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$24 billion in American taxpayer money went to Israel in 2024, or about $65M/day. That's 32 equivalent of those. Each and every day. And this is what enables bu

$24 billion in American taxpayer money went to Israel in 2024, or about $65M/day. That's 32 equivalent of those. Each and every day. And this is what enables burying/killing a wide ranging, unknowable number (60k-200k?) of humans, half of whom were children, by systematic aerial bombardment using 2000 lbs. unguided Mk. 84's into urban areas and terrestrial structural demolitions, forced concentration/ethnic cleansing, and engineered famine by siege. Not all Israelis and Americans are okay with this, but protesting so far hasn't made much difference.

4gotunameagain 1y ago
[flagged]
- apples_oranges 1y ago
  Regardless of "truth" or whatever your opinion or my opinion is, in terms of PR Israel seems not to be able to influence the outcome in their favour. I want to be totally impartial and neutral - if that were only possible - and think about why that is so.
  - 4gotunameagain 1y ago
    It is not a matter of opinion, it is widely documented that Israel is blocking any external aid or journalists in Gaza. And yes, at least it gives some hope that there is still widespread outcry against the atrocities they are committing. Maybe we still have a sliver of humanity left in us amongst all the individualism and profiteering. (except Germany of course, where protests against the war crimes committed by Israel are routinely dismantled. Two wrongs don't make a right Germany.)
  - msgodel 1y ago
    Good fences make good neighbors. Maybe they should try to have our state more distanced from theirs. People might be more friendly if they feel they have some say in the situation.
- Gothmog69 1y ago
  [dead]
jillesvangurp 1y ago
That's a misconception about military aid. That money is flowing straight back to US defense companies. It's not actually costing the US; it's profiting from this. And it's not actually tax payer money but freshly minted dollars that are created through debt. Nobody is getting taxed "extra" to pay for all this. If you strip away all the moralism and suffering, the conflicts (plural) in the middle east and increasingly Ukraine are all about keeping the defense industry and the economy going. Same with Ukraine. Same with just about any other conflict where countries like the US supply the weapons.
- ozgrakkurt 1y ago
  You mean they are funneling their citizens’ money into some private corporations, and killing a decent number of children while doing it? Edit: they are helping to kill the children, they are not doing it themselves
- burnt-resistor 1y ago
  Doesn't change the end result, but it paints a moral dimension on those who actively profit from the deaths of imprisoned civilians. The money goes into the pockets of the owners of mostly American defense contractors' owners, arms leave for conflict zones, and mostly civilians where Gaza is concerned get made homeless, injured, or flee for tent cities, only to be pushed around again. Conflating Ukraine with Gaza is genocide-denial gaslighting.
- rlt 1y ago
  > And it's not actually tax payer money but freshly minted dollars that are created through debt Minting dollars is a form of taxation (albeit one partially paid by foreign entities that hold dollars)
- simonh 1y ago
  This is the US devoting resources to do one thing, build things go bang abroad, instead of doing other things like building/renewing infrastructure or providing services to citizens. So, that is a cost. The question is what are the benefits. In Ukraine I can see that, in Israel it’s got a lot more messy.
ponector 1y ago
If numbers are unknown, how can you claim half of them are children? Ps: Ukrainian army has better use for ammo than Israel. Should have sent there
- burnt-resistor 1y ago
  Very simple. Demographics of the populace. Median age is around 18-19.
- giardini 1y ago
  So you prefer us assisting the killing of Russian soldiers rather than the killing of Hamas soldiers?
  - ponector 1y ago
    Right. To help an ally to defend against unprovoked invasion. Punish the bully, keep global peace.
  - Xss3 1y ago
    Who wouldn't? Its a far more morally justifiable position to hold. Ukraine deserves freedom from Russian strikes on their civilians.
  - Aeolun 1y ago
    I think I prefer a war fought between soldier to one fought between bombers and children.
- Aeolun 1y ago
  It’s not all the numbers that are unknown, but so many are still buried beneath rubble that the scope of death isn’t clear. The numbers that are known are depressing enough.
pjc50 1y ago
"Every gun that is made, every warship launched, every rocket fired signifies, in the final sense, a theft from those who hunger and are not fed, those who are cold and are not clothed. This world in arms is not spending money alone. It is spending the sweat of its laborers, the genius of its scientists, the hopes of its children. The cost of one modern heavy bomber is this: a modern brick school in more than 30 cities. It is two electric power plants, each serving a town of 60,000 population. It is two fine, fully equipped hospitals. It is some fifty miles of concrete pavement. We pay for a single fighter with a half-million bushels of wheat. We pay for a single destroyer with new homes that could have housed more than 8,000 people... This is not a way of life at all, in any true sense. Under the cloud of threatening war, it is humanity hanging from a cross of iron." -- notorious antifa leftist Dwight D Eisenhower
- OldfieldFund 1y ago
  "War is a racket. It always has been. It is possibly the oldest, easily the most profitable, surely the most vicious. It is the only one international in scope. It is the only one in which the profits are reckoned in dollars and the losses in lives." -- Smedley Butler, a United States Marine Corps Major General and, at the time of his death, the most decorated Marine in U.S. history.
- Ey7NFZ3P0nzAe 1y ago
  Thanks didn't know about that speech: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chance_for_Peace_speech https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chance_for_Peace_speech
- Aeolun 1y ago
  But then, if you were in Gaza right now and consider how many buildings/lives might have been saved by the existence of a whole bunch of air-to-air or ground-to-air missiles to trash bombers with, you start to wonder if having these things for the moment you need them might not make a lot of sense. Similar story for Ukraine. The only thing the missile has to do is be cheaper than the bomber it’ll destroy. To be cheaper than the infrastructure that can’t be bombed into dust because the bomber was destroyed by the missile. Taken in that light they suddenly seem pretty cheap.
stuaxo 1y ago
A lot of it going back to American arms cos, so a subsidy of industry. Now, imagine that money going to American infrastructure and health.

