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All this so a handful of passengers a week can wait for the extremely small pool of vehicles in a dusty hole
by leakycap 1y ago
All this so a handful of passengers a week can wait for the extremely small pool of vehicles in a dusty hole
- testing22321 1y agoHave you ridden the existing Vegas tunnel? Tens of thousands of riders when I was there and not a spec of dirt. Very far from perfect, but a long way from useless.
- dagmx 1y agoThe LVCC Loop has demonstrated a peak capacity of ~4,400–4,500 passengers per hour in testing. How did you arrive at tens of thousands of riders?
- testing22321 1y agoI was at the world’s biggest automotive show. It was packed.
- olyjohn 1y agoI didn't realize they could fit tens of thousands of people in the waiting areas. Those stations must really be something to behold.
- dagmx 1y agoSo then saying “ Tens of thousands of riders” is a lie since they weren’t actually using the tunnels to ride in at the time.
- testing22321 1y agoI didn’t say anything like at the same time. In my week in Vegas for SEMA from 8am to well after dark it was always jam packed. That’s tens of thousands of riders. What was it like when you rode it?
- dagmx 1y agoI’m not in LA so I haven’t ridden it but that’s a moot point to the discussion. Having tens of thousands of drivers over an unspecified time period rather than simultaneously isn’t really a flex imho.
- testing22321 1y agoI didn’t intend it to be a flex. I was stating what I saw when I rode it.
- serf 1y ago>Tens of thousands of riders You saw tens of thousands of riders? That anecdote just doesn't jibe with the throughput numbers -- that's why it seems like a flex, it's grossly inflated. Now before we go into pedantry and you talk about how 'riders' meant 'all willing participants who are sitting in line' , fine -- i've been to SEMA and I understand those crowds , but those aren't riders. It's a misreporting of the situation, and frankly it seems intentional.
- testing22321 1y agoI did. I was in and around multiple stations for a week, from early till late, and never saw a single one anything other than packed. Lineups up the turned off escalators topside were extremely common. Many tens of thousands of people were riding. FWIW I was at the event that caused the worlds biggest event centre (the Vegas convention centre) to expand, because it wasn’t big enough to host the event. Millions and millions of people in and around the convention centre, all serviced by the loop.
- AgentK20 1y agoThere were tens of thousands of riders _when you were there?_ Or there were tens of thousands of riders over the lifetime of the system? Most videos I've seen recently show a system that, while functional, typically only has a handful of vehicles running simultaneously, each with carrying capacity for one party of up to 3 people.
- testing22321 1y agoWhen I was there. During SEMA, the worlds biggest automotive show.
- Moomoomoo309 1y agoTens of thousands of riders in what time period? Please, look up how many people it is capable of moving per hour, and compare that to any light rail or street car service in any city. There is no way the loop makes sense to build.
- JumpCrisscross 1y ago> Please, look up how many people it is capable of moving per hour …what is it?
- foxyv 1y agoPeak ridership is about 1300/hour. About how many people you can fit in two trams. Or 10 Disneyland people movers.
- Retric 1y agoThat seems high for what it is. Is that hypothetical peak or actually measured capacity?
- foxyv 1y agoThat is the peak spontaneous ridership per hour. So about 22 people per minute. Probably measured during a convention or something. Most of the time it's probably half of that. So essentially they made a ride comparable to Space Mountain that takes about 2200 passengers per hour.
- chrisfosterelli 1y ago> Please, look up how many people it is capable of moving per hour, and compare that to any light rail or street car service in any city. I have a hard time understanding this criticism. Why not do both? It seems to me like underground highways make sense as an alternative to above ground highways in urban areas, not that they're an alternative to rail. There's lots of cities with excellent public transport that also make use of underground car travel (Melbourne for e.g.). If a company can figure out how to (safely) make underground highways more quickly and more affordably, it seems like that means we may need to do above-ground roads less frequently -- why would that not be a good thing? Further, obviously Musk has a PR angle in facilitating tesla traffic here as the test bed in early days, but I don't see any reason that this couldn't be repurposed to rail use at scale.
- Veserv 1y agoIn 2023-03, they did passenger 1,000,000 [1]. In 2024-05, they did passenger 2,000,000 [2]. So 1,000,000 passengers in 14 months or ~420 days. That is a average throughput of ~2,400 passengers per day. In comparison, the Tokyo Marunouchi line averages ~1,100,000 passengers per day [3]. That is ~420x the rate. Every single day, they do what the Las Vegas Loop does in a year. The peak capacity that they claim without evidence is ~32,000 in a day [4]. The Maruonouchi line does in a day what the Las Vegas Loop at maximum capacity could theoretically do in a entire month. [1] https://www.teslarati.com/elon-musk-boring-co-vegas-loop-1-million-passengers/ https://www.teslarati.com/elon-musk-boring-co-vegas-loop-1-m... [2] https://www.teslarati.com/boring-company-2-million-passengers https://www.teslarati.com/boring-company-2-million-passenger... [3] https://www.japan-experience.com/plan-your-trip/travel-by-train/getting-around-tokyo/tokyo-metro-marunouchi-line-a-comprehensive-guide https://www.japan-experience.com/plan-your-trip/travel-by-tr... [4] https://www.boringcompany.com/lvcc https://www.boringcompany.com/lvcc
- testing22321 1y agoYou are 100% correct. It’s small fry right now. You might be shocked to learn the first airplane couldn’t take passengers. Things improve, or at least attempt to. Even if it fails, I’d rather live in a world where new ideas are being tried and tested and not always talking about how good my horse and cart is.
