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Seattle, Tech Boomtown, Grapples with a Future of Fewer Tech Jobs
- wewewedxfgdf 1y agoIts interest rates more than AI. When interest rates again are low, money is cheap, people will look for ways to make money on money, there will be another boom and massive demand for people.
- Fordec 1y agoIt is not a requirement that those people are in Seattle. Just as car manufacturing is not required to be in Detroit.
- dboreham 1y agos/when/if/
- alephnerd 1y agoIt's not becuase of interest rates (or section 174 or H1Bs or whatever boogeyman you want) Microsoft, Amazon, and other firms have been steadily moving out of Seattle for the past several years - first doing domestic offshoring in Tier 2 metros like RTP, DMV, and Denver and after that to dramatically expanding their already significant presence in the CEE and India. A lot of people on work visas who were impacted during the initial COVID visa issues were PMs, EMs, and other mid-level managers who when they shifted back to their home country were given P/L and product responsibilities, and as such the center of gravity has left Seattle. On top of that, local Seattle area politicians strangled the golden goose by becoming populist tech haters - great for winning an election, but did nothing for the Seattle or Washington economy.
- mac-mc 1y agook what is DMV, RTP is research triangle park from what I can see. DMV is unsearchable.
- Buildstarted 1y agoDistrict of Columbia, Maryland, Virginia according to wikipedia. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DMV https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DMV
- whycombinetor 1y ago"dmv metro area" is not unsearchable
- SpicyLemonZest 1y agoZIRP was a historical anomaly. We shouldn’t expect another sustained period of what we understand to be low interest rates in our lifetimes.
- oldpersonintx2 1y agowrong! we are now entering in to the total opposite - ZIRP by default with only periodic phases of rate increases to "correct" when the next recession hits we will be back at ZIRP and stay there for years welcome to the forever-MMT economy
- hiddencost 1y agoI think many Seattle residents would be delighted. Much of the city's culture was hollowed out by Amazon.
- thesmtsolver 1y agoSeattle residents are happy because other people they deem as "uncultured" are out of jobs? If that is true, do we really want to save Seattle's "culture" from being hollowed out.
- lepus 1y agoIf you live in a tech growth region get your truck driver, construction, bar tender friends or neighbors to be truly honest with you about how they view "tech guys" and the impacts of massive tech growth on their cities and the impacts on their personal quality of life and you'll learn a lot about how people feel, especially if they're renters.
- deleted 1y ago[deleted]
- lolperspectives 1y agoHmm, and who do you think contributed to the salaries, tips and businesses of the above mentioned groups. I'm quite sure a large part came from tech salaries. Everything is related. You can't jump off the planet.
- whycombinetor 1y agoI'm sure they would argue that the primary impact is higher prices (of housing especially), not higher salaries and tips. If you have a few new high income people come into a neighborhood, that feels like some extra dollars coming into the neighborhood; but if a large enough portion starts to become high income transplants, suddenly the locale starts catering to high income as the median consumer target, and previously-middle income workers are now relatively low income.
- aaronbrethorst 1y agoI can't get archive.is to work with this, but if you're subscribed to Apple News+ (e.g. through the Apple One bundle), you can read it here: https://apple.news/AWYHVpxN6QQWlM1h__Hp9nA https://apple.news/AWYHVpxN6QQWlM1h__Hp9nA
- asdev 1y agoSeattle has one of, if the not the biggest real estate bubble in the US
- slaw 1y agoIs it still a bubble if it is not going to burst in your lifetime?
- alephnerd 1y agoThe median household income in the Greater Seattle Area is $121k [0] and the median house sale price is $775k [1]. This means the median income to house ratio is roughly 1:5.5 This is fairly standard across the US, and was true even 20 years ago. For example, in 2000 the median household income ($46k [2]) and house price (~$240k [3]) ratio was roughly 1:5.5. This ratio held true in 2024 as well with a median household income of $83k [2] and a median house price of ~430k [3]. As such, the cost of buying a house as a ratio of household income hasn't changed. The only thing that has changed is the perception. [0] - https://data.census.gov/profile/Seattle_city,_Washington?g=160XX00US5363000 https://data.census.gov/profile/Seattle_city,_Washington?g=1... [1] - https://www.fox13seattle.com/news/seattle-top-cities-home-prices https://www.fox13seattle.com/news/seattle-top-cities-home-pr... [2] - https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/MEHOINUSA646N https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/MEHOINUSA646N [3] - https://www.fedprimerate.com/new_home_sales_price_history.htm https://www.fedprimerate.com/new_home_sales_price_history.ht...
