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The fact the average Japanese person won't even consider trying imported Japonica rice from Australia or USA is madness if budget is a consideration. But as so

by kondro 1y ago

The fact the average Japanese person won't even consider trying imported Japonica rice from Australia or USA is madness if budget is a consideration. But as someone who's tried many varieties of Japonica, there is a difference between the best Japan-grown rice and non-speciality rice grown elsewhere, as well as a difference between fresh (Japanese enjoy eating new rice, which is different from many rice-eating cultures) and old rice. I pay somewhere around AUD$14/kg for Japanese rice in Australia, but I also don't eat it that often and I'm not that price sensitive. But also, the average Japanese eats around 1kg of uncooked rice per week. That's ¥800 at the rates in the article (~USD$300/year). Japan's cost of living is generally pretty low, but I doubt +/- $100/year is effecting many people.

daedrdev 1y ago
Japan forces this to be the case with extremely high tariffs on rice imports. It's not that they won't consider it, they literally can't.
- balanced2 1y ago
  I see cal-rose for shy above 3000 yen. While I didn't grasp the details, I saw a news report which made it seems they've set up a quota (xx tons or something) of rice to be imported with almost no tariffs.
  - daedrdev 1y ago
    That sounds possible, I can get premium calrose at 4.5kg for 20$, which adjusted to be 5kg is like 3200 yen or it could be regular quality calrose marked up, I can get that for half the premium price so equivalent of 1600 yen.
- Dylanlacey 1y ago
  I'm not sure tarrifs have a huge impact; Japan is Australia's largest buyer of rice, importing $63.8MUSD worth in 2023 per the OEC: https://oec.world/en/profile/bilateral-product/rice/reporter/aus https://oec.world/en/profile/bilateral-product/rice/reporter.... That's a lot of rice to buy, if it's more expensive and less desirable then domestic rice.
  - freetime2 1y ago
    > The government imports 770,000 tons of rice tariff-free annually under its minimum access quota, and places up to 100,000 tons of that up for auction. Private-sector imports, which are separate from that framework, are subject to a tariff of 341 yen ($2.35) per kilogram, a measure intended to protect domestic producers. [1] Since 1995 Japan has been forced by the WTO to import a certain amount of rice tariff-free every year. Much of it doesn't even go to Japanese consumers, but rather to animal feed and strategic reserves. Prior to 2024, virtually all imported rice in Japan was imported to satisfy this requirement. Presumably that also includes the $63M of rice imported from Australia in 2023. The tariffs do indeed have a massive impact, and until recently it was very difficult for consumers to even find imported rice in supermarkets. [1] https://archive.is/0heNf#selection-2761.52-2761.373 https://archive.is/0heNf#selection-2761.52-2761.373
  - arein3 1y ago
    Japan is forced to buy it as per some kind of trade agreement, and then stores it until it is fed to livestock
balanced2 1y ago
From what I've seen at the supermarket, cal-rose, rice from California does sell out and get restocked with reasonable quantity. While I can't be sure it's "average Japanese people" buying it I see no reason to believe otherwise. It's been shown on TV a few times too, the sure-fire average marketing in Japan.
mc3301 1y ago
Honestly, I think the average Japanese person wouldn't care that much after they tried it a few times. Especially upon noting the significant monthly savings. There's almost no imported rice even available here, and the propaganda of the superiority of domestic rice is quite powerful.
- jjangkke 1y ago
  does it have the same sticky/wet/chewy texture that Japanese rice is famous for ? the rice demand in Japan is extremely inelastic, they would rather eat less than consume foreign brands, and a lot of this comes from the trust they have in their industries. hardly something to ridicule Japan or suggest they depart from their cultural values.
  - kondro 1y ago
    I know that Australian-grown Japonica does, although I don't think produces in Australia care about taste (which is why I buy Japanese rice). But when the average bowl of rice is smothered in curry, demi-glace or egg, soy & sugar I don't think you could tell.
    - Dylanlacey 1y ago
      What I want to know is, what's happening to all the Australian rice they do import? Are the statistics lumping all varieties together, are we only selling them Basmati?
  - balanced2 1y ago
    The tv reporting on cal-rose did point out it's a bit less starchy, but still good. Similar reporting on the strategic reserve rice pointed out it's a bit more crunchy but still good. Someone on TV saying it's still good is pretty strong marketing and seems to be contributing to sales of imported rice. It'll be interesting to see how this goes once things settle down, especially if tariff-free rice quotas stick around.
    - 1y ago
Hasnep 1y ago
> the average Japanese eats around 1kg of uncooked rice per week. That's gonna be crunchy
- chii 1y ago
  just in case people dont understand, the dry weight of rice is what gets measured.
  - cjrp 1y ago
    I'm glad you've explained that because I genuinely thought it was being eaten raw. I guess it's more like they eat the _equivalent_ of 1kg of uncooked rice.
    - chii 1y ago
      The grandparent poster used a strange way to word it - you dont normally call it uncooked rice in this context! It's like saying people eat 1kg of raw flour when they're talking about bread consumption.
