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> They promise that their gadget will free us from technology One cannot be free of technology by introducing more technology. To be honest, I think most of th

> They promise that their gadget will free us from technology One cannot be free of technology by introducing more technology. To be honest, I think most of this recent junk we've been seeing hasn't really made life a lot better. It's almost as if we started a culture of innovation which was based on making life more comfortable, and now that we have, we have to keep the machine going but into the realms more and more pointless than ever before. In fact, if I look back at the last 20 years, yes technology has gotten a little better, but very little of it (especially in the computer sphere) has really added new enjoyment to life. I mean, if computer innovation had stagnated 20 years ago, we wouldn't have as nice monitors, screens, or processors maybe, but would any of us be any worse off except for a few fringe cases? And what did we get in return? A push for even more efficiency, which isn't even a good thing. AI datacenters that need gigajoules of energy to run when we desperately need to save energy. People like Sam Altman and Jony Ive really are shining examples of the pathological sickness we have to ignore the good things in life for the trivial.

koakuma-chan 1y ago
If innovation stagnated 20 years ago we wouldn’t have Baldurs Gate 3, etc
- ge96 1y ago
  life peaked at 8-bit
- baal80spam 1y ago
  > If innovation stagnated 20 years ago we wouldn’t have Baldurs Gate 3 I'm not sure, is this supposed to be irony?
  - koakuma-chan 1y ago
    Parent is arguing technology hasn't added enjoyment to life. Have you played Baldur's Gate 3? I did and I enjoyed it.
    - yoyohello13 1y ago
      But is BG3 MORE enjoyable than anything that's come before? I would say I got just as much enjoyment from Mass Effect 20 years ago. Like is entertainment THAT much better now? Is better entertainment really the bar we want to use for measuring tech advancement?
      - koakuma-chan 1y ago
        > But is BG3 MORE enjoyable than anything that's come before? I would say I got just as much enjoyment from Mass Effect 20 years ago. Can't comment on Mass Effect, but I find BG3 is definitely more enjoyable than DOS2 or PWotR. > Is better entertainment really the bar we want to use for measuring tech advancement? There is definitely room for improvement there. I am having existential crises every time I wait for the next game I would enjoy to come out. The best time of my life was during the recent Mecha Break open beta, but now they closed it and I basically have nothing to do that I would really enjoy.
    - vouaobrasil 1y ago
      I'm not saying that there won't be small new additions to life that are fun, like better cameras (for me). But I think that you'd probably find something else equally enjoyable, like another new game that just isn't as advanced, and your life would not be significantly worse – in general, except for fringe cases. And on average, life isn't made better specifically because of technological improvement.
- jamie_ca 1y ago
  Baldur's Gate 3 nailed execution out of the park, but I don't know what I'd point to as innovation that puts it meaningfully beyond what Neverwinter Nights expansions coming out in 2004-2005 were doing.
- ViktorRay 1y ago
  Baldur’s Gate 3 could have been made 10 years ago. Just the graphics would have been worse. Baldur’s Gate 1 and 2 came out in the 90’s after all.
  - koakuma-chan 1y ago
    > Baldur’s Gate 1 and 2 came out in the 90’s after all. Is Baldur's Gate 1 or 2 as enjoyable as Baldur's Gate 3?
coliveira 1y ago
> And what did we get in return? Almost two hundred years ago, a bearded philosopher proposed that technology would simply make money move even faster to the pockets of the ultra-rich and leave the rest of humanity poor. He was ignored. We're now witnessing the results.
- hatefulmoron 1y ago
  Didn't he predict that capitalism will naturally give way to socialism?
  - yoyohello13 1y ago
    Technically there is still time.
- selfselfgo 1y ago
  [dead]
- deleted 1y ago
  [deleted]
- frumplestlatz 1y ago
  He wasn’t ignored, and tens of millions of people died unnecessarily trying to implement his ideas.
  - Jensson 1y ago
    What he didn't expect was the rise to democracy and governments that started to help people rather than oppress them. Modern governments having so high taxes and using almost all of that for social benefit while being controlled by the people is probably something Marx would already call an utopia, but people call that horrible capitalism still even though its nothing like the capitalism under his time.
    - LudwigNagasena 1y ago
yoyohello13 1y ago
I was thinking about this the other day too. In the last 10 years has technology actually made my life better? I had surgery recently and it seems like medical technology is much better. But day to day consumer tech? I was actually happier with that stuff 10 years ago than I am now.
- onlyrealcuzzo 1y ago
  > I was actually happier with that stuff 10 years ago than I am now. Why can't you just use that then?
  - amanaplanacanal 1y ago
    The Internet of 10 years ago doesn't exist. The Google search of 10 years ago doesn't exist. The social media of 10 years ago doesn't exist.
  - vouaobrasil 1y ago
    Sometimes it's a matter of the prisoner's dilemma or an arms-race. For example, I would like to continue using older phones. But most older phones don't support 4G or 5G. And that's not just a matter of internet: I had a nice phone, worked well for calls and texts, but the phone literally would not connect to the network because it was 2G max. In other cases, one has to use newer technology because it is what is provided at work. Mainly because older technology doesn't get security updates. Now my iPhone SE original, which works perfectly fine, no longer is updated and I don't know what to do. I DON'T want a newer phone. I hate phones. Still, some other technology isn't even made any more and if you need to use something at all, it has to be newer because it's harder and harder to find older stuff.
  - Analemma_ 1y ago
    Because increasingly I can't park my car, order from a restaurant, manage my bank account, or schedule a doctor's appointment without an up-to-date smartphone, since the old ways of doing those things got removed in favor of apps. I also can't stay in touch with a bunch of my friends, who are on various chat platforms I can't access. Unless you're prepared to go full off-grid hermit, you cannot opt out of technological progress even if you want to. That irks me, but what can I do?
adriand 1y ago
They will not rest until humanity has become as depicted in WALL-E: the ultimate brainless consumers. Unable to concentrate or focus or form an original thought. WALL-E might be the most prescient sci-fi movie ever made.
- drewr 1y ago
  Substitute hover chairs for automobiles and we're already living in it. As a walker and cyclist in your average midsize US city, I often feel like the scene where WALL-E is pursuing EVE through the spaceship narrowly escaping collision.
jstummbillig 1y ago
> most of this recent junk we've been seeing What are you thinking of?
- vouaobrasil 1y ago
  AI, LLM models, newer computers that come *default* with A.I, newer phones with cameras I don't want, "Apps" for everything, IOT devices that flood the trash heap with electronic waste, phones that are forced to be obsolete and upgrade to make more trash, websites that load 200MB onto your local storage just to read an article that can fit in 65KB (check out the structure of BBC.com and see how much space it takes in the cache), cars with *ugly* huge screens and touch controls, social media, huge tech corporations, sophisticated advertising algorithms,...
deleted 1y ago
[deleted]
tweetle_beetle 1y ago
> There’s a moral imperative of somehow celebrating making something with people that you think is important and curious and special. This nonsense from a speech Ive gave (in celebration of designing a few expensive jackets that were not really different from other expensive jackets) sticks with me. It is a pathology when you become this delusional. https://www.vogue.co.uk/article/moncler-jony-ive-lovefrom-collaboration https://www.vogue.co.uk/article/moncler-jony-ive-lovefrom-co...
- vouaobrasil 1y ago
  Yeah, these days a lot of people have that attitude. And I had that attitude when I was younger. But now that I've gotten older, I have realized there is "another side to the equation": there is also a moral imperative to take responsibility for your creations, and to temper curiosity with wisdom and care for how your inventions might affect the future. The problem is, in today's culture, we're only about rights and benefits and "curiosity above all else" without wanting to take the responsibility that goes with it. Unlike the prevailing philosophy in tech and academia, we shouldn't elevate curiosity above all else, and it is pathological to do so even when not delusional if it becomes a myopic goal to the exclusion of other considerations.
palmotea 1y ago
>> They promise that their gadget will free us from technology > One cannot be free of technology by introducing more technology. So they're blatantly lying to our faces, then? Or, more charitably, they're so full of themselves that they aren't registering their own contradictions.

