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GOP omnibus bill would sell off USPS's EVs
- dadjoker 1y ago[dead]
- i80and 1y agoObviously this is extremely bad and dumb and performative, but putting that aside: who is going to buy them at the needed scale? They're custom purpose-built vehicles for mail delivery, not exactly something I see the marketplace absorbing.
- vesinisa 1y agoIf these are legal to drive on Europe I think they have a good market offshore.
- BartjeD 1y agoExcept for tarif war
- NewJazz 1y agoYou're putting way too much thought into this. The purpose of this provision is to appease donors. If these get sold for scrap, that is a feature. Did someone say there is no quid pro quo? https://www.cnn.com/2024/05/23/politics/trump-senate-democrats-oil-investigation https://www.cnn.com/2024/05/23/politics/trump-senate-democra...
- cosmic_cheese 1y agoMaybe they’d be bought as last-mile vehicles for FedEx contractors or similar? Selling them off really doesn’t make sense, though. I understand that the USPS operates in many areas that aren’t conducive to EVs and that ICE models are needed there, but these electric models would be extremely well-suited for urban areas where drivers are making frequent stops given how poorly ICEs perform in constant-stop-and-go scenarios.
- NewJazz 1y agoFedEx has a supplier for EVs already. So does Amazon. They probably don't want some oddball trucks in their fleet. Although it would be a nice favor for FedEx or someone to keep the batteries warm until a more sane administration offers to buy them back.
- cchance 1y agoExactly its more likely its a push to have USPS less efficient and less stable, so that in a year or so they can be like "see its useless we need to privatize it we told you the whole time" (this thing we did is totally proof we were right before) lol
- deepsquirrelnet 1y agoThe skeptic in me thinks the provision was added at the behest of the future purchaser. Amazon? FedEx? UPS? There’s a good chance this ends up as outright thievery.
- i80and 1y agoI would be a little surprised -- Amazon already has their own custom electric delivery trucks, and FedEx and UPS could probably order these from Oshkosh directly if they wanted. These vehicles are also optimized for mail, less for parcels. None of these players need to play backroom shenanigans. That said, blatant corruption is just the name of the game at this point in America, so who knows.
- WWLink 1y ago> Amazon already has their own custom electric delivery trucks The vast majority of amazon's delivery vehicles are random vans, and amazon themselves doesn't own them; they franchise out like fedex ground does. https://www.reddit.com/r/AmazonDSPDrivers/comments/17l2gue/all_amazon_vans_by_rank/ https://www.reddit.com/r/AmazonDSPDrivers/comments/17l2gue/a...
- throwawaymaths 1y agono. if you look at Oshkosh's behaviour according to the article you would immediately know this isn't going to be the case. the thievery has already happened.
- tart-lemonade 1y agoScrappers? UPS and Fedex would need bigger vehicles than this. Maybe some other country's postal service would take advantage of it and buy them up, but that's about it as far as I can see. It's all part of a much larger plan to cripple the USPS so republicans can justify outsourcing mail delivery to the private sector. Take a great investment the USPS made that would decrease health premiums (because it's so much better ergonomically for drivers) and lower operating costs, and throw it into a fire. Now USPS has to continue to maintain the LLVs, even as they continue to fall apart and the drivers suffer.
- spike021 1y ago>UPS and Fedex would need bigger vehicles than this. I live in the SF Bay Area and i've definitely seen small vans and such used for delivery by the major shippers. they don't always use the standard trucks.
- adastra22 1y agoAmazon would take them at fire-sale prices.
- deleted 1y ago[deleted]
- s0rce 1y agoI could see Amazon buying them.
- jrockway 1y agoI don't think there is any desire to find a legitimate buyer. The bill wants to say "throw them into a landfill" but the architects are trying to sound thrifty. Stated reasoning: "Stop wasting the government's money on useless initiatives. Sell these white elephants and ask employees to use their own car!" Actual reasoning: "We need to burn more oil. There are campaign donations on the line and the midterms are going to be very tough for us. Big Electricity does not donate to campaigns and we can't take the money we save on fuel and use it for ads."
