5 ms·

> tariff taxes are paid before we sell any of the products and are due within a week of receipt This is going to smash the cash flow of so many small businesse

> tariff taxes are paid before we sell any of the products and are due within a week of receipt This is going to smash the cash flow of so many small businesses

SV_BubbleTime 1y ago
[flagged]
- avsteele 1y ago
  Where are you getting PCBs assembled in the USA at small volume?
  - generj 1y ago
    Adafruit does their own assembly (pick and place / reflow) but not sure what PCB providers they have. There are US based PCB fabs. Cyber City Circuits does small scale assembly in the US and seem like a cool company (ran into them from the Datasheet Digest podcast they put out). But yeah obviously they aren’t going to be able to match a $35 PCBA JLCPCB prototyping order. https://cybercitycircuits.com/ https://cybercitycircuits.com/
    - Workaccount2 1y ago
      I can tell you from first hand day job experience: Electronic manufacturing in the US definitely exists. It also is low quality and 5x to 10x the cost of China. An assembled board that costed us $825/unit in the US (and frequently had errors) costs $130/unit from China and they nailed it every time (probably because they machine QC rather than human QC). It's really not even close. Same goes for machined parts - drastically cheaper and higher quality from China.
  - deleted 1y ago
    [deleted]
  - SV_BubbleTime 1y ago
    I do mine in Detroit. There are five shops I can think of offhand. I was in Montana once and stopped in to see a small PCB line. They were doing F22 and F35 PCBs. Small USA PCB is everywhere.
    - avsteele 1y ago
      Name one
    - fzeroracer 1y ago
      Name them and share the prices with us.
      - SV_BubbleTime 1y ago
        Adco, Devron, Riverside, Altera, RBB, VAST, EMSG… And that’s the ones I can think of within a couple hours of each other.
- _DeadFred_ 1y ago
  'because the US Government implemented dramatic new rulings with literally no plan/support for previously thriving American small businesses.' Not saying that is right or wrong but finish the sentence.
  - SV_BubbleTime 1y ago
    As a whole sentence that doesn’t work though. If you said -rely on Chinese products because MBAs and politicians spent decades shutting us out of manufacturing for the draw of cheap labor. That would be correct.
    - _DeadFred_ 1y ago
      No, the immediate issue is 100% because the current administration changed policy on a dime without care or concern for the impact on existing American small, less powerful American small business (but has repeatedly modified policy at the request of larger businesses/powerful business people). It is an intentional lack of intention in their policies by the current administration causing this, not previous business decisions. You can agree with the current policy, but you can't disagree that it is the DIRECT cause of the situation (in an attempt to address the indirect issue that you mentioned).
      - SV_BubbleTime 1y ago
        Have you considered crying about? Or positioning yourself and business to adapt to a more domestic centric manufacturing? We did the former a long time ago. You’re welcome to do the former.
- hidelooktropic 1y ago
  They said "so many" meaning a subset, and there are tariffs on other countries.
- switchbak 1y ago
  When the MBAs of all the large corps spend decades reworking supply chains to rely on overseas suppliers, you shouldn't be surprised when you have no domestic alternatives when you suddenly pull the rug out. None of this is by accident, of course, but it just seems predictably short-sighted, and I don't buy any of the 4d chess nonsense that some supporters are suggesting. And now the world has to bear the consequences of a misguided and overconfident policy.
joezydeco 1y ago
And if that tax isn't paid the shipment goes back, billed to the original shipper. I wonder how much stuff is going to be completely wasted by this process.
jkestner 1y ago
I mean, aside from the profits. Very exciting that we can't predict how much extra we'll pay by the time our orders hit the shores.
evan_ 1y ago
and as the article says it's going to cause prices to shoot up so even if they have the cash, some dongle that would sell at $10 might not sell as well at $30, so they aren't even going to be able to e.g. borrow money to float until they can sell the goods.
rsanheim 1y ago
Not just small. _all_ businesses.
- ncr100 1y ago
  "Recession!"

