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Apple has on a few occasions in the past come in after people have spent a lot of time and energy developing things and making a small market, figuring out how

Apple has on a few occasions in the past come in after people have spent a lot of time and energy developing things and making a small market, figuring out how it should actually work, making a nice version 1.0 of how it should actually work, making that market explode 100-fold and taking all the money. That smart homes are more trouble than they are worth currently sounds to me like ripe territory for Apple to poach. However not sure if without Jobs and Ive if they can actually do anything like what they used to.

paulryanrogers 1y ago
Was Johnny Ive really a driver of innovation? Or just trading repairabily for vanity metrics?
- DrBenCarson 1y ago
  You tell me, was the iPhone innovative?
  - kjkjadksj 1y ago
    No it was inevitable
    - bryanrasmussen 1y ago
      the inevitable things are the greatest innovations (in the realm of technology)
    - DrBenCarson 1y ago
      Inevitable * in hindsight * Innovation is the introduction of a new paradigm that works so well that people can no longer imagine not having No one was close to the original iPhone at launch and they didn’t really catch up until ~iPhone 12 for truly competitive alternatives
      - kjkjadksj 1y ago
        It was inevitable in the sense the hardware was already available on the wholesale market. People tend to lionize these companies like they forged the phone out of the living earth themselves. Really they just contract with factories that assemble products out of components available on the wholesale market. Sexy OS? You can argue that came mostly from within since that is how that software was developed, in house. But the hardware stack they ordered and had assembled for you? I’m not so sure.
  - paulryanrogers 1y ago
    Was Ive involved in the iPhone creation? Or only its enshittification?
    - dcrazy 1y ago
      When the iPhone was developed, Jony led industrial design but not yet software design.
    - DrBenCarson 1y ago
      Jony owned iPhone hardware design top-to-bottom through development and multiple launches You think he’s glorified for literally nothing?
  - guestbest 1y ago
    The iPhone wasn’t as innovative as the AppStore which didn’t come around until iPhone OS 2. Selling software like music changed everything
    - DrBenCarson 1y ago
      Cool. App Store extended the true innovation which was a fully capable OS in everyone’s pocket App Store doesn’t exist without iPhone just like Windows doesn’t exist without the PC
      - guestbest 1y ago
        Not really. There was a way of slab typed smart phones with capacitance touch screen windows mobile devices and they were more capable than the iPhone with on board GPS, etc. but they didn’t have an integrated App Store, which was the key to customer retention. The first iPhones didn’t have GPS and so the map app wasn’t quiet as capable as the other high end smart phones in the market as it couldn’t do directions properly. It had the best web browser, though. Every other model of high end smart phones quickly adopted the App Store model since it was such an obviously thing to install application directly to the device, but up until it was a major missing feature. All phones at the time required a computer tethered to do the purchase and installation. With the App Store the age of phones needing full general purpose computers was coming to an end. It was a whole cultural shift in software Later they started the iCloud sync so backups could be done ‘in the field’ as well.
      - paulryanrogers 1y ago
        I recall getting apps on my Blackberry and Treo before iPhone existed.
- mgh2 1y ago
  He was a great designer with low business acumen (without Jobs). His realm at Apple began crumbling when he executed a flawed strategy for the Apple watch launch as a fashion item, instead of a technology product geared toward health (Fitbit was 1st). It costed Apple 25M, and seemed like buying advertising from influencers (similar to 23andme launch). I usually value this youtuber's insights, but he has recently been reaching the wrong conclusions: https://youtu.be/JUG1PlqAUJk?si=_Y87UQGdhIo92a7r&t=469 https://youtu.be/JUG1PlqAUJk?si=_Y87UQGdhIo92a7r&t=469
FireBeyond 1y ago
[flagged]
- veidr 1y ago
  A fuck of a lot better than HomePod, LOL! (Context: I have 2 Apple TV devices and 5 HomePod devices in my home, plus one Apple Vision Pro. I only like one of those more than my Pixel 9 Fold.)
  - FireBeyond 1y ago
    I use HomePod Minis solely as Thread/Matter routers, as my home is set up very heavily with HomeKit. I have 2 in areas where I have a bunch of devices but no Apple TVs nearby. So fully invested. But yeah...
- api 1y ago
  The problem isn't that Vision Pro is a bad product. The problem is that it's built for a bad thesis. People don't want VR/AR goggles very much, or at least not many people do, and I think eventually we will stop trying to make this happen. VR/AR has niche applications: gaming, industrial and military AR uses, assistive uses with people who are mobility challenged, education. These are niche uses. Even gaming is a niche-- most gamers have demonstrated that a big-ass monitor is preferred over goggles. Making the goggles better may push this a little but I doubt it's going to lead to a landslide of gaming demand. VR/AR was largely a feature of dystopian sci-fi for a reason, too. Everyone jacking into goggles is dystopian. It's something that would appeal to people if the world got so shitty that you just don't even want to see what's in front of you, but I'd rather us spend our engineering effort making the world not get like that by solving some of our real world problems. I don't think I'm alone here. It might be a good idea for long duration space flight, but personally if I were on a ship on the way to Mars I'd rather read books or hang with my ship mates and talk about the problems we're going to face when we land. If I decided to go into space I'd rather experience life in space -- including the boring parts and the hard parts -- than jack into some kind of VR escape world. I could do that at home.
  - 1y ago

paulryanrogers 1y ago

Was Johnny Ive really a driver of innovation? Or just trading repairabily for vanity metrics?

DrBenCarson 1y ago
You tell me, was the iPhone innovative?
- kjkjadksj 1y ago
  No it was inevitable
  - bryanrasmussen 1y ago
    the inevitable things are the greatest innovations (in the realm of technology)
  - DrBenCarson 1y ago
    Inevitable * in hindsight * Innovation is the introduction of a new paradigm that works so well that people can no longer imagine not having No one was close to the original iPhone at launch and they didn’t really catch up until ~iPhone 12 for truly competitive alternatives
    - kjkjadksj 1y ago
      It was inevitable in the sense the hardware was already available on the wholesale market. People tend to lionize these companies like they forged the phone out of the living earth themselves. Really they just contract with factories that assemble products out of components available on the wholesale market. Sexy OS? You can argue that came mostly from within since that is how that software was developed, in house. But the hardware stack they ordered and had assembled for you? I’m not so sure.
- paulryanrogers 1y ago
  Was Ive involved in the iPhone creation? Or only its enshittification?
  - dcrazy 1y ago
    When the iPhone was developed, Jony led industrial design but not yet software design.
  - DrBenCarson 1y ago
    Jony owned iPhone hardware design top-to-bottom through development and multiple launches You think he’s glorified for literally nothing?
- guestbest 1y ago
  The iPhone wasn’t as innovative as the AppStore which didn’t come around until iPhone OS 2. Selling software like music changed everything
  - DrBenCarson 1y ago
    Cool. App Store extended the true innovation which was a fully capable OS in everyone’s pocket App Store doesn’t exist without iPhone just like Windows doesn’t exist without the PC
    - guestbest 1y ago
      Not really. There was a way of slab typed smart phones with capacitance touch screen windows mobile devices and they were more capable than the iPhone with on board GPS, etc. but they didn’t have an integrated App Store, which was the key to customer retention. The first iPhones didn’t have GPS and so the map app wasn’t quiet as capable as the other high end smart phones in the market as it couldn’t do directions properly. It had the best web browser, though. Every other model of high end smart phones quickly adopted the App Store model since it was such an obviously thing to install application directly to the device, but up until it was a major missing feature. All phones at the time required a computer tethered to do the purchase and installation. With the App Store the age of phones needing full general purpose computers was coming to an end. It was a whole cultural shift in software Later they started the iCloud sync so backups could be done ‘in the field’ as well.
    - paulryanrogers 1y ago
      I recall getting apps on my Blackberry and Treo before iPhone existed.
mgh2 1y ago
He was a great designer with low business acumen (without Jobs). His realm at Apple began crumbling when he executed a flawed strategy for the Apple watch launch as a fashion item, instead of a technology product geared toward health (Fitbit was 1st). It costed Apple 25M, and seemed like buying advertising from influencers (similar to 23andme launch). I usually value this youtuber's insights, but he has recently been reaching the wrong conclusions: https://youtu.be/JUG1PlqAUJk?si=_Y87UQGdhIo92a7r&t=469 https://youtu.be/JUG1PlqAUJk?si=_Y87UQGdhIo92a7r&t=469

FireBeyond 1y ago

[flagged]

veidr 1y ago
A fuck of a lot better than HomePod, LOL! (Context: I have 2 Apple TV devices and 5 HomePod devices in my home, plus one Apple Vision Pro. I only like one of those more than my Pixel 9 Fold.)
- FireBeyond 1y ago
  I use HomePod Minis solely as Thread/Matter routers, as my home is set up very heavily with HomeKit. I have 2 in areas where I have a bunch of devices but no Apple TVs nearby. So fully invested. But yeah...
api 1y ago
The problem isn't that Vision Pro is a bad product. The problem is that it's built for a bad thesis. People don't want VR/AR goggles very much, or at least not many people do, and I think eventually we will stop trying to make this happen. VR/AR has niche applications: gaming, industrial and military AR uses, assistive uses with people who are mobility challenged, education. These are niche uses. Even gaming is a niche-- most gamers have demonstrated that a big-ass monitor is preferred over goggles. Making the goggles better may push this a little but I doubt it's going to lead to a landslide of gaming demand. VR/AR was largely a feature of dystopian sci-fi for a reason, too. Everyone jacking into goggles is dystopian. It's something that would appeal to people if the world got so shitty that you just don't even want to see what's in front of you, but I'd rather us spend our engineering effort making the world not get like that by solving some of our real world problems. I don't think I'm alone here. It might be a good idea for long duration space flight, but personally if I were on a ship on the way to Mars I'd rather read books or hang with my ship mates and talk about the problems we're going to face when we land. If I decided to go into space I'd rather experience life in space -- including the boring parts and the hard parts -- than jack into some kind of VR escape world. I could do that at home.
- 1y ago