- whycombinetor 1y agoI can't find too much direct historical data on this, but this article says the price to income ratio for Seattle in 1998 was 2.5, and their chart says the 50th percentile was around 3.0 in that year. https://www.jchs.harvard.edu/blog/price-to-income-ratios-are-nearing-historic-highs https://www.jchs.harvard.edu/blog/price-to-income-ratios-are... Edit: This page has a historical slider that you can go back and see the price to income ratio of various metro areas over time. If you go back to the late 90s you will see overwhelming dark blue (dark blue is <3.0). https://www.jchs.harvard.edu/son-2025-price-to-income-map https://www.jchs.harvard.edu/son-2025-price-to-income-map
- rgovostes 1y ago> Uber driver Juan Prado made six figures in 2021, often shuttling passengers in town for job interviews and doing frequent drop-offs near downtown tech offices. Now, he said, demand is much lower. “There are moments where you can be online, and in certain areas, it shows nothing.” "Seattle has the nation’s most expensive Uber rides" (Seattle Times). Rides to the airport have increased 50% for me in the past year, to about $75, and it's at best twice as fast as the $3 train. I doubt it's just fewer tech jobs suppressing Uber activity since 2021.
- stephencoyner 1y agoNot just rideshare, but food delivery has been practically outlawed with all the taxes and fees. We have… Sales tax: 10.25% on prepared delivery food. Commission cap: Apps can only charge restaurants up to 15% per order, which leads to apps passing on fees to consumers PayUp ordinance from 2024: delivery workers must be paid at least $0.44 per engaged minute + $0.74 per engaged mile, or a minimum of $5 per offer, whichever is greater. For 2025, those rates increase to $0.45/minute, $0.77/mile, or $5.20 per offer. I tried to order 1 pad Thai and 1 curry the other night and it was going to be over $70. Insanity.
- httpsoverdns 1y agoIn most major metros, an entree is easily $25. So paying $50 for your food, $15 for somebody to deliver it to you, and $5 in taxes is really not all that crazy
- mirekrusin 1y agoWhy do you have to pay taxes? You already paid them before salary hit your bank account (~30% in most countries) and anybody who receives your money will pay it as well.
- Eisenstein 1y agoDifferent taxes go to different places, and taxes do not exist only to take money from people. Amongst other reasons, they exist to discourage certain behaviors, pay for externalities, or because the market does not price in the costs of certain things.
- pm90 1y agoYou can’t be a boomtown forever. Seattle is a beautiful city; very desirable to live. Im sure it will be just fine.
- glimshe 1y agoLeaving Seattle 10 years ago was the best decision of my life. Awful weather, high prices, physical isolation, traffic. It had a good job market, though... Without it, I don't know what's left.
- RobCodeSlayer 1y agoAmazing nature, food, and people. Not a whole lot of cities that compete with it in the US.
- huhkerrf 1y agoI never thought I'd hear someone say the people were a plus for Seattle. It's quite famous for being closed off to newcomers.
- relyks 1y agoNah, people are just pretty introverted and you need to try harder and make the first move lol
- xracy 1y agoI feel like this is more of just "seattleites respect people's autonomy." I think a lot of places can be really invasive to outsiders of "what are you doing here?" and I htink Seattle is just more "mind your own business" as a culture. I find this to be refreshing in some ways.
- chrismcb 1y agoI'm curious to know what you consider good weather.
- glimshe 1y agoAnywhere that isn't cold, gray and rainy 8 months of the year. And please don't say "Seattle isn't that rainy in total precipitation volume" - I lived there for close to a decade and know its weather very well. I had never had seasonal depression spells in my life before (or after) living in Seattle.
- reply00r123 1y agoMy read: 1. The tech companies knew an H1B price change was coming 2. They offshored and front-loaded their H1B hiring 3. AI means much smaller teams, they will just hire 01 The damage has been done, American workers are just bag holders.
- alephnerd 1y agoThat's not the right read in my experience. Most companies began opening offices abroad with P/L and roadmap ownership responsibilities during the initial Covid layoffs, because the first employees cut were those on work visas. Despite the stereotypes on this forum, this included a lot of PMs, EMs, and Principal Engineers. When companies began rehiring during the COVID recovery, they began rehiring these former employees, but giving them a significant salary premium while allowing them to open and manage entire offices abroad. On top of that, CEE, Israel, and India all give massive subsidizes and roll the red carpet for companies to open high headcount offices which made it easier to do this move. Now in 2025, you can see the 75th percentile of TCs in India and Romania in the $50k-60k mark and the 90th percentile breaking the $75k-85k mark, so it's not only cheap back office work.
- black_13 1y ago[dead]
- Animats 1y agoAmazon and Microsoft dominate Seattle tech hiring. There are layoffs in the SF bay area, but no company is that dominant. Salesforce has been laying off in a big way. Maybe they'll change their slogan from "No Software" to "No People".