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It surprises me that the monied elite seem to have so little awareness of what happens when they keep winning.
by shermantanktop 1y ago
It surprises me that the monied elite seem to have so little awareness of what happens when they keep winning.
- newswasboring 1y agoPlease give me an example of what happens. Edit: before someone throws very strong platitudes at me again, I would like to see real-world examples. Because at least in my lifetime there have been zero consequences for people in power. Edit 2: I've been banned from replying to this thread (lol, talk about power of the state). I guess I didn't define my acceptance criteria properly. But I thought it would be clear that the goal should be uplifting everyone not just shift the money around to someone else. That is what most of the revolutions mentioned in the replies are.
- throwawayoldie 1y agoSome very close haircuts.
- newswasboring 1y agoWhen was the last instance of this in the last 100 years?
- mosburger 1y agoNicolae Ceaușescu comes to mind? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nicolae_Ceau%C8%99escu#Death https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nicolae_Ceau%C8%99escu#Death EDIT: One could argue whether the United Healthcare CEO assassination meets the criteria, too.
- throwawayoldie 1y agohttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethiopia#Derg_era_(1974%E2%80%931991) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethiopia#Derg_era_(1974%E2%80%... comes to mind. So, even if you weren't factually incorrect as well as smug, what's your actual point?
- ModernMech 1y agoThey're the ones trying to bring back feudalism. If they want feudalism, things are going to get... well feudal. The lesson I've learned in the past decade is that people have not changed, at all. People will act as medieval as their circumstances allow.
- shermantanktop 1y agoWhen it goes on just a little too long, it can result in the French Revolution and 1917 and the election of populist candidates with unexpected consequences. So sure, not a given, but it’s a risk that goes up as conditions get worse.
- newswasboring 1y agoFrench revolution I can still see as consequences but Bolsheviks just took land and gave it to the new nobelity (the state).
- kergonath 1y agoThe goalposts somewhat shifted, here. The original point was > It surprises me that the monied elite seem to have so little awareness of what happens when they keep winning. What happened is that the Russian elite ended up dead or penniless in exile. What happened after that is not really relevant to the lot of the blind elite of the ancien régime.
- dragontamer 1y agoThe period after the initial French Revolutions includes a period with an Emperor Napoleon and also a period where King Charles is restored to power. It's like a century of struggle before that whole situation resolved.
- achierius 1y ago> just took land and gave it to the new nobelity (the state). This is unsubstantiated by historical evidence. No new class of "hereditary bureaucrats" emerged to replace the nobility; there was remarkably high movement between workers and officials, and even up to the very end of the Soviet Union, high officials were former day workers who had worked their way up the ranks.
- kergonath 1y ago> Please give me an example of what happens. It’s easy to forget after 80 years of stable western democracies, but brutal equilibrium shifts do happen. There was a revolution every ~20 years in Europe between 1789 and 1917. And even during the 20th century, the history of much of the world is full of coups, revolts, and uprisings. See all the revolutions in ex-soviet republics, the Arab spring, etc. So you can pick and choose between the American independence, the French Revolution, the revolutions of 1848, the Commune, and the soviets, to give you just a couple of examples for which you can find some documentation easily.
- geraldwhen 1y agoModern police and military gear is so advanced that revolution is unrealistic.
- ElFitz 1y agoMaybe. But a modern revolution also doesn’t need physical violence. People in power only have power in so far as others believe and enforce it. The emperor has no clothes.
- kergonath 1y agoIt does not help when part of the military sides with the revolution. Which happened to some extent in just about all of them. It’s never just normal people against the army. Soldiers also have families suffering just like the others. They also see what happens to them when they leave the military and become part of the underclass again. There is a spectrum between not following orders efficiently to just ignoring orders and then open mutiny.
- johnnyanmac 1y agoIf they want to try their hand and unleash the first American genocide in history, that may be the cost for people to wake up. too many cameras and live uploading about to bury hundreds, maybe thousands of citizens being shot down in cold blood.