4gotunameagain 1y ago

[flagged]

apples_oranges 1y ago
Regardless of "truth" or whatever your opinion or my opinion is, in terms of PR Israel seems not to be able to influence the outcome in their favour. I want to be totally impartial and neutral - if that were only possible - and think about why that is so.
- 4gotunameagain 1y ago
  It is not a matter of opinion, it is widely documented that Israel is blocking any external aid or journalists in Gaza. And yes, at least it gives some hope that there is still widespread outcry against the atrocities they are committing. Maybe we still have a sliver of humanity left in us amongst all the individualism and profiteering. (except Germany of course, where protests against the war crimes committed by Israel are routinely dismantled. Two wrongs don't make a right Germany.)
- msgodel 1y ago
  Good fences make good neighbors. Maybe they should try to have our state more distanced from theirs. People might be more friendly if they feel they have some say in the situation.
Gothmog69 1y ago
[dead]

jillesvangurp 1y ago

That's a misconception about military aid. That money is flowing straight back to US defense companies. It's not actually costing the US; it's profiting from this. And it's not actually tax payer money but freshly minted dollars that are created through debt. Nobody is getting taxed "extra" to pay for all this. If you strip away all the moralism and suffering, the conflicts (plural) in the middle east and increasingly Ukraine are all about keeping the defense industry and the economy going. Same with Ukraine. Same with just about any other conflict where countries like the US supply the weapons.

ozgrakkurt 1y ago
You mean they are funneling their citizens’ money into some private corporations, and killing a decent number of children while doing it? Edit: they are helping to kill the children, they are not doing it themselves
burnt-resistor 1y ago
Doesn't change the end result, but it paints a moral dimension on those who actively profit from the deaths of imprisoned civilians. The money goes into the pockets of the owners of mostly American defense contractors' owners, arms leave for conflict zones, and mostly civilians where Gaza is concerned get made homeless, injured, or flee for tent cities, only to be pushed around again. Conflating Ukraine with Gaza is genocide-denial gaslighting.
rlt 1y ago
> And it's not actually tax payer money but freshly minted dollars that are created through debt Minting dollars is a form of taxation (albeit one partially paid by foreign entities that hold dollars)
simonh 1y ago
This is the US devoting resources to do one thing, build things go bang abroad, instead of doing other things like building/renewing infrastructure or providing services to citizens. So, that is a cost. The question is what are the benefits. In Ukraine I can see that, in Israel it’s got a lot more messy.

ponector 1y ago

If numbers are unknown, how can you claim half of them are children? Ps: Ukrainian army has better use for ammo than Israel. Should have sent there

burnt-resistor 1y ago
Very simple. Demographics of the populace. Median age is around 18-19.
giardini 1y ago
So you prefer us assisting the killing of Russian soldiers rather than the killing of Hamas soldiers?
- ponector 1y ago
  Right. To help an ally to defend against unprovoked invasion. Punish the bully, keep global peace.
- Xss3 1y ago
  Who wouldn't? Its a far more morally justifiable position to hold. Ukraine deserves freedom from Russian strikes on their civilians.
- Aeolun 1y ago
  I think I prefer a war fought between soldier to one fought between bombers and children.
Aeolun 1y ago
It’s not all the numbers that are unknown, but so many are still buried beneath rubble that the scope of death isn’t clear. The numbers that are known are depressing enough.

pjc50 1y ago

"Every gun that is made, every warship launched, every rocket fired signifies, in the final sense, a theft from those who hunger and are not fed, those who are cold and are not clothed. This world in arms is not spending money alone. It is spending the sweat of its laborers, the genius of its scientists, the hopes of its children. The cost of one modern heavy bomber is this: a modern brick school in more than 30 cities. It is two electric power plants, each serving a town of 60,000 population. It is two fine, fully equipped hospitals. It is some fifty miles of concrete pavement. We pay for a single fighter with a half-million bushels of wheat. We pay for a single destroyer with new homes that could have housed more than 8,000 people... This is not a way of life at all, in any true sense. Under the cloud of threatening war, it is humanity hanging from a cross of iron." -- notorious antifa leftist Dwight D Eisenhower

OldfieldFund 1y ago
"War is a racket. It always has been. It is possibly the oldest, easily the most profitable, surely the most vicious. It is the only one international in scope. It is the only one in which the profits are reckoned in dollars and the losses in lives." -- Smedley Butler, a United States Marine Corps Major General and, at the time of his death, the most decorated Marine in U.S. history.
Ey7NFZ3P0nzAe 1y ago
Thanks didn't know about that speech: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chance_for_Peace_speech https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chance_for_Peace_speech
Aeolun 1y ago
But then, if you were in Gaza right now and consider how many buildings/lives might have been saved by the existence of a whole bunch of air-to-air or ground-to-air missiles to trash bombers with, you start to wonder if having these things for the moment you need them might not make a lot of sense. Similar story for Ukraine. The only thing the missile has to do is be cheaper than the bomber it’ll destroy. To be cheaper than the infrastructure that can’t be bombed into dust because the bomber was destroyed by the missile. Taken in that light they suddenly seem pretty cheap.

stuaxo 1y ago

A lot of it going back to American arms cos, so a subsidy of industry. Now, imagine that money going to American infrastructure and health.