- 6SixTy 1y agoIf most other last mile delivery companies (e.g. UPS) weren't already commissioning their own delivery vans, then I would say that any one of them could pick up the slack.`
- toast0 1y agoIf there's only 93 of them as posted elsewhere in the thread, there's no scale needed, just two randos per state. Plenty of people driving old usps mail jeeps, you can always find someone who wants to drive something weird.
- extraduder_ire 1y agoIf they're auctioned off somewhere like govdeals, I could see them selling for above their reserve price.
- deleted 1y ago[deleted]
- burnt-resistor 1y agoThey'll rust in surplus lots until Burners buy them one at a time.
- siilats 1y agoI think they only made 93 for the $10bn so it doesnt matter who guys them
- NewJazz 1y agoAlternative, non-paywalled story https://electrek.co/2025/06/22/republicans-cant-stop-wasting-money-they-want-to-scrap-usps-awesome-evs/ https://electrek.co/2025/06/22/republicans-cant-stop-wasting...
- SoftTalker 1y agoBut hardly unbiased.
- xnx 1y agoI hope the spite is worth it for all the wasted money for anyone who voted for this.
- atoav 1y agoThose who voted for this will think whatever their extremely distorted media diet will tell them. After all Trump/God works in mysterious ways, so they might ask: who knows what the grander plan behind it all is? The notion of Trump playing 4D chess is basically the same concept.
- decremental 1y ago[dead]
- throwawaymaths 1y agoat least in the case of canoo the money was already wasted (see the history of canoo). the oshkosh vehicles are incredibly sensible, but very (irrationally?) unpopular and already beset with cost overruns. If you look at it, its not hard to guess why theyre unpopular. the success of the usmail ev program was by no means guaranteed; and if the us mail goes with a COTS unit (ev or otherwise), it's probably going to be more cost effective in any case.
- faraggi 1y agoWhat a bunch of corrupt, useless idiots.
- NewJazz 1y agowaves hands "there is no quid pro quo" https://www.cnn.com/2024/05/23/politics/trump-senate-democrats-oil-investigation https://www.cnn.com/2024/05/23/politics/trump-senate-democra...
- deleted 1y ago[deleted]
- candiddevmike 1y agoWisconsin folks should be seething about this. These vehicles were created by Oshkosh Corporation and are one of the more successful public/private "redesigns" in recent memory.
- tlogan 1y agoOshkosh Corporation will get a new military contract :) No worries there. Let’s be honest - Oshkosh Corporation is really strange choice for making EVs. Very strange choice.
- deleted 1y ago[deleted]
- toast0 1y agoWhat's strange about them? They're a major contract vehicle builder and familiar with building vehicles for government (defense) contracts. Like most contract vehicle builders, they put together parts from major suppliers. Bosch makes the EV motor and most likely supplies the control module and what not too.
- NewJazz 1y agoRivian, GM, and Ford all have experience making fleet EVs. If the government procurement process is too hard for them to deal with, maybe the process is the problem. Giving it to one of those manufacturers would help them achieve economies of scale and be more competitive in the consumer and private sector fleet markets. (Sure the vehicle is a very different format, but the drivetrains and battery would be nearly indistinguishable).
- toast0 1y agoOshkosh is working in partnership with Ford. The ICE build uses a Ford drive train, and there's a connection to the Ford Transit. This is how most contract commercial vehicles are built for the US markets, take a cutaway truck/van from usually Ford or GM, and put the needed body on it. Sometimes even the cutaway cab is too much, there's often a chassis+engine only package, and sometimes a custom chassis is needed. GM had entered the procurement process, but left early on. Rivian had no track record when the procurement process began. No argument that the process is long, and probably has problems, but I don't think it's strange that Oshkosh made it through the process.
- dyauspitr 1y agoThe postmen and women love this design. Plus they’re cheaper to run and clean. I hate this administration and group of people like nothing I’ve hated before.
