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Having a deadline is how things get done. With no deadline, nothing gets accomplished.
by WalterBright 1y ago
Having a deadline is how things get done. With no deadline, nothing gets accomplished.
- notahacker 1y agoThe (aero)space industry tends to do rather well out of it being acceptable to miss deadlines though...
- bahmboo 1y agoThis is a political deadline with no grounding in reality.
- opwieurposiu 1y agoHey, it worked when JFK did it!
- jjk166 1y agoWho was president during the moonlanding?
- tick_tock_tick 1y agoJFK got assassinated.....
- jjk166 1y agoAnd was the guy who took over after his assassination, and then won the next election, president during the moon landings?
- hypeatei 1y agoPrecisely. Trump wants to put his name on things for the history books.
- WalterBright 1y agohttps://www.obama.org/presidential-center/ https://www.obama.org/presidential-center/
- oceanplexian 1y agoJFK proposed we go to the Moon in 1962. We did it in 1969, 7 years later.
- phkahler 1y agoNot only that, he wanted to go to the moon before the end of the decade. They made it within that time.
- jjk166 1y agoWhich is kind of the key point - Kennedy's deadline was a realistic one based on the technical difficulty of the challenge.
- dghlsakjg 1y agoArtemis is scheduled to take longer than Apollo. We are in year 8 of Artemis. In year 8 of Apollo there were multiple manned missions including one that went to the moon but did not land.
- WalterBright 1y agoIt was never realistic. It turned out be possible, though. Also, corners were cut in the testing. (Full stack testing.)
- jjk166 1y agoI don't know how you can claim a deadline that was achieved was not realistic. Full stack testing was not cutting corners. After ground testing it was deemed that incremental testing would not be beneficial. Doing tasks in parallel instead of in series can introduce project risks, but that's not the same thing as cutting corners, which is where something necessary is not done at all.
- WalterBright 1y agoIt's not realistic that you can become a supermodel. But it's not impossible. The idea that rocket X not exploding in a single launch makes it man-rated is cutting corners.
- kulahan 1y agoSo just like every other deadline I'm given, then.
- colechristensen 1y agoThe entire Apollo program was a political stunt to upstage the USSR.
- NoMoreNicksLeft 1y agoIt was a semi-covert program to be able to get to the USSR in 25 minutes with 150ktons of carryon luggage.
- dboreham 1y agoThat was Mercury. All the ICBM systems predate Apollo.
- jjk166 1y agoA political stunt for America to upstage the USSR, not to stroke the ego of a particular American.
- echelon 1y agoI feel like that attitude has kept us on earth all this time. We let people do stupid shit and kill themselves all the time. Driving 80+ MPH, driving motorcycles, recreational drugs, alcohol, climbing Everest, etc. I think it's fine. If I were in the position, I'd sign up to do this. The moon is meaningful.
- tastyface 1y ago[flagged]
- MarsIronPI 1y ago> The moon will be desecrated by Trump planting some gaudy gilded flag with his name on it. Let's be serious, please. When has Trump ever stuck his name or face on anything nationally meaningful?
- chrisco255 1y agoThis is preferable to "we'll go back again maybe one day 5 decades from now, if we get around to it"
- nobleach 1y agoMost deadlines are completely made up to create a false scarcity of time. While I agree this one is pretty meaningless and we'll forget about it in a few days... it's not unlike any other silly deadline.
- Teever 1y agoThe point you raise is implicit in the comment that you're replying to and your response seems to intentionally ignore the very valid point that a bad deadline in this context may kill people and have other very negative consequences for the program. What part of the comment you're replying to lead you to believe that the person you're replying to does not understand the value of deadlines?
- kagakuninja 1y agoWith Trump, assume there will be massive kickbacks and corruption, most likely nothing useful will happen.
- deleted 1y ago[deleted]
- dragontamer 1y agoThe Moon directive was set by Donald Trump in 2017. This is just the same deadline being pushed another year because of failures. Deadlines that get constantly pushed aren't deadlines at all. As I recall, SpaceX and Artemis project was supposed to be Moon by 2024. At least originally. But then SpaceX blew up all the rockets (successfully testing them or something) and now we've wasted damn near a decade.
- jaapbadlands 1y agoTesting rockets that fail is still progress. Deadlines that get pushed isn't an argument against deadlines.
- dragontamer 1y agoDeadlines that get pushed is an argument against SpaceX. How many deadlines do we miss before we realize there is no actual plan to get to the moon?
- b00ty4breakfast 1y agoAny project even a quarter as complex as a manned lunar mission going to run into problems and failures and unforeseen complications (just ask anyone who's ever done any home renovation). Things go over budget, deadlines are missed, stuff doesn't work out the way you'd envisioned. This isn't always somebody's fault or the result of poor planning (though they can be). Yeah, we've been there already, but it's been many decades and we haven't exactly kept all the tech and procedures up to date in the intervening years. And that first go-round itself missed it's intended deadline by about 7-8 years.
- mikkupikku 1y agoDeadlines, political pressure to ignore issues and get it done, is how you get astronauts dead. Apollo 1, Challenger, Columbia. And of course Soyuz 1 and Soyuz 11 / Salyut 1; it's not just a problem for America. I fear it's going to happen again; Orion isn't safe and hasn't been successfully tested. The heat shield started to disintegrate the last time they tested it and instead of testing it again with their changes they're going to put people in it next time.
- 05 1y agoTo play devil's advocate, the only purpose astronauts serve is PR. Anything that can be done is space could be done cheaper and better with automation/rovers. So it seems that having those astronauts risk their lives for a short term political win is just table stakes, because the alternative for them is to stay on Earth and maybe pay $100K for just an hour in orbit with any of the commercial space tourism companies.
- WalterBright 1y agoAutomation still cannot pick a strawberry.
- genewitch 1y agono strawberries in space
- 05 1y agoIt can't cost effectively pick a strawberry when compared to underpaid workers. It can definitely pick a strawberry cheaper when you take cost of lifting oxygen up from a gravity well into account. And with Moon 'ping' time of 2.6 seconds RTT, direct teleoperation is always an option.
- WalterBright 1y agoCost effectiveness matters, even when cost is no object.
- deleted 1y ago[deleted]