- mschuster91 1y agoThere's that, but attempting to run around regulations despite numerous violations just doesn't fly either.
- testing22321 1y agoAnd they will be punished for it, exactly as defined by the law.
- mschuster91 1y ago
- leetharris 1y ago[flagged]
- MrDarcy 1y agoThey aren’t just trying shit in the real world, they are literally boring holes into it causing significant harm to people and the environment.
- leetharris 1y agoCan you list the significant harm to people and the environment? I read the article and I'm struggling to find anything.
- cheschire 1y agohttps://www.documentcloud.org/documents/26184164-tbc-state-letter/ https://www.documentcloud.org/documents/26184164-tbc-state-l... Looks like its mainly related to waste water and not cleaning up after themselves.
- red-iron-pine 1y agothis is the news blog for a tech incubator. there is an awful lot of snake oil in this sector, and which is pushed hard here, and an awful lot of high-end talent here, too. which means the snake oil tends to be called a lot.
- FireBeyond 1y agoThis is a fleet of sometimes-self-driving vehicles following a nearly straight route in a closed environment with very few variables. There's little to describe "progress" or "technology" in this.
- antonvs 1y agoApparently the Vegas loop cars are all driven by a human driver currently.
- daemonologist 1y agoThere was a CityNerd video (which you may take or leave in general, but I found the anecdote interesting) in which there appeared to be one vehicle in service on the entire system: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VPjODKUxV5g https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VPjODKUxV5g I assume though that they would adjust the capacity depending on time of day and whether there's an event or something going on, to some degree.
- tallowen 1y agoThanks for sharing this, I had understood prior to this video that the combo of self driving tech + dedicated tunnels might have capacity that rival a light rail system like Seattle has but that's clearly not the case in the current system. I'm curious why more of the autonomous driving tech isn't being used in what I might have thought would be an "easier" place to do it.
- kevin_thibedeau 1y agoThey come to the surface to switch tunnels and Tesla FSD is not a viable technology for automated driving beyond a sunny highway.
- jcotton42 1y ago> had understood prior to this video that the combo of self driving tech + dedicated tunnels might have capacity that rival a light rail system like Seattle has but that's clearly not the case in the current system Not to disparage, but how did you come to that conclusion? A train will always be able to fit more people/m^2 than several cars of equivalent length, due to things like ability to stand, not needing to have multiple engines and trunks, etc.
- tallowen 1y ago> Not to disparage, but how did you come to that conclusion? I did some math and you're clearly right. I think I imagined that with driver-less vehicles leaving much more frequently (10s per minute) one could catch up to the capacity of a small light rail system but that's clearly not the case. I had imagined that _maybe_ it could be an approach for a lower capacity system in the future. My math as someone who is not knowledgeable in how to get this data is as follows: In Seattle is running 4 car trains at 8 minute headways at peak which works out to 7500 people per hour at crush load (4 cars, 250 people per car, 7.5 times per hour). This would require 125 vehicles with 5 seats leaving every minute which is clearly impossible. Looking at Portland's MAX, it looks like they often run 2 car service with 160 passengers of capacity each with service every 15 minutes so 1280 people per hour (2 cars, 160 per car, 4 services per hour). 1280 people per hour could be served by a 5 seat vehicle leaving every ~15 seconds. This I suppose is what I had expected would happen when I tried to imagine the best case scenario for this service.
- kstrauser 1y agoWhen we were in Vegas for Def Con, one of the tube stations was next to one of the Las Vegas Convention Center entrances. I'd occasionally hang out there with friends, and once every half an hour or so, we'd see a lonely Tesla weave through the traffic cone path and disappear into the nethers. Based purely on my own observations, I'd guesstimate that station sees about 50-75 cars per day.
- stogot 1y agoWhat does this cost to use?
- cedws 1y agoI just hope there is never a battery fire down there, because there appears to be no evacuation tunnel or safety procedures. I don't think you can even get the car doors open in the tunnel.
- EA-3167 1y agoMore accurately all this so Elon Musk could keep peddling the lie that boreholes and cars are the future of public transit. What’s a little fraud and environmental harm compared to such a lofty goal?
- paulsutter 1y agoIf you’re curious, this is a demo/experiment. The long term goal is tunnels so inexpensive that they can go 30 levels deep, letting us travel within cities at 200kph with no stop signs (even eliminate automobiles from the surface of cities) This will require considerable progress in tunneling r&d, which is their primary activity
- dzhiurgis 1y agoIMHO Tunnels for bicycles make a ton of sense - similarly to EVs low ventilation requirements, small diameter means cheaper build and most importantly protects you from weather elements. Takes most of the biking joy away tho.
- lo0dot0 1y agoTunnels can recoup their cost easily if they are used massively by many people every day. Any reason why you are against building a subway / underground railway?