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Google’s ability to offer inference for free is a massive competitive advantage vs everyone else: > Is Jules free of charge? > Yes, for now, Jules is free of

by thorum 1y ago

Google’s ability to offer inference for free is a massive competitive advantage vs everyone else: > Is Jules free of charge? > Yes, for now, Jules is free of charge. Jules is in beta and available without payment while we learn from usage. In the future, we expect to introduce pricing, but our focus right now is improving the developer experience. https://jules-documentation.web.app/faq https://jules-documentation.web.app/faq

cheriot 1y ago
OpenAI lost $5 billion in 2024 and there are claims loses will double in 2025. For now, that's just the cost to play.
candiddevmike 1y ago
You're the product here, though. EDIT: legal link doesn't work here (https://jules-documentation.web.app/faq#does-jules-train-on-private-repos https://jules-documentation.web.app/faq#does-jules-train-on-...) > No. Jules does not train on private repository content. Privacy is a core principle for Jules, and we do not use your private repositories to train models. Learn more about how your data is used to improve Jules. It's hard to tell what the data collection will be, but it's most likely similar to Gemini where your conversation can become part of the training data. Unclear if that includes context like the repository contents. https://jules.google.com/legal https://jules.google.com/legal
- add-sub-mul-div 1y ago
  They're going to make so much money when nobody knows how to code or think anymore without the crutch.
  - falcor84 1y ago
    I'll just put this here: > And so it is that you by reason of your tender regard for the writing that is your offspring have declared the very opposite of its true effect. If men learn this, it will implant forgetfulness in their souls. They will cease to exercise memory because they rely on that which is written, calling things to remembrance no longer from within themselves, but by means of external marks. > What you have discovered is a recipe not for memory, but for reminder. And it is no true wisdom that you offer your disciples, but only the semblance of wisdom, for by telling them of many things without teaching them you will make them seem to know much while for the most part they know nothing. And as men filled not with wisdom but with the conceit of wisdom they will be a burden to their fellows. - Plato quoting Socrates in "Phaedrus", circa 370 BCE
    - noduerme 1y ago
      But did you memorize that quote, or was it sufficient to know its gist so you could google it?
      - Avicebron 1y ago
        At least with writing it's fairly easy to implement on your own with little more than what most people would have available in a rudimentary survival situation. It'll be a tough day when someone goes to sign into their GoogleLife (tm) and find out that they can't get AI access because "precluding conditions agreed to upon signing"
        falcor84 1y ago
        As I see it, the solution to this is to invest in open source. As for a "survival situation", a solar-powered laptop with a locally running LLM would definitely be the first item on my list.
        deleted 1y ago
        [deleted]
        cess11 1y ago
        It shouldn't be, because LLM:s can't be trusted in the way literature can. People around you are also going to question why you insist on such a power hungry setup.
        wuiheerfoj 1y ago
        I’m not suggesting LLMs are infallible, but boy you’re overselling the accuracy of literature
        cess11 1y ago
        Why do you think that?
- jstummbillig 1y ago
  I read that a couple of times. It sounds vaguely clever and a bit ominous, but I have no clue what it means. Can you explain? Google products had had a net positive impact on my life over, what is it, 20 years now. If I had had to pay subscription fees over that span of time, for all the services that I use, that would have been a lot of very real money that I would not have right now. Is there a next step where it all gets worse? When?
diggan 1y ago
> Google’s ability to offer inference for free is a massive competitive advantage vs everyone else: Haven't tried Jules myself yet, still playing around with Codex, but personally I don't really care if it's free or not. If it solves my problems better than the others, then I'll use it, otherwise I'll use other things. I'm sure I'm not alone in focusing on how well it works, rather than what it costs (until a certain point).
- kristopolous 1y ago
  $0 opens up new doors. You use it differently at $0. Fundamentally.
  - vincnetas 1y ago
    until you built your stuff on 0$ assumption start depending on it and then the price increases.
    - jasonjmcghee 1y ago
      And if it's a good product / you're locked in, you pay up.
- YetAnotherNick 1y ago
  That's all good and well but its takes time to compare the products. And people are rarely willing to use paid product for comparison.
  - diggan 1y ago
    > That's all good and well but its takes time to compare the products Hence many of us are still busy trying out Codex to it's full extent :) > And people are rarely willing to use paid product for comparison. Yeah, and I'm usually the same, unless there is some free trial or similar, I'm unlikely to spend money unless I know it's good. My own calculation changed with the coming of better LLMs though. Even paying 200 EUR/month can be easily regained if you're say a freelance software engineer, so I'm starting to be a lot more flexible in "try for one month" subscriptions.
85392_school 1y ago
There are some limits: > 2 concurrent tasks > 5 total tasks per day
- spongebobstoes 1y ago
  5 tasks per day is low enough to be roughly useless for serious work
  - sigmar 1y ago
    It isn't "5 prompts." A single task is more like a "project" where you can repeatedly extend, re-prompt, and revise.
  - mark_l_watson 1y ago
    No, one task is a complete work cycle. I was only able to use up three tasks yesterday.
threatofrain 1y ago
This is standard startup play. Have a free beta stage and then transition into pricing.
Y_Y 1y ago
I feel like this (and I know it's big tech tradition) had the same economic effect as dumping. https://www.investopedia.com/terms/d/dumping.asp https://www.investopedia.com/terms/d/dumping.asp
- jeffbee 1y ago
  Google has been offering you "free inference" for more than a decade. People who never work there are simply not aware of how thorough soaked in machine inference many Google products are, especially the major ones like web search, mail, photos, etc.

by thorum 1y ago

cheriot 1y ago

OpenAI lost $5 billion in 2024 and there are claims loses will double in 2025. For now, that's just the cost to play.

candiddevmike 1y ago

You're the product here, though. EDIT: legal link doesn't work here (https://jules-documentation.web.app/faq#does-jules-train-on-private-repos https://jules-documentation.web.app/faq#does-jules-train-on-...) > No. Jules does not train on private repository content. Privacy is a core principle for Jules, and we do not use your private repositories to train models. Learn more about how your data is used to improve Jules. It's hard to tell what the data collection will be, but it's most likely similar to Gemini where your conversation can become part of the training data. Unclear if that includes context like the repository contents. https://jules.google.com/legal https://jules.google.com/legal

add-sub-mul-div 1y ago
They're going to make so much money when nobody knows how to code or think anymore without the crutch.
- falcor84 1y ago
  I'll just put this here: > And so it is that you by reason of your tender regard for the writing that is your offspring have declared the very opposite of its true effect. If men learn this, it will implant forgetfulness in their souls. They will cease to exercise memory because they rely on that which is written, calling things to remembrance no longer from within themselves, but by means of external marks. > What you have discovered is a recipe not for memory, but for reminder. And it is no true wisdom that you offer your disciples, but only the semblance of wisdom, for by telling them of many things without teaching them you will make them seem to know much while for the most part they know nothing. And as men filled not with wisdom but with the conceit of wisdom they will be a burden to their fellows. - Plato quoting Socrates in "Phaedrus", circa 370 BCE
  - noduerme 1y ago
    But did you memorize that quote, or was it sufficient to know its gist so you could google it?
    - Avicebron 1y ago
      At least with writing it's fairly easy to implement on your own with little more than what most people would have available in a rudimentary survival situation. It'll be a tough day when someone goes to sign into their GoogleLife (tm) and find out that they can't get AI access because "precluding conditions agreed to upon signing"
      - falcor84 1y ago
        As I see it, the solution to this is to invest in open source. As for a "survival situation", a solar-powered laptop with a locally running LLM would definitely be the first item on my list.
        deleted 1y ago
        [deleted]
        cess11 1y ago
        It shouldn't be, because LLM:s can't be trusted in the way literature can. People around you are also going to question why you insist on such a power hungry setup.
        wuiheerfoj 1y ago
        I’m not suggesting LLMs are infallible, but boy you’re overselling the accuracy of literature
        cess11 1y ago
        Why do you think that?
jstummbillig 1y ago
I read that a couple of times. It sounds vaguely clever and a bit ominous, but I have no clue what it means. Can you explain? Google products had had a net positive impact on my life over, what is it, 20 years now. If I had had to pay subscription fees over that span of time, for all the services that I use, that would have been a lot of very real money that I would not have right now. Is there a next step where it all gets worse? When?

diggan 1y ago

> Google’s ability to offer inference for free is a massive competitive advantage vs everyone else: Haven't tried Jules myself yet, still playing around with Codex, but personally I don't really care if it's free or not. If it solves my problems better than the others, then I'll use it, otherwise I'll use other things. I'm sure I'm not alone in focusing on how well it works, rather than what it costs (until a certain point).

kristopolous 1y ago
$0 opens up new doors. You use it differently at $0. Fundamentally.
- vincnetas 1y ago
  until you built your stuff on 0$ assumption start depending on it and then the price increases.
  - jasonjmcghee 1y ago
    And if it's a good product / you're locked in, you pay up.
YetAnotherNick 1y ago
That's all good and well but its takes time to compare the products. And people are rarely willing to use paid product for comparison.
- diggan 1y ago
  > That's all good and well but its takes time to compare the products Hence many of us are still busy trying out Codex to it's full extent :) > And people are rarely willing to use paid product for comparison. Yeah, and I'm usually the same, unless there is some free trial or similar, I'm unlikely to spend money unless I know it's good. My own calculation changed with the coming of better LLMs though. Even paying 200 EUR/month can be easily regained if you're say a freelance software engineer, so I'm starting to be a lot more flexible in "try for one month" subscriptions.

85392_school 1y ago

There are some limits: > 2 concurrent tasks > 5 total tasks per day

spongebobstoes 1y ago
5 tasks per day is low enough to be roughly useless for serious work
- sigmar 1y ago
  It isn't "5 prompts." A single task is more like a "project" where you can repeatedly extend, re-prompt, and revise.
- mark_l_watson 1y ago
  No, one task is a complete work cycle. I was only able to use up three tasks yesterday.

threatofrain 1y ago

This is standard startup play. Have a free beta stage and then transition into pricing.

Y_Y 1y ago

I feel like this (and I know it's big tech tradition) had the same economic effect as dumping. https://www.investopedia.com/terms/d/dumping.asp https://www.investopedia.com/terms/d/dumping.asp

jeffbee 1y ago
Google has been offering you "free inference" for more than a decade. People who never work there are simply not aware of how thorough soaked in machine inference many Google products are, especially the major ones like web search, mail, photos, etc.