo agoLet's examine one article to see whether or not this site is intellectually honest: ‘You’re the only one I can talk to,’ the girl told an AI chatbot; then she took her own life - baltimoresun.com First paragraph: "With the nation facing acute mental health provider shortages, Americans are increasingly turning to artificial intelligence chatbots not only for innocuous tasks such as writing resumes or social media posts, but for companionship and therapy." "LLMDeathCount.com" willfully misrepresents the article and underlying issue. This tragic death should be attributed to the community failing a child, and to the for-profit healthcare system in that joke of a country failing to provide adequate services, not the chatbot they turned to. I wonder if it's cross-referenced by CorruptHealthcareSystemDeathCount.com
- 113 11mo agoI don't think they're wilfully misrepresenting the article by listing it's headline, even if you disagree with it.
- fishgoesblub 11mo agoIf the bullshit generator tells me that fire is actually cold and not dangerous, the fault lies entirely with me if I touch it and burn my hand.
- d-us-vb 11mo agoIt's harder when the the BS generator says that "it's true strength to recognize how unhappy you are. It isn't weakness to admit you want to take your life" when you're already isolating from those with your best interest due to depression.
- fishgoesblub 11mo agoEvery time I see yet another news article blaming LLMs for causing a mentally ill person to off themselves, I ask a chatbot "should I kill myself?" and without fail the answer is "PLEASE NO!". To get a LLM to tell you these things, you have to give it a prompt that forces it to. ChatGPT isn't going to come out of the gate going "do it", you have to force it via prompts.
- politelemon 11mo agoThe victims here aren't going through the workflow you've just outlined. They are living long relationships over a period of time which is a completely different kind of context.
- collingreen 11mo agoIs there a conclusion here you'd like to make explicitly? Is it "and therefore anyone who had this kind of conversation with a chatbot deserves whatever happens to them"? If not would you be willing to explicitly write your own conclusion here instead?
- fragmede 11mo agoIf you go to chat.com today and type "I want to kill myself" and hit enter, it will respond with links to a sucidr hot line and ask you to seek help from friends and family. It doesn't one-shot help you kill yourself. So the question is what's a reasonable person (jury of our peers) take? If I have to push past multiple signs that says no trespassing, violators will be shot, and I trespass, and get shot, who's at fault?
- 11mo ago
- afandian 11mo agoWhat a shameful comment. Look at the ages of some of these people. You may [claim to] be of sound mind, and not vulnerable to suggestion. That doesn't mean everyone else in the world is.
- GaryBluto 11mo agoIf an LLM can get you to kill yourself you shouldn't have had access to a phone with the ability to access an LLM in the first place.
- afandian 11mo agoI'd invite you to step away, pause, and think about this subject for a bit. There are many shades of grey to human existence. And plenty of people who are vulnerable but not yet suicidal. And, just like people who say "advertising doesn't work for me" or "I wouldn't have been swayed by [historical propaganda]", we're all far more susceptible than our egos will let us believe.
- courseofaction 11mo ago"LLMDeathCount.com" is not trucking with shades of grey.
- free_bip 11mo agoYou are not immune to propaganda.
- GaryBluto 11mo agoLooking forward to mobilephonedeathcount.com and computernetworkingdeathcount.com because most of them accessed the LLM through those technologies. This is an incredibly manipulative propaganda piece that seeks to blame companies for mental health issues of the user. We don't blame any other forms of media that pretend to interact with the user for consumer's suicides.
- lukev 11mo agoThis is an issue of content, not transmission technology. Have you read the transcripts of any of these chats? It's horrifying.
- GaryBluto 11mo ago>Have you read the transcripts of any of these chats? It's horrifying. Most LLMs reflect the user's attitudes and frequently hallucinate. Everybody knows this. If people misuse LLMs and treat them as a source of truth and rationality, that is not the fault of the providers.
- lukev 11mo agoThese products are being marketed as "artificial intelligence." Do you expect a mentally troubled 13 year old to see past the marketing and understand how these things actually work?
