6 ms·

Obama didn't do anything (other than follow the law at the time): https://web.archive.org/web/20141224180231/https://foreignpolicy.com/2011/10/25/will-congress

Obama didn't do anything (other than follow the law at the time): https://web.archive.org/web/20141224180231/https://foreignpolicy.com/2011/10/25/will-congresss-defunding-of-the-u-n-over-palestine-hurt-u-s-goals-around-the-world/ https://web.archive.org/web/20141224180231/https://foreignpo...

tolerance 1y ago
So would it be fair to say that this is just a reiteration of a 30+ year-long trend. Edit: 40+ year-long trend? https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44648359 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44648359 https://babel.hathitrust.org/cgi/pt?id=pst.000012506323&seq=1 https://babel.hathitrust.org/cgi/pt?id=pst.000012506323&seq=...
hackyhacky 1y ago
The is a good point: the decision was made by Congress, not by Obama. Although I disagree with that decision, that is the correct way to make it. Now, Trump is withdrawing unilaterally, without Congressional approval. Remember when presidents followed the law?
- CWuestefeld 1y ago
  I've been complaining about the increasing power being ceded to the Presidency, like, forever now. This isn't specifically a GOP or DEM thing, it's been happening consistently at least since FDR, and probably even beyond that. That said, the one area where the Constitution really does give the President a fairly free hand is in foreign policy.
  - nonethewiser 1y ago
    And congress increasingly wanting to do nothing.
    - CWuestefeld 1y ago
      I think it's a little more subtle. It's not that they want to do nothing. It's that they're terrified of being seen to have done something, if for some reason that thing turns out to be a mistake. For all the talk about wanting to do things scientifically, there's a remarkable lack of willingness to actually experiment. If a failed experiment is fatal, then we'll never do anything, bad or good.
- saelthavron 1y ago
  Was the law repealed?
- nonethewiser 1y ago
  You seem to be conflating two things. That Obama was bound by law to withhold funds, and that the president cannot leave UNESCO unilaterally. The president in fact can just withdraw as the commander in chief and head of foreign policy, and they have withdrawn already in 1984 (Reagan) and 2017 (Trump).
cooper_ganglia 1y ago
Sure, it was a Democrat president enforcing laws passed by a Democrat-controlled House and Senate in 1990 and 1994, under at least one Democrat president. There are no real "sides" when it comes to the U.S. and Israel. Every party bends the knee and kisses the wall. It’s one big club, and we’re not in it.
- csours 1y ago
  Excuses and explanations can feel the same. I do not intend this to be an excuse, but a partial explanation. Before the assassination of Yitzhak Rabin, there was a feeling of a possibility of peace in some form; in this context, those laws could be viewed as the stick of a carrot and stick approach. At this point in time, you can make your own determination about how that has worked out.
  - amendegree 1y ago
    Because Israel alone bears all the responsibility for the lack of peace in the region… it’s not like these people are perpetually looking for war
- rafram 1y ago
  > It’s one big club, and we’re not in it. I’m not sure what you’re trying to imply here, but like it or not, most Americans do support Israel.
  - jpadkins 1y ago
    it's a reference to a famous George Carlin skit.
  - cooper_ganglia 1y ago
    That's no longer true, nor should it be: https://www.pewresearch.org/short-reads/2025/04/08/how-americans-view-israel-and-the-israel-hamas-war-at-the-start-of-trumps-second-term/ https://www.pewresearch.org/short-reads/2025/04/08/how-ameri... From the article: >The public’s views of Israel have turned more negative over the past three years. More than half of U.S. adults (53%) now express an unfavorable opinion of Israel, up from 42% in March 2022 It turns out when you invade a country and commit a genocide, you become less popular. Putin figured that out. Hitler figured that out. Netanyahu’s still mulling it over.

tolerance 1y ago

So would it be fair to say that this is just a reiteration of a 30+ year-long trend. Edit: 40+ year-long trend? https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44648359 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44648359 https://babel.hathitrust.org/cgi/pt?id=pst.000012506323&seq=1 https://babel.hathitrust.org/cgi/pt?id=pst.000012506323&seq=...

hackyhacky 1y ago

The is a good point: the decision was made by Congress, not by Obama. Although I disagree with that decision, that is the correct way to make it. Now, Trump is withdrawing unilaterally, without Congressional approval. Remember when presidents followed the law?

CWuestefeld 1y ago
I've been complaining about the increasing power being ceded to the Presidency, like, forever now. This isn't specifically a GOP or DEM thing, it's been happening consistently at least since FDR, and probably even beyond that. That said, the one area where the Constitution really does give the President a fairly free hand is in foreign policy.
- nonethewiser 1y ago
  And congress increasingly wanting to do nothing.
  - CWuestefeld 1y ago
    I think it's a little more subtle. It's not that they want to do nothing. It's that they're terrified of being seen to have done something, if for some reason that thing turns out to be a mistake. For all the talk about wanting to do things scientifically, there's a remarkable lack of willingness to actually experiment. If a failed experiment is fatal, then we'll never do anything, bad or good.
saelthavron 1y ago
Was the law repealed?
nonethewiser 1y ago
You seem to be conflating two things. That Obama was bound by law to withhold funds, and that the president cannot leave UNESCO unilaterally. The president in fact can just withdraw as the commander in chief and head of foreign policy, and they have withdrawn already in 1984 (Reagan) and 2017 (Trump).

cooper_ganglia 1y ago

Sure, it was a Democrat president enforcing laws passed by a Democrat-controlled House and Senate in 1990 and 1994, under at least one Democrat president. There are no real "sides" when it comes to the U.S. and Israel. Every party bends the knee and kisses the wall. It’s one big club, and we’re not in it.

csours 1y ago
Excuses and explanations can feel the same. I do not intend this to be an excuse, but a partial explanation. Before the assassination of Yitzhak Rabin, there was a feeling of a possibility of peace in some form; in this context, those laws could be viewed as the stick of a carrot and stick approach. At this point in time, you can make your own determination about how that has worked out.
- amendegree 1y ago
  Because Israel alone bears all the responsibility for the lack of peace in the region… it’s not like these people are perpetually looking for war
rafram 1y ago
> It’s one big club, and we’re not in it. I’m not sure what you’re trying to imply here, but like it or not, most Americans do support Israel.
- jpadkins 1y ago
  it's a reference to a famous George Carlin skit.
- cooper_ganglia 1y ago
  That's no longer true, nor should it be: https://www.pewresearch.org/short-reads/2025/04/08/how-americans-view-israel-and-the-israel-hamas-war-at-the-start-of-trumps-second-term/ https://www.pewresearch.org/short-reads/2025/04/08/how-ameri... From the article: >The public’s views of Israel have turned more negative over the past three years. More than half of U.S. adults (53%) now express an unfavorable opinion of Israel, up from 42% in March 2022 It turns out when you invade a country and commit a genocide, you become less popular. Putin figured that out. Hitler figured that out. Netanyahu’s still mulling it over.