- IAmBroom 1y ago
  The shittiest bowl of GrapeNuts ever.
creakingstairs 1y ago
At least for supermarkets around me they _only_ sell Japanese rice. You’d have to buy online or drive out which doesn’t work for vast majority of old population. Also as an East Asian I can somewhat understand reluctance to change rice. It’s just such a staple in your daily life. If I had eaten one type of rice for my entire life (and the price of the rice has remained stable for the last 40 years) and suddenly I can’t afford that type of rice, it would be a shock.
- kondro 1y ago
  There are so many restaurants that talk about using the best rice in Japan. On asking them where it comes from and it's always either local to the restaurant, or to the prefecture the owner grew up in. There's a lot of local patriotism for rice in Japan, I even find it admirable most of the time. Rice price is obviously important and probably linked pretty highly with inflation numbers in Japan. It's price is currently being artificially manipulated higher by JA, and that sucks. But I think ultimately most of these articles and even the local discourse with other Japanese is just a socially acceptable topic to grumble about.
  - numpad0 1y ago
    Rice patriotism in Japan is just result of politically motivated and generally unpopular gen-tan policy spectacularly backfiring. The price is not artificially inflated, at least not by JA, it's just result of forcing rice to be uneconomical in the market where people just buys rice no matter what. As supply is decreased artificially and price increases in response, unit price rose and so did quality. As result of quality increased artificially although indirectly, imports unaffected by local market further lost competitiveness. I bet Japan's going to be internally forced to expand rice exports, not imports. Farmers must pay bills or else they go away, and people aren't going to eat imports. So farmers has to stay by either completely subsidized a la defense production, or by scaling out at paces permanently exceeding inflation. Maybe both. Extra production has to go somewhere but population is on decline, so it has to go somewhere beyond the seas. Unless iPhone moment happens and the country's hit by vastly superior rice, which iOS was - iPhone had worse hardware with worse integration than any of local phones back then, but UI/UX was literally 5-10 years ahead of everything else, and it completely replaced the entire Japanese phone market helped by blatantly illegal marketing tactics. That's not happening so far with rice.
angst 1y ago
I'm curious if anyone has noticed a significant taste difference between Japonica rice and those imported from China, Korea, or Vietnam. Is one generally considered better tasting than the others?
- rubansk 1y ago
  my mum once bought "japanese rice" from the supermarket that tasted noticeably different (and worse). had to check the label, turns out it was made in Vietnam.
- RJIb8RBYxzAMX9u 1y ago
  > I'm curious if anyone has noticed a significant taste difference between Japonica rice and those imported from China, Korea, or Vietnam. Yes, but it's like somewhere between mineral water and coffee. That is, most can tell the difference when directly compared, and may even prefer one over the other, but in many cases they are interchangeable. > Is one generally considered better tasting than the others? IMHO, no, but you tend to prefer the type you eat most often. Going back to the coffee analogy, most people have a roast / style they prefer, but few would claim that it's better.
  - fc417fc802 1y ago
    Isn't that likely to be the other way around? You tend to eat most often that which you prefer? Granted familiarity itself can play a role when considering something unfamiliar. But when it comes to both rice and coffee I purchase what I do because I significantly preferred it to the variants I tried before it.
    - RJIb8RBYxzAMX9u 1y ago
      I don't think so, because there are too many things, but not enough time in life to find out your true preferences for them all, so we all are (to varying degree of) indifferent to most things, and focus on only a few things we truly care about. For you, it's coffee and rice; for others, it may be monitor latency and keyboard switches. I'd used coffee as an analogy, because it's something that almost everyone drinks, has many varieties, but most generally aren't too picky about it. Alas, I'd underestimated the population overlap between HN readers and picky coffee drinkers. :-P
azinman2 1y ago
Not always a smart choice: https://www.japanfs.org/sp/en/news/archives/news_id032147.html https://www.japanfs.org/sp/en/news/archives/news_id032147.ht...
rtpg 1y ago
> I pay somewhere around AUD$14/kg for Japanese rice in Australia a 10kg bag of (AU-grown) koshihikari at Hanaromart (some Asian supermarket) is around 43 AUD right now IIRC. Could I tell the difference in blind tasting between it and just "normal" koshihikari off the shelf off a Japanese supermarket? Maybe, but maybe not. Not an argument for removing trade barriers, but the gap right now seems pretty stark. I do feel like it's worth thinking about how you're saying 800 yen, but that might be per person. So for a 3-person family that's almost ~120k JPY per year. If you could cut that down to 90k JPY per year thats an extra 2500 JPY per month you can spend on food. If you're the kind of person who only goes to the discount shops, an extra 2500 JPY per month can go a decent way on food. If you are on a pretty strict/limited food budget that 2500 JPY could go a long way. Though of course like with eggs, etc, all food prices are just more obvious as well. And Japan has had really nasty inflation with energy + the weakening yen as well, so this is yet another thing that saps away at a budget where you're probably not saving that much to begin with.