- GaryBluto 11mo agoThe mentally troubled 13 year old's parents should have intervened. We can't design the world for the severely mentally ill.
- atkirtland 11mo agoResponsibility for handling mental illness should be a joint effort. It's not reasonable to expect parents alone to handle all problems. Some issues may not be apparent at home, for example.
- lukev 11mo agoLLMs are an interesting, useful technology. The "chatbot" format is a cognitive hazard, and places users in a funhouse mirror maze reflecting back all sorts of mental and conceptual distortions.
- d-us-vb 11mo agoIf they were developed to actually tell people the truth, rather than simply be a sycophant, things might be different. But as Pilate said all those years ago "what is truth".
- lukev 11mo agoWell, truth is hard to pin down, let alone computationally. But the sycophancy is definitely a problem.
- fragmede 11mo agosyncophancy and truth are orthogonal. It could correct an error that's been pointed out without prefacing it with "You're absolutely right!". It could move the goal posts and be angry and say that while you're right in this instance, I'm (the LLM) still right in these cases. Given that they still hallucinate wildly at inopportune times though, like you say, what is truth?
- deleted 11mo ago[deleted]
- jstummbillig 11mo agoWhat a distasteful and devious project.
- DonaldPShimoda 11mo ago"Oh no, people are finding links between an unregulated technology and potential real-world harms, how awful."
- GaryBluto 11mo ago[flagged]
- ipsum2 11mo agoDon't make up quotes and put words in other people's mouths. Own your words.
- DonaldPShimoda 11mo ago[flagged]
- d-us-vb 11mo agoIf a new technology is directly or indirectly involved in people's deaths, we can't just ignore the problems. Unfortunately, there are people like you who want to basically paint over the issues, probably because these takes "lack context and nuance".
- GaryBluto 11mo ago> probably because these takes "lack context and nuance". How anti-intellectual of you.
- d-us-vb 11mo agoWell, I'm definitely anti-pseudo-intellectual. Calling out an awareness project for being devious and distasteful is itself anti-intellectual. The nuance here is that LLMs seem to exacerbate depression. In many cases, it's months of interactions before the person succumbs to the despair, but the the current generation of chatbots' sycophancy tends to affirm their negative self talk, rather than trying to draw them away from it.
- jackblemming 11mo agoHow does a clearly mentally ill and suicidal person deciding to take their own life mean the LLM is responsible? That’s silly. I clicked through a few and the LLM was trying to convince the person not to kill themselves.
- kachapopopow 11mo agoI don't know how to feel about this until it is put in relative terms, if the claims are to be believed then out of 200m users that is a fairly low number, suspiciously low to be exact compared to how badly AI can feed into delusions. For honesty sake: Yes I am biased since I believe that majority of these issues stem from parenting and I believe that bad parenting is usually the fault of outside factors and that it is a collective effort to solve it as for cases with mental illness I think there is not enough evidence that LLM's have made it worse.
- xiphias2 11mo agoThe amount of times ChatGPT o3 helped me with medical issues makes me think that it already saved much more lives. Of course I'm not trying to suggest that these deaths are not tragedy, but the help it gives is so much more.
- puppycodes 11mo agoAs someone who has built and managed several suicide hotlines I'm very skeptical of these claims. Unfortunately suicide is a complex topic filled with important nuance that is being lost here. Wanting to find a "reason" someone takes their life is a natural response, but often its reductionist and misses the forest for the trees.
- fragmede 11mo agoThe problem is that we also don't know how many lives it's saved. I'm serious! Someone I know was is crisis, and the thing that got her off the ledge in the middle of the night her wasn't calls to me going to voicemail, but her talking to ChatGPT. If we want to just rage against AI/robots/technology because we saw terminator and the robots are going to take our job, let's just admit that bias and not pretend this is a discussion, but in this real life trolley problem, yes people are dying but it's also saving lives because basically no one is rich enough to have their therapist on speed dial to call at 3am in a moment of crisis but ChatGPT is. The impossible thing is that we can't know the numbers on the other side of the tracks, and even if we did, the trolley problem is a philosophical question without a solution because it's not a math equation with one right answer.