- CoastalCoder 1y ago> I hate this administration and group of people like nothing I’ve hated before. I'm in the same boat. Politically / culturally I'm pretty centrist, and historically I've found things to like and dislike about both parties' governance. (G.W. Bush was the first administration I ever hated. But I'm mostly willing to write GW Bush off as a moron, and his fellow Republicans as inept.) With Trump 2, for the first time I actually loath the entire Republican party, and the voters who support him. I'm having a very difficult time believing anything praiseworthy behind their motives. It's the first time I truly fear for the immediate future of the country. I'm sure this says as much about me as it does about the Republicans. But if there are many others like me, this can't be a good sign of what's to come.
- squigz 1y agoOne is almost forced to wonder if "hating" half of your country is part of the issue.
- CoastalCoder 1y ago> One is almost forced to wonder if "hating" half of your country is part of the issue. I agree. It's the first time I've ever had these thoughts and feelings, and it's not obvious how justified my hatred is.
- squigz 1y agoI don't think your feelings are necessarily 'unjustified' - because, well... shit's crazy - but I don't think hatred is going to be lead anywhere productive. And I think the assumption that hatred stems from - that 70 million people or so voted for this because they're racist stupid people - is also problematic. I think people need to start asking in at least some good faith why so many people voted for this. If your answer really is that they're just racist and stupid... then I would encourage you to consider whether your opinion is more informed from social media and news than meeting actual people.
- spike021 1y agoOver the past few years i've become friends with my neighborhood's USPS mailman. While it doesn't get as hot here as other parts of the country, it's pretty awful what he needs to deal with once temps reach 80+. his truck is like sitting in a metal can. he does what he can to park in shady areas but otherwise he's basically being cooked when he needs to go inside to get mail or drive it from stop to stop. these vehicles would've been a huge improvement.
- NewJazz 1y agoFWIW there are ICE and EV versions of the new trucks... There are a lot of benefits for the EV version, but I think both have AC. Not sure idling the engine to run the AC would be feasible, though. "Idling" an EV to run the AC would have much less "fuel" impact.
- mindslight 1y agoAnybody who considers themselves an American needs to be calling for a full stop to all activities of this administration, including impeachment and conviction. It's clear that our country and our government have many problems. They have festered over years, causing the frustration and pan-society feelings of disenfranchisement that drove Trumpism. But at this point it's clear that regardless of all the "4d chess", there is no reforming going on here - just a wholesale destruction and fire sale of our country at the behest of the same entrenched interests that have been pulling the strings the entire time. This is like going to the hospital for a broken bone, and they start calling surgeons to salvage your organs.
- Analemma_ 1y agoGreat. I'm "calling for a full stop", and nothing is happening. Now what?
- NewJazz 1y agoWhatever you do don't start drinking again!
- IncreasePosts 1y agoWell. That's what Americans voted for. What right do you have to demand them to stop?
- i80and 1y agoWe don't have a strategic referendum every four years and shut up otherwise.
- mindslight 1y agoBased on Trump's shotgun approach of contradictory positions and statements that promised everything to everyone, plus the completely uninspiring alternative option, it's not clear what Americans actually voted for. I have talked to many people that sheepishly admit they voted for Trump, yet lament that what he is doing is not at all what they thought he would do. So my point is that the opposition here is not just the usual partisan squabbling. People should not think that waiting for 2/4 years is going to passively solve the problem like the regular changing of the buntings. Rather people need to realize the speed and brazenness these societal arsonists are moving, and demand their congresspeople stand up (versus the stochastic death threats from the social media addled nutsos, bots, etc) and put a stop to this. Congress shouldn't be voting on a big ugly omnibus spending bill written by special interests, rather they should be browbeaten into focusing on impeachment.
- CoastalCoder 1y agoDoes anyone know the Republicans' steel-man argument in favor of this idea? (It wasn't clear if the article presented it.) I'm ready to believe the absolute worst about their conduct, but experience tells me to always hear both sides of a story before judging.
- dmd 1y ago“EVs bad, oil good.”
- NewJazz 1y agoI imagine their argument is that these are a waste of money and EVs are completely impractical. But that doesn't really square with big players in delivery voluntarily adopting EVs, and the physics around delivery driving patterns that really really benefits EVs.