- kondro 1y ago
  As mentioned, I've done taste tests across various options and I can definitely tell the difference, which is why I pay more. But as I also said, I can afford to pay more. I don't think the average Japanese is going to be effected. But as I mentioned, if you're budget conscious, not even considering non-Japanese rice is ridiculous.
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  - teruakohatu 1y ago
    > As mentioned, I've done taste tests across various options and I can definitely tell the difference, which is why I pay more. Can you tell the difference between Japanese brands or only between Japanese and non Japanese origin rice? Is rice a significant percentage of food cost in Japan? Coming from a culture that uses less rice, the cost of price verses the cost of protein makes it just about a rounding error when cooking. Now butter on the other hand has just about become a luxury good in New Zealand when it was once cheap, plentiful and extremely high quality.
YouMeWeThem 1y ago
I got Calrose about a month back for just over 3000 yen, which is slightly cheaper than the homegrown stuff. The issue is that a year ago the homegrown stuff was going for 1500 yen.
pezezin 1y ago
> The fact the average Japanese person won't even consider trying imported Japonica rice from Australia or USA is madness if budget is a consideration. I live in Japan, and my girlfriend is an atypical Japanese that doesn't like rice that much. For her, the madness is that people here won't even consider other sources of carbs like pasta, potatoes, or bread.
- teruakohatu 1y ago
  I am not Japanese, and don’t eat a lot of rice (twice a week maybe), but I don’t think it’s madness. If you told me to eat rice instead of bread I would probably be just as horrified
  - robertlagrant 1y ago
    While I'm English with some Indian leanings, I think it's potatoes > rice > bread > naan bread.
    - teruakohatu 1y ago
      Are those “>” greater than signs or arrows? Neither English nor Indian and I would rate Naan bread right at the top if I had a choice.
- wkat4242 1y ago
  But yakisoba is pasta/noodles right? Or is that a dish more tailored to Western? I've never been to Japan, I'm just wondering.
  - Dylanlacey 1y ago
    Yes, it is, and no, it's very much to the Japanese taste. There's no absence of non-rice main meals in Japan; Wafu pasta is an entire category of Japanese pasta dishes whose name literally means Japanese Style Pasta. Udon, Ramen and Soba abound, and Kansai in particular has a large number of Konamon, flour-based meals and snacks (resulting from Allied food aid after the bombings). In some ways, the reaction to suggestions of swapping out rice are like that redneck uncle of yours who is mad his Cardiologist told him to cut down on red meat because "what else am I supposed to eat?!" even though his wife does all the cooking and they already have pork/chicken/fish 3 nights out of 7. It's an identity thing; in some ways to eat rice is to _be_ Japanese.
lovich 1y ago
Their rice imports have risen by 2 orders of magnitude from 126 tons a year to over 10k tons already[1] I don’t know if that is a drop in the bucket compared to their total consumption but their does appear to be an increasing appetite for foreign rice at the price points Japan is currently experiencing [1] https://asia.nikkei.com/Business/Agriculture/Japan-s-May-rice-imports-surge-as-companies-shrug-off-heavy-tariff https://asia.nikkei.com/Business/Agriculture/Japan-s-May-ric...
- kondro 1y ago
  But to put that in perspective, 10k tons is still only around the consumption for around 2.3m people, or less than 2% of the population.
  - lovich 1y ago
    Yea that totally fits in as this not really moving the needles, but at least on person in Japan has realized the market inefficiency and is capitalizing on it, which was main point to the comment I was replying to
skhr0680 1y ago
> The fact the average Japanese person won't even consider trying imported Japonica rice from Australia or USA is madness if budget is a consideration. Domestic rice is a national security concern, not a financial one. Being fed by another country, even an ally, can turn pear-shaped very quickly. Is it that hard to imagine Trump threatening to starve Japan if they don't bow to his demands?* > But also, the average Japanese eats around 1kg of uncooked rice per week. That's ¥800 at the rates in the article (~USD$300/year). Japan's cost of living is generally pretty low, but I doubt +/- $100/year is effecting many people. Why the doubt? The average price of rice literally doubled YoY. For families that can be hundreds of dollars per month (yen equivalent) that they have to pull out of thin air, and that's in a country where the median wage is half of Australia. * Yes, Japan already imports over half of its food, but rice is where the government decided to draw the line in the sand.
- sunnyam 1y ago
  You don't even need to consider an ally being a bad actor. When Ukraine was invaded, wheat prices (to name one) in Europe shot up. England in particular has fairly significant food security challenges.
ianpenney 1y ago
…And how much time have you spent in Japan if I may ask?
- deleted 1y ago
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bamboozled 1y ago
How is eating rice from years old storage "eating fresh rice"? This rice in Japan is cheap because it's coming out of storage.
Saigonautica 1y ago