> tariff taxes are paid before we sell any of the products and are due within a week of receipt This is going to smash the cash flow of so many small businesses

SV_BubbleTime 1y ago

[flagged]

avsteele 1y ago
Where are you getting PCBs assembled in the USA at small volume?
- generj 1y ago
  Adafruit does their own assembly (pick and place / reflow) but not sure what PCB providers they have. There are US based PCB fabs. Cyber City Circuits does small scale assembly in the US and seem like a cool company (ran into them from the Datasheet Digest podcast they put out). But yeah obviously they aren’t going to be able to match a $35 PCBA JLCPCB prototyping order. https://cybercitycircuits.com/ https://cybercitycircuits.com/
  - Workaccount2 1y ago
    I can tell you from first hand day job experience: Electronic manufacturing in the US definitely exists. It also is low quality and 5x to 10x the cost of China. An assembled board that costed us $825/unit in the US (and frequently had errors) costs $130/unit from China and they nailed it every time (probably because they machine QC rather than human QC). It's really not even close. Same goes for machined parts - drastically cheaper and higher quality from China.
- deleted 1y ago
  [deleted]
- SV_BubbleTime 1y ago
  I do mine in Detroit. There are five shops I can think of offhand. I was in Montana once and stopped in to see a small PCB line. They were doing F22 and F35 PCBs. Small USA PCB is everywhere.
  - avsteele 1y ago
    Name one
  - fzeroracer 1y ago
    Name them and share the prices with us.
    - SV_BubbleTime 1y ago
      Adco, Devron, Riverside, Altera, RBB, VAST, EMSG… And that’s the ones I can think of within a couple hours of each other.
_DeadFred_ 1y ago
'because the US Government implemented dramatic new rulings with literally no plan/support for previously thriving American small businesses.' Not saying that is right or wrong but finish the sentence.
- SV_BubbleTime 1y ago
  As a whole sentence that doesn’t work though. If you said -rely on Chinese products because MBAs and politicians spent decades shutting us out of manufacturing for the draw of cheap labor. That would be correct.
  - _DeadFred_ 1y ago
    No, the immediate issue is 100% because the current administration changed policy on a dime without care or concern for the impact on existing American small, less powerful American small business (but has repeatedly modified policy at the request of larger businesses/powerful business people). It is an intentional lack of intention in their policies by the current administration causing this, not previous business decisions. You can agree with the current policy, but you can't disagree that it is the DIRECT cause of the situation (in an attempt to address the indirect issue that you mentioned).
    - SV_BubbleTime 1y ago
      Have you considered crying about? Or positioning yourself and business to adapt to a more domestic centric manufacturing? We did the former a long time ago. You’re welcome to do the former.
hidelooktropic 1y ago
They said "so many" meaning a subset, and there are tariffs on other countries.
switchbak 1y ago
When the MBAs of all the large corps spend decades reworking supply chains to rely on overseas suppliers, you shouldn't be surprised when you have no domestic alternatives when you suddenly pull the rug out. None of this is by accident, of course, but it just seems predictably short-sighted, and I don't buy any of the 4d chess nonsense that some supporters are suggesting. And now the world has to bear the consequences of a misguided and overconfident policy.

joezydeco 1y ago

And if that tax isn't paid the shipment goes back, billed to the original shipper. I wonder how much stuff is going to be completely wasted by this process.

jkestner 1y ago

I mean, aside from the profits. Very exciting that we can't predict how much extra we'll pay by the time our orders hit the shores.

evan_ 1y ago

and as the article says it's going to cause prices to shoot up so even if they have the cash, some dongle that would sell at $10 might not sell as well at $30, so they aren't even going to be able to e.g. borrow money to float until they can sell the goods.

rsanheim 1y ago

Not just small. _all_ businesses.

ncr100 1y ago
"Recession!"