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- ben_w 1y ago> I would like to see real-world examples. Because at least in my lifetime there have been zero consequences for people in power. Liberia (1980 coup & 1989–2003 wars): Americo-Liberian elite overthrown by indigenous-led coups; cyclical elite purges, executions, and exiles: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1980_Liberian_coup_d%27état https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1980_Liberian_coup_d%27état Argentine Military Junta (1983): generals faced prosecution: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trial_of_the_Juntas https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trial_of_the_Juntas Philippines – Marcos Family (1986): Ousted by "People Power"; Ferdinand Marcos fled, family assets frozen, political exile: https://www.upi.com/Archives/1986/06/17/Judge-orders-Marcos-assets-frozen/9517519364800/ https://www.upi.com/Archives/1986/06/17/Judge-orders-Marcos-... Romania – Ceaușescu Regime (1989): Ceaușescu and wife executed after rapid regime collapse; party elite purged: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trial_and_execution_of_Nicolae_and_Elena_Ceaușescu https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trial_and_execution_of_Nicolae... Rwanda (1994): Hutu elite responsible for genocide overthrown by Tutsi-led RPF, the attempt to seek justice overwhelmed their legal system so hard that it was itself criticised by Amnesty International: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rwandan_genocide#Aftermath https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rwandan_genocide#Aftermath; internationally, there were also trials and convictions: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Criminal_Tribunal_for_Rwanda https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Criminal_Tribuna... Iraq (2003)/Libya (2011): External forces happened, Saddam Hussein got hanged, Muammar Gaddafi's death was the kind of thing people make laws to stop soldiers from doing. And this year, that health insurance CEO who got assassinated, didn't they get their own legal strategy carved onto the bullets or something like that?
- kergonath 1y agoWhat is even more infuriating is that they can keep winning. They just have to stop being arseholes about it and pay lip service to wealth redistribution and social progress. It’s their winner-takes-all fuck-you-got-mine mentality that is pouring fuel on the fire
- rapind 1y agoThat's probably why "old money" doesn't like "new money". New money is crass, loud, and obnoxious. Old money knows that it's best to keep to the shadows, at least until one of their idiot kids ruins it. I think the inability for people to control themselves, while probably our greatest weakness, is also what often saves us. The greed goes too far and then there's a massive backlash (revolution). Technology is trying to neuter any potential backlash though. I mean who can be bothered with a revolution while there's youtubes to watch and AIs doing everything for you! I'm still optimistic we'll smarten up eventually.
- assword 1y ago> That's probably why "old money" doesn't like "new money". New money is crass, loud, and obnoxious. Old money knows that it's best to keep to the shadows, at least until one of their idiot kids ruins it. I suspect that’s why I’ve seen more serious monarchists than I ever have before.
- throaway5454 1y ago"old money" tended to come with the assumption that you'd operate with a bit of noblesse oblige.
- immibis 1y agoEvidence says they can keep winning without being nice. I trust evidence.
- mingus88 1y agoI’m not that surprised. To reach the level of billionaire, it’s pretty much a requirement that you abandon all empathy and ethics. What’s surprising is that nobody in their circle has educated them on the concept of a win-win. These people could be folk heros, universally loved and respected in ways buying a social media platform and banning all the haters will never accomplish.
- QuercusMax 1y agoThat's what's so incredibly stupid about the tariffs, immigration crackdowns, etc. Life is not a zero-sum game, and treating it like it is just makes it worse for everyone - unless you're the sort of person who really gets off on having other suffer worse than you.
- AyyWS 1y agoWhat society or culture survived by taking the high road? I'm reminded of Princess Leia's quote: No! Alderaan is peaceful, we have no weapons.
- mejutoco 1y agoNorway s sovereign fund seems like one instance.
- alistairSH 1y agoLife isn't a sci-fi movie.
- ben_w 1y agoThe high (moral) road doesn't preclude self-defence, it precludes sadism and zero-sum thinking.
- throwawayoldie 1y agoSwitzerland.
- rightbyte 1y ago
- LightBug1 1y agoThey've refined the art of turning the majority against themselves to an almost exquisite level.
- rwmj 1y agoThey're getting NZ citizenship & building bunkers, so I guess they do know, but believe they can ride it out.
- panarky 1y agohttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Herbert_Stein#Stein's_Law https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Herbert_Stein#Stein's_Law Nobody knows when. But it's useful to think about how.