Oh, this brings back memories. I agree, the Japanese-grown rice in Japan is definitely different than the imported stuff. I used to buy the rice grown in Fukushima prefecture because it was sold at a significant discount, during the short and financially disastrous period where I tried to immigrate there.
decimalenough 1y ago
Fun fact: in feudal Japan, taxes and income were measured in koku of rice (approx 150 kg), which is roughly how much a person needed to sustain themselves for a year. The little plastic cup that comes with your rice cooker measures one gō, which is 1/1000th of a koku.
- IAmBroom 1y ago
  Interesting. I am assuming that is nominally "one ordinary peasant's rice consumption", not "enough rice to live on". One gō appears to be about 5 ounces/150 grams, and that is about 550 calories, or 25% of a nominal daily calorie need. One can quibble with the exact numbers - smaller stature Japanese feudal peasants, but heavier physical demands, etc. It works out to 25% of the calorie need, ironically close to the amount supplied by beer in an estimate of a European medieval monastery.
  - reverendsteveii 1y ago
    it's reasonable to assume that this represents the amount of rice japan should allocate per-peasant in a functioning economy with other food sources. it would be meaningless and absurd to develop a standard for the amount of rice one would need in a year if and only if rice was the sole food source in their universe. In fact I'd be willing to bet there's no amount of rice that would keep a person alive for a year if that's all they ate.
  - hyghjiyhu 1y ago
    Divided by 1000, not 365. So they eat just shy of 3 such portions a day.
  - Nasrudith 1y ago
    Well Japanese peasants were also encouraged to live off of 'lesser' grains like millet, barley, and wheat. Let alone the other nutritionally imporant but non calorically-dense supplements like vegetables.
boruto 1y ago
I don't think it is simple to eat a different rice under normal circumstances once you are used to it. In my case even something which is staple variety 200 km away
- grues-dinner 1y ago
  Maybe this is my millennial spoiled-for-choice nature, but that seems very strange to me. Though certainly it was (is?) similar in older generations here (overheard in the 80s: "pasta? no, no, we don't eat that foreign muck, it's meat and two veg in my house"). But if I lived somewhere where there are noticeable varieties of rice with local characters, it seems more fun to at least be open to trying them rather than stick with one for my life. Same with fresh pasta variations, olives etc in Italy, say. Even for things like bread and coffee, I'll usually buy different kinds just to mix things up. Sourdough and Columbian today, rye and Ethiopian next week. I don't really have a "usual" of anything much that I'd be disturbed by changing to an alternative. Sometimes you get hits and occasionally misses, but that just means the you appreciate the hits more!
fabifabulous 1y ago
Not a Japanese person. But I regularly shop rice at a big asian supermarket. They offered a huge variety of US rice. However, I bought the Japanese one for twice the cost. Primary reason: Trump. Secondary reason: quality.
harimau777 1y ago
Isn’t at least some US rice high in arsenic due to The land previously being used for cotton farming? I was told never to eat rice from the South.
wdb 1y ago
I am curious now! What is the (taste) difference between old and new rice? Never heard that distinction before. I do like to use Japanese rice when making congee it tastes so much better.
georgeecollins 1y ago
It's probably like the price of gas in America. Easily seen, frequently bought so it causes anxiety. I know for some in America transportation is a serious concern, but there is also a lot of irrational reaction as well. After COVID, the person in the office next to mine was really upset that gas was like +$1. Like your house went up a quarter million in value and your mad because gas cost $5. You're never going to buy enough gas for it to matter. People are strange.
- PaulHoule 1y ago
  I've thought about carbon pricing. $100 a tonne sounds like a nice round number and it is in the ballpark where it is claimed that carbon capture and storage is affordable for coal burning power plants, oil refineries and such. That comes to about $1 a gallon on gas, which I have two thoughts about: (1) I don't think it would change people's behavior that much -- gas has been $1 higher at times in the past and it didn't discourage me from driving and I'm not rich, I wouldn't consider spending more than $25k on a car whereas I know people who think nothing of buying an $80k truck. (2) I think Americans are highly sensitized to price increases right now and I think it would politically impossible to add $1/gallon to the price of gas, people would complain they are all out of spoons or it is the straw that breaks the camel's back or something. I think even 10 years ago it might have been easier, but right now, forget about it.
- nozzlegear 1y ago
  I used to live paycheck to paycheck, and when you live that way you're very sensitive to the price of gas since transportation is so vital. Gas going up by a dollar means you're now paying $60 to fill up your 15 gallon tank instead of $45. It's only $15 more, but if you don't make much in the first place and you already live paycheck to paycheck, it makes a huge difference and can cause a lot of stress watching that fuel gauge tick down.
  - reverendsteveii 1y ago
    This. When I was a bartender it wasn't uncommon for the last little bit of free cash I had at the beginning of the work week to be (barely) enough to get me to work

by kondro 1y ago

daedrdev 1y ago

Japan forces this to be the case with extremely high tariffs on rice imports. It's not that they won't consider it, they literally can't.

balanced2 1y ago
I see cal-rose for shy above 3000 yen. While I didn't grasp the details, I saw a news report which made it seems they've set up a quota (xx tons or something) of rice to be imported with almost no tariffs.
- daedrdev 1y ago
  That sounds possible, I can get premium calrose at 4.5kg for 20$, which adjusted to be 5kg is like 3200 yen or it could be regular quality calrose marked up, I can get that for half the premium price so equivalent of 1600 yen.
Dylanlacey 1y ago
I'm not sure tarrifs have a huge impact; Japan is Australia's largest buyer of rice, importing $63.8MUSD worth in 2023 per the OEC: https://oec.world/en/profile/bilateral-product/rice/reporter/aus https://oec.world/en/profile/bilateral-product/rice/reporter.... That's a lot of rice to buy, if it's more expensive and less desirable then domestic rice.
- freetime2 1y ago
  > The government imports 770,000 tons of rice tariff-free annually under its minimum access quota, and places up to 100,000 tons of that up for auction. Private-sector imports, which are separate from that framework, are subject to a tariff of 341 yen ($2.35) per kilogram, a measure intended to protect domestic producers. [1] Since 1995 Japan has been forced by the WTO to import a certain amount of rice tariff-free every year. Much of it doesn't even go to Japanese consumers, but rather to animal feed and strategic reserves. Prior to 2024, virtually all imported rice in Japan was imported to satisfy this requirement. Presumably that also includes the $63M of rice imported from Australia in 2023. The tariffs do indeed have a massive impact, and until recently it was very difficult for consumers to even find imported rice in supermarkets. [1] https://archive.is/0heNf#selection-2761.52-2761.373 https://archive.is/0heNf#selection-2761.52-2761.373
- arein3 1y ago
  Japan is forced to buy it as per some kind of trade agreement, and then stores it until it is fed to livestock

balanced2 1y ago

From what I've seen at the supermarket, cal-rose, rice from California does sell out and get restocked with reasonable quantity. While I can't be sure it's "average Japanese people" buying it I see no reason to believe otherwise. It's been shown on TV a few times too, the sure-fire average marketing in Japan.

mc3301 1y ago

Honestly, I think the average Japanese person wouldn't care that much after they tried it a few times. Especially upon noting the significant monthly savings. There's almost no imported rice even available here, and the propaganda of the superiority of domestic rice is quite powerful.

jjangkke 1y ago
does it have the same sticky/wet/chewy texture that Japanese rice is famous for ? the rice demand in Japan is extremely inelastic, they would rather eat less than consume foreign brands, and a lot of this comes from the trust they have in their industries. hardly something to ridicule Japan or suggest they depart from their cultural values.
- kondro 1y ago
  I know that Australian-grown Japonica does, although I don't think produces in Australia care about taste (which is why I buy Japanese rice). But when the average bowl of rice is smothered in curry, demi-glace or egg, soy & sugar I don't think you could tell.
  - Dylanlacey 1y ago
    What I want to know is, what's happening to all the Australian rice they do import? Are the statistics lumping all varieties together, are we only selling them Basmati?
- balanced2 1y ago
  The tv reporting on cal-rose did point out it's a bit less starchy, but still good. Similar reporting on the strategic reserve rice pointed out it's a bit more crunchy but still good. Someone on TV saying it's still good is pretty strong marketing and seems to be contributing to sales of imported rice. It'll be interesting to see how this goes once things settle down, especially if tariff-free rice quotas stick around.
  - 1y ago

Hasnep 1y ago

> the average Japanese eats around 1kg of uncooked rice per week. That's gonna be crunchy

chii 1y ago
just in case people dont understand, the dry weight of rice is what gets measured.
- cjrp 1y ago
  I'm glad you've explained that because I genuinely thought it was being eaten raw. I guess it's more like they eat the _equivalent_ of 1kg of uncooked rice.
  - chii 1y ago
    The grandparent poster used a strange way to word it - you dont normally call it uncooked rice in this context! It's like saying people eat 1kg of raw flour when they're talking about bread consumption.
IAmBroom 1y ago
The shittiest bowl of GrapeNuts ever.

creakingstairs 1y ago

At least for supermarkets around me they _only_ sell Japanese rice. You’d have to buy online or drive out which doesn’t work for vast majority of old population. Also as an East Asian I can somewhat understand reluctance to change rice. It’s just such a staple in your daily life. If I had eaten one type of rice for my entire life (and the price of the rice has remained stable for the last 40 years) and suddenly I can’t afford that type of rice, it would be a shock.

kondro 1y ago
There are so many restaurants that talk about using the best rice in Japan. On asking them where it comes from and it's always either local to the restaurant, or to the prefecture the owner grew up in. There's a lot of local patriotism for rice in Japan, I even find it admirable most of the time. Rice price is obviously important and probably linked pretty highly with inflation numbers in Japan. It's price is currently being artificially manipulated higher by JA, and that sucks. But I think ultimately most of these articles and even the local discourse with other Japanese is just a socially acceptable topic to grumble about.
- numpad0 1y ago
  Rice patriotism in Japan is just result of politically motivated and generally unpopular gen-tan policy spectacularly backfiring. The price is not artificially inflated, at least not by JA, it's just result of forcing rice to be uneconomical in the market where people just buys rice no matter what. As supply is decreased artificially and price increases in response, unit price rose and so did quality. As result of quality increased artificially although indirectly, imports unaffected by local market further lost competitiveness. I bet Japan's going to be internally forced to expand rice exports, not imports. Farmers must pay bills or else they go away, and people aren't going to eat imports. So farmers has to stay by either completely subsidized a la defense production, or by scaling out at paces permanently exceeding inflation. Maybe both. Extra production has to go somewhere but population is on decline, so it has to go somewhere beyond the seas. Unless iPhone moment happens and the country's hit by vastly superior rice, which iOS was - iPhone had worse hardware with worse integration than any of local phones back then, but UI/UX was literally 5-10 years ahead of everything else, and it completely replaced the entire Japanese phone market helped by blatantly illegal marketing tactics. That's not happening so far with rice.

angst 1y ago

I'm curious if anyone has noticed a significant taste difference between Japonica rice and those imported from China, Korea, or Vietnam. Is one generally considered better tasting than the others?

rubansk 1y ago
my mum once bought "japanese rice" from the supermarket that tasted noticeably different (and worse). had to check the label, turns out it was made in Vietnam.
RJIb8RBYxzAMX9u 1y ago
> I'm curious if anyone has noticed a significant taste difference between Japonica rice and those imported from China, Korea, or Vietnam. Yes, but it's like somewhere between mineral water and coffee. That is, most can tell the difference when directly compared, and may even prefer one over the other, but in many cases they are interchangeable. > Is one generally considered better tasting than the others? IMHO, no, but you tend to prefer the type you eat most often. Going back to the coffee analogy, most people have a roast / style they prefer, but few would claim that it's better.
- fc417fc802 1y ago
  Isn't that likely to be the other way around? You tend to eat most often that which you prefer? Granted familiarity itself can play a role when considering something unfamiliar. But when it comes to both rice and coffee I purchase what I do because I significantly preferred it to the variants I tried before it.
  - RJIb8RBYxzAMX9u 1y ago
    I don't think so, because there are too many things, but not enough time in life to find out your true preferences for them all, so we all are (to varying degree of) indifferent to most things, and focus on only a few things we truly care about. For you, it's coffee and rice; for others, it may be monitor latency and keyboard switches. I'd used coffee as an analogy, because it's something that almost everyone drinks, has many varieties, but most generally aren't too picky about it. Alas, I'd underestimated the population overlap between HN readers and picky coffee drinkers. :-P

azinman2 1y ago

Not always a smart choice: https://www.japanfs.org/sp/en/news/archives/news_id032147.html https://www.japanfs.org/sp/en/news/archives/news_id032147.ht...

rtpg 1y ago

> I pay somewhere around AUD$14/kg for Japanese rice in Australia a 10kg bag of (AU-grown) koshihikari at Hanaromart (some Asian supermarket) is around 43 AUD right now IIRC. Could I tell the difference in blind tasting between it and just "normal" koshihikari off the shelf off a Japanese supermarket? Maybe, but maybe not. Not an argument for removing trade barriers, but the gap right now seems pretty stark. I do feel like it's worth thinking about how you're saying 800 yen, but that might be per person. So for a 3-person family that's almost ~120k JPY per year. If you could cut that down to 90k JPY per year thats an extra 2500 JPY per month you can spend on food. If you're the kind of person who only goes to the discount shops, an extra 2500 JPY per month can go a decent way on food. If you are on a pretty strict/limited food budget that 2500 JPY could go a long way. Though of course like with eggs, etc, all food prices are just more obvious as well. And Japan has had really nasty inflation with energy + the weakening yen as well, so this is yet another thing that saps away at a budget where you're probably not saving that much to begin with.

kondro 1y ago
As mentioned, I've done taste tests across various options and I can definitely tell the difference, which is why I pay more. But as I also said, I can afford to pay more. I don't think the average Japanese is going to be effected. But as I mentioned, if you're budget conscious, not even considering non-Japanese rice is ridiculous.
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- teruakohatu 1y ago
  > As mentioned, I've done taste tests across various options and I can definitely tell the difference, which is why I pay more. Can you tell the difference between Japanese brands or only between Japanese and non Japanese origin rice? Is rice a significant percentage of food cost in Japan? Coming from a culture that uses less rice, the cost of price verses the cost of protein makes it just about a rounding error when cooking. Now butter on the other hand has just about become a luxury good in New Zealand when it was once cheap, plentiful and extremely high quality.

YouMeWeThem 1y ago

I got Calrose about a month back for just over 3000 yen, which is slightly cheaper than the homegrown stuff. The issue is that a year ago the homegrown stuff was going for 1500 yen.

pezezin 1y ago

> The fact the average Japanese person won't even consider trying imported Japonica rice from Australia or USA is madness if budget is a consideration. I live in Japan, and my girlfriend is an atypical Japanese that doesn't like rice that much. For her, the madness is that people here won't even consider other sources of carbs like pasta, potatoes, or bread.

teruakohatu 1y ago
I am not Japanese, and don’t eat a lot of rice (twice a week maybe), but I don’t think it’s madness. If you told me to eat rice instead of bread I would probably be just as horrified
- robertlagrant 1y ago
  While I'm English with some Indian leanings, I think it's potatoes > rice > bread > naan bread.
  - teruakohatu 1y ago
    Are those “>” greater than signs or arrows? Neither English nor Indian and I would rate Naan bread right at the top if I had a choice.
wkat4242 1y ago
But yakisoba is pasta/noodles right? Or is that a dish more tailored to Western? I've never been to Japan, I'm just wondering.
- Dylanlacey 1y ago
  Yes, it is, and no, it's very much to the Japanese taste. There's no absence of non-rice main meals in Japan; Wafu pasta is an entire category of Japanese pasta dishes whose name literally means Japanese Style Pasta. Udon, Ramen and Soba abound, and Kansai in particular has a large number of Konamon, flour-based meals and snacks (resulting from Allied food aid after the bombings). In some ways, the reaction to suggestions of swapping out rice are like that redneck uncle of yours who is mad his Cardiologist told him to cut down on red meat because "what else am I supposed to eat?!" even though his wife does all the cooking and they already have pork/chicken/fish 3 nights out of 7. It's an identity thing; in some ways to eat rice is to _be_ Japanese.

lovich 1y ago

Their rice imports have risen by 2 orders of magnitude from 126 tons a year to over 10k tons already[1] I don’t know if that is a drop in the bucket compared to their total consumption but their does appear to be an increasing appetite for foreign rice at the price points Japan is currently experiencing [1] https://asia.nikkei.com/Business/Agriculture/Japan-s-May-rice-imports-surge-as-companies-shrug-off-heavy-tariff https://asia.nikkei.com/Business/Agriculture/Japan-s-May-ric...

kondro 1y ago
But to put that in perspective, 10k tons is still only around the consumption for around 2.3m people, or less than 2% of the population.
- lovich 1y ago
  Yea that totally fits in as this not really moving the needles, but at least on person in Japan has realized the market inefficiency and is capitalizing on it, which was main point to the comment I was replying to

skhr0680 1y ago

> The fact the average Japanese person won't even consider trying imported Japonica rice from Australia or USA is madness if budget is a consideration. Domestic rice is a national security concern, not a financial one. Being fed by another country, even an ally, can turn pear-shaped very quickly. Is it that hard to imagine Trump threatening to starve Japan if they don't bow to his demands?* > But also, the average Japanese eats around 1kg of uncooked rice per week. That's ¥800 at the rates in the article (~USD$300/year). Japan's cost of living is generally pretty low, but I doubt +/- $100/year is effecting many people. Why the doubt? The average price of rice literally doubled YoY. For families that can be hundreds of dollars per month (yen equivalent) that they have to pull out of thin air, and that's in a country where the median wage is half of Australia. * Yes, Japan already imports over half of its food, but rice is where the government decided to draw the line in the sand.

sunnyam 1y ago
You don't even need to consider an ally being a bad actor. When Ukraine was invaded, wheat prices (to name one) in Europe shot up. England in particular has fairly significant food security challenges.

ianpenney 1y ago

…And how much time have you spent in Japan if I may ask?

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bamboozled 1y ago

How is eating rice from years old storage "eating fresh rice"? This rice in Japan is cheap because it's coming out of storage.