- const_cast 1y agoI would imagine the real waste of money would be selling the vehicles you just got and breaking a contract for, presumably, a huge loss. I mean, there's no way these vehicles are going to sell for even 20% of what USPS bought them for.
- smadge 1y ago3 republicans are quoted in the article defending the proposal. Is there a better argument that the article didn’t quote?
- throwawaymaths 1y agoi dont know what the republicans are saying but FTA: > Oshkosh encountered delays and engineering problems during early manufacturing runs, and disagreements — and accusations of corporate dishonesty — among executives plagued the production process, The Washington Post reported in December. > Oshkosh was supposed to have delivered about 3,000 vehicles by the end of 2024. Instead it had provided roughly 100 and raised its prices as the Postal Service ordered additional EVs. sounds like cancelling should be agreed upon bipartisanly; partisan divide maybe on whether or not it's worthwhile to restart the procurement process.
- jbombadil 1y agohttps://archive.is/4iBzE https://archive.is/4iBzE
- wqeqweqw 1y ago[dead]
- SoftTalker 1y agoAt first impression this does seem pretty silly to cancel the project so late after most of the costs have already been incurred. Auctioning the vehicles will certainly not recover anything close to their cost, to say nothing of the other infrastructure that has been built out and will essentially have to be scrapped. On the other hand, that could be a "sunk cost" fallacy, if the future costs of these bespoke EVs is higher than the cost of just using a standard commercial utility vehicle. Not saying that it is, and the article really doesn't explore this other than to quote Rand Paul as saying that the provision “aims to cut unnecessary costs and focus USPS on delivering mail and not achieving the environmental initiatives pushed by the Biden Administration.”
- tastyface 1y agoThere's no careful reasoning here, just spite and cruelty.
- melenty 1y ago[dead]
- silverth 1y ago[dead]
- tlogan 1y agoApparently, only 93 electric vehicles have been delivered. And the 3,000 originally expected. [1] I suppose the headline could’ve been: “GOP tax bill compels USPS to sell its 93 delivery EVs”. But let’s be honest, that wouldn’t get many clicks nor be on the first page of HN. [1] https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/2024/12/11/biden-usps-ev-oshkosh-climate/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/2024/12/11/biden-usp...
- monocasa 1y agoWhat's the story with the rest of the contract? You don't normally get a vehicle manufacturer to start up a custom line without some contract in place wrt minimum orders (or paying out the wazoo).
- AlotOfReading 1y agoThe NGDV program was issued under IDIQ terms, which in this case means the government promised to order at least 10,019 vehicles over 10 years. There will have been a clause about termination for convenience that the government will invoke here. Oshkosh will then take them to court to ask for the remainder and the court will find that they're owed somewhere between 0-100% of it.
- mcphage 1y ago> that wouldn’t get many clicks nor be on the first page of HN. It probably would. Knowing the small number of vehicles involved makes the bill seem more capricious and stupid, not less.
- tlogan 1y agoDepends on the audience. You could write an article with the same facts but different subject and get a ton of clicks on Truth Social. (Just to clarify: I’m speaking here from the perspective of a hacker or hustler. No politic or opinion on the actual subject.)
- melenty 1y ago[dead]
- silverth 1y ago[dead]
- dang 1y agoProposed bills generally don't make good HN submissions, since usually nothing much comes of them: https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=true&query=by%3Adang%20bills%20propos&sort=byDate&type=comment https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=true&que... (I'm not commenting on this bill, about which I don't know anything.)
- mannyv 1y agoAll 100 of them? FTA: "Instead it had provided roughly 100 and raised its prices as the Postal Service ordered additional EVs."
- xtiansimon 1y ago> “Biden administration officials hoped that postal procurement would bolster the small-but-growing domestic EV market, both for commercial fleets and individual consumers.” Ho-Ho-Ho! > “The Senate’s version of Trump’s One Big Beautiful Bill […] aims to cut unnecessary costs […] and … the environmental initiatives pushed by the Biden Administration.” Undermining investment in American companies! This agendas of this administration are a cancer.