koakuma-chan 1y ago

If innovation stagnated 20 years ago we wouldn’t have Baldurs Gate 3, etc

ge96 1y ago
life peaked at 8-bit
baal80spam 1y ago
> If innovation stagnated 20 years ago we wouldn’t have Baldurs Gate 3 I'm not sure, is this supposed to be irony?
- koakuma-chan 1y ago
  Parent is arguing technology hasn't added enjoyment to life. Have you played Baldur's Gate 3? I did and I enjoyed it.
  - yoyohello13 1y ago
    But is BG3 MORE enjoyable than anything that's come before? I would say I got just as much enjoyment from Mass Effect 20 years ago. Like is entertainment THAT much better now? Is better entertainment really the bar we want to use for measuring tech advancement?
    - koakuma-chan 1y ago
      > But is BG3 MORE enjoyable than anything that's come before? I would say I got just as much enjoyment from Mass Effect 20 years ago. Can't comment on Mass Effect, but I find BG3 is definitely more enjoyable than DOS2 or PWotR. > Is better entertainment really the bar we want to use for measuring tech advancement? There is definitely room for improvement there. I am having existential crises every time I wait for the next game I would enjoy to come out. The best time of my life was during the recent Mecha Break open beta, but now they closed it and I basically have nothing to do that I would really enjoy.
  - vouaobrasil 1y ago
    I'm not saying that there won't be small new additions to life that are fun, like better cameras (for me). But I think that you'd probably find something else equally enjoyable, like another new game that just isn't as advanced, and your life would not be significantly worse – in general, except for fringe cases. And on average, life isn't made better specifically because of technological improvement.
jamie_ca 1y ago
Baldur's Gate 3 nailed execution out of the park, but I don't know what I'd point to as innovation that puts it meaningfully beyond what Neverwinter Nights expansions coming out in 2004-2005 were doing.
ViktorRay 1y ago
Baldur’s Gate 3 could have been made 10 years ago. Just the graphics would have been worse. Baldur’s Gate 1 and 2 came out in the 90’s after all.
- koakuma-chan 1y ago
  > Baldur’s Gate 1 and 2 came out in the 90’s after all. Is Baldur's Gate 1 or 2 as enjoyable as Baldur's Gate 3?

coliveira 1y ago

> And what did we get in return? Almost two hundred years ago, a bearded philosopher proposed that technology would simply make money move even faster to the pockets of the ultra-rich and leave the rest of humanity poor. He was ignored. We're now witnessing the results.

hatefulmoron 1y ago
Didn't he predict that capitalism will naturally give way to socialism?
- yoyohello13 1y ago
  Technically there is still time.
selfselfgo 1y ago
[dead]
deleted 1y ago
[deleted]
frumplestlatz 1y ago
He wasn’t ignored, and tens of millions of people died unnecessarily trying to implement his ideas.
- Jensson 1y ago
  What he didn't expect was the rise to democracy and governments that started to help people rather than oppress them. Modern governments having so high taxes and using almost all of that for social benefit while being controlled by the people is probably something Marx would already call an utopia, but people call that horrible capitalism still even though its nothing like the capitalism under his time.
  - LudwigNagasena 1y ago

yoyohello13 1y ago

I was thinking about this the other day too. In the last 10 years has technology actually made my life better? I had surgery recently and it seems like medical technology is much better. But day to day consumer tech? I was actually happier with that stuff 10 years ago than I am now.

onlyrealcuzzo 1y ago
> I was actually happier with that stuff 10 years ago than I am now. Why can't you just use that then?
- amanaplanacanal 1y ago
  The Internet of 10 years ago doesn't exist. The Google search of 10 years ago doesn't exist. The social media of 10 years ago doesn't exist.
- vouaobrasil 1y ago
  Sometimes it's a matter of the prisoner's dilemma or an arms-race. For example, I would like to continue using older phones. But most older phones don't support 4G or 5G. And that's not just a matter of internet: I had a nice phone, worked well for calls and texts, but the phone literally would not connect to the network because it was 2G max. In other cases, one has to use newer technology because it is what is provided at work. Mainly because older technology doesn't get security updates. Now my iPhone SE original, which works perfectly fine, no longer is updated and I don't know what to do. I DON'T want a newer phone. I hate phones. Still, some other technology isn't even made any more and if you need to use something at all, it has to be newer because it's harder and harder to find older stuff.
- Analemma_ 1y ago
  Because increasingly I can't park my car, order from a restaurant, manage my bank account, or schedule a doctor's appointment without an up-to-date smartphone, since the old ways of doing those things got removed in favor of apps. I also can't stay in touch with a bunch of my friends, who are on various chat platforms I can't access. Unless you're prepared to go full off-grid hermit, you cannot opt out of technological progress even if you want to. That irks me, but what can I do?

adriand 1y ago

They will not rest until humanity has become as depicted in WALL-E: the ultimate brainless consumers. Unable to concentrate or focus or form an original thought. WALL-E might be the most prescient sci-fi movie ever made.

drewr 1y ago
Substitute hover chairs for automobiles and we're already living in it. As a walker and cyclist in your average midsize US city, I often feel like the scene where WALL-E is pursuing EVE through the spaceship narrowly escaping collision.

jstummbillig 1y ago

> most of this recent junk we've been seeing What are you thinking of?

vouaobrasil 1y ago
AI, LLM models, newer computers that come *default* with A.I, newer phones with cameras I don't want, "Apps" for everything, IOT devices that flood the trash heap with electronic waste, phones that are forced to be obsolete and upgrade to make more trash, websites that load 200MB onto your local storage just to read an article that can fit in 65KB (check out the structure of BBC.com and see how much space it takes in the cache), cars with *ugly* huge screens and touch controls, social media, huge tech corporations, sophisticated advertising algorithms,...

deleted 1y ago

[deleted]

tweetle_beetle 1y ago

> There’s a moral imperative of somehow celebrating making something with people that you think is important and curious and special. This nonsense from a speech Ive gave (in celebration of designing a few expensive jackets that were not really different from other expensive jackets) sticks with me. It is a pathology when you become this delusional. https://www.vogue.co.uk/article/moncler-jony-ive-lovefrom-collaboration https://www.vogue.co.uk/article/moncler-jony-ive-lovefrom-co...

vouaobrasil 1y ago
Yeah, these days a lot of people have that attitude. And I had that attitude when I was younger. But now that I've gotten older, I have realized there is "another side to the equation": there is also a moral imperative to take responsibility for your creations, and to temper curiosity with wisdom and care for how your inventions might affect the future. The problem is, in today's culture, we're only about rights and benefits and "curiosity above all else" without wanting to take the responsibility that goes with it. Unlike the prevailing philosophy in tech and academia, we shouldn't elevate curiosity above all else, and it is pathological to do so even when not delusional if it becomes a myopic goal to the exclusion of other considerations.

palmotea 1y ago

>> They promise that their gadget will free us from technology > One cannot be free of technology by introducing more technology. So they're blatantly lying to our faces, then? Or, more charitably, they're so full of themselves that they aren't registering their own contradictions.