Saigonautica 1y ago

Oh, this brings back memories. I agree, the Japanese-grown rice in Japan is definitely different than the imported stuff. I used to buy the rice grown in Fukushima prefecture because it was sold at a significant discount, during the short and financially disastrous period where I tried to immigrate there.

decimalenough 1y ago

Fun fact: in feudal Japan, taxes and income were measured in koku of rice (approx 150 kg), which is roughly how much a person needed to sustain themselves for a year. The little plastic cup that comes with your rice cooker measures one gō, which is 1/1000th of a koku.

IAmBroom 1y ago
Interesting. I am assuming that is nominally "one ordinary peasant's rice consumption", not "enough rice to live on". One gō appears to be about 5 ounces/150 grams, and that is about 550 calories, or 25% of a nominal daily calorie need. One can quibble with the exact numbers - smaller stature Japanese feudal peasants, but heavier physical demands, etc. It works out to 25% of the calorie need, ironically close to the amount supplied by beer in an estimate of a European medieval monastery.
- reverendsteveii 1y ago
  it's reasonable to assume that this represents the amount of rice japan should allocate per-peasant in a functioning economy with other food sources. it would be meaningless and absurd to develop a standard for the amount of rice one would need in a year if and only if rice was the sole food source in their universe. In fact I'd be willing to bet there's no amount of rice that would keep a person alive for a year if that's all they ate.
- hyghjiyhu 1y ago
  Divided by 1000, not 365. So they eat just shy of 3 such portions a day.
- Nasrudith 1y ago
  Well Japanese peasants were also encouraged to live off of 'lesser' grains like millet, barley, and wheat. Let alone the other nutritionally imporant but non calorically-dense supplements like vegetables.

boruto 1y ago

I don't think it is simple to eat a different rice under normal circumstances once you are used to it. In my case even something which is staple variety 200 km away

grues-dinner 1y ago
Maybe this is my millennial spoiled-for-choice nature, but that seems very strange to me. Though certainly it was (is?) similar in older generations here (overheard in the 80s: "pasta? no, no, we don't eat that foreign muck, it's meat and two veg in my house"). But if I lived somewhere where there are noticeable varieties of rice with local characters, it seems more fun to at least be open to trying them rather than stick with one for my life. Same with fresh pasta variations, olives etc in Italy, say. Even for things like bread and coffee, I'll usually buy different kinds just to mix things up. Sourdough and Columbian today, rye and Ethiopian next week. I don't really have a "usual" of anything much that I'd be disturbed by changing to an alternative. Sometimes you get hits and occasionally misses, but that just means the you appreciate the hits more!

fabifabulous 1y ago

Not a Japanese person. But I regularly shop rice at a big asian supermarket. They offered a huge variety of US rice. However, I bought the Japanese one for twice the cost. Primary reason: Trump. Secondary reason: quality.

harimau777 1y ago

Isn’t at least some US rice high in arsenic due to The land previously being used for cotton farming? I was told never to eat rice from the South.

wdb 1y ago

I am curious now! What is the (taste) difference between old and new rice? Never heard that distinction before. I do like to use Japanese rice when making congee it tastes so much better.

georgeecollins 1y ago

It's probably like the price of gas in America. Easily seen, frequently bought so it causes anxiety. I know for some in America transportation is a serious concern, but there is also a lot of irrational reaction as well. After COVID, the person in the office next to mine was really upset that gas was like +$1. Like your house went up a quarter million in value and your mad because gas cost $5. You're never going to buy enough gas for it to matter. People are strange.

PaulHoule 1y ago
I've thought about carbon pricing. $100 a tonne sounds like a nice round number and it is in the ballpark where it is claimed that carbon capture and storage is affordable for coal burning power plants, oil refineries and such. That comes to about $1 a gallon on gas, which I have two thoughts about: (1) I don't think it would change people's behavior that much -- gas has been $1 higher at times in the past and it didn't discourage me from driving and I'm not rich, I wouldn't consider spending more than $25k on a car whereas I know people who think nothing of buying an $80k truck. (2) I think Americans are highly sensitized to price increases right now and I think it would politically impossible to add $1/gallon to the price of gas, people would complain they are all out of spoons or it is the straw that breaks the camel's back or something. I think even 10 years ago it might have been easier, but right now, forget about it.
nozzlegear 1y ago
I used to live paycheck to paycheck, and when you live that way you're very sensitive to the price of gas since transportation is so vital. Gas going up by a dollar means you're now paying $60 to fill up your 15 gallon tank instead of $45. It's only $15 more, but if you don't make much in the first place and you already live paycheck to paycheck, it makes a huge difference and can cause a lot of stress watching that fuel gauge tick down.
- reverendsteveii 1y ago
  This. When I was a bartender it wasn't uncommon for the last little bit of free cash I had at the beginning of the work week to be (barely) enough to get me to work