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One thing I've learned when buying a full set of appliances couple of years ago: don't read consumer reports or reviews by randos on the internet -- instead, go

One thing I've learned when buying a full set of appliances couple of years ago: don't read consumer reports or reviews by randos on the internet -- instead, go to industry literature, and read reports by/for service and warranty providers. They have actual hard data on the types and frequency of problems across brands and models. But back to the main theme of the article: hell to the no was my initial attitude, and I went out of my way to make sure my appliances were as simple as possible. Still, three out of the five were "wifi-enabled" and promised a world of app-enhanced wonders. Needless to say, none of these ever even got anywhere near being set up, and I think I am lucky, all the normal, expected appliance features work without requiring these extras. The idea of remotely preheating my oven while I am not home still makes me shudder.

MarkusWