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This is interesting: > “It’s more fun to write code than to read code,” said Simon Willison, an A.I. fan who is a longtime programmer and blogger, channeling t
by jt2190 1y ago
This is interesting:
> “It’s more fun to write code than to read code,” said Simon Willison, an A.I. fan who is a longtime programmer and blogger, channeling the objections of other programmers. “If you’re told you have to do a code review, it’s never a fun part of the job. When you’re working with these tools, it’s most of the job.”
> This shift from writing to reading code can make engineers feel as if they are bystanders in their own jobs. The Amazon engineers said that managers have encouraged them to use A.I. to help write one-page memos proposing a solution to a software problem and that the artificial intelligence can now generate a rough draft from scattered thoughts.
> They also use A.I. to test the software features they build, a tedious job that nonetheless has forced them to think deeply about their coding.
- timr 1y agoI was just thinking about this the other day (after spending an extended session talking to an LLM about bugs in its code), and I realized that when I was just starting out, I enjoyed writing code, but now the fun part is actually fixing bugs. Maybe I'm weird, but chasing down bugs is like solving a puzzle. Writing green-field code is maybe a little bit enjoyable, but especially in areas I know well, it's mostly boring now. I'd rather do just about anything than write another iteration of a web form or connect some javascript widget to some other javascript widget in the framework flavor of the week. To some extent, then, working with LLMs has restored some of the fun of coding because it takes care of the tedious part, and I get to solve the interesting problems.
- danielbln 1y agoI'm with you. I love solving puzzles to make something go. In the past that involved writing code, but it's not the code writing that I love, it's the problem solving and building. And I get plenty of that now, in a post-LLM world.
- ape4 1y agoFixing bugs in my own code is fine. In other's code its less fun.
- notyourwork 1y agoThat’s the wrong mentality. You and your team own all the code. A bugs peer is your bug too.
- SonOfKyuss 1y agoNot OP but I’ll give my perspective. I have no problem fixing someone else’s bugs up to a point, but I also don’t want to be the one cleaning up someone else’s mess who didn’t take time to do proper testing but is getting rated higher than me for clearing more tasks last month because they cut corners
- Wowfunhappy 1y agoWhy?
- seanmcdirmid 1y agoBugs are awesome. I picked my current job at Google because it involved lots of bug fixing and crash investigation.
- archagon 1y agoCode reviews are fun when you can trust the competence of the coder.
- user32489318 1y agoMaybe we have changed or the industry changed, but last 5 years I’ve rarely met anyone who took the code reviews seriously. Any feedback, or glaring issues, are swept under “we will address this later”, “we work in MVP way(read:deploy barely working code without any accountability to production”, or just outright take it as a character challenge. I’ve lead a team of junior-level engineers who would fight with you via the product owner/scrum master because of the “priorities” and “deadlines”. And then, you’d be on the call solving the same issues you’ve raised in pull request earlier. Maybe I’m getting old, but, taking accountability or pride in one’s work, is getting only worse with Vibe coding and ai generated garbage
- archagon 1y agoWell, from personal experience, code reviews at the FAANG I worked at were taken quite seriously. (But we were building OS frameworks so it mattered more.)
- Vinnl 1y agoI think for me, the fun comes from preventing bugs; being able to draw on my experience to foresee common classes of bugs, and being able to prevent them through smart code architecture, making it easier for future contributors/readers to avoid walking into those traps. I'm hoping I'll keep being able to do that.
- overgard 1y agoI spend all day fixing bugs and that's why they pay me -- because for most people it's not an enjoyable task. I'm not denying your experience but I will tell you I think you're an outlier. For most people, fixing bugs they didn't create is the worst part of the job.
- jerpint 1y agoPart of the fun is also figuring out the “best” way to achieve a thing. LLMs don’t often propose the best way and will happily propose convoluted ways. Clean approaches are still hard to come up with, but LLMs certainly help implementing them once thought up
- timr 1y agoYeah, I agree with that. I still enjoy doing the conceptual and design work that once upon a time would have been the role of an "architect", and that's still required with LLMs.
- protocolture 1y ago100% agreed. I solve a problem, let the AI mull on the next bit, solve another problem etc.
- zeroonetwothree 1y agoI find both fun. Writing a web form is still kinda fun even after 20 years. I guess it’s like how some people still play the same video games after years and years while others want something new.
- owebmaster 1y agoI hate fixing bugs but I enjoy big refactoring, AI-assisted or not - sometimes you just gotta do it all
- twobitshifter 1y agoAs far as vibes go, these guys sound much more negative.
- Ericson2314 1y agoIlliterates. Reading code was always very important. Hell may be mandatory vibe coding, but I'm glad this guy is now forced to read.
- bpicolo 1y agoSame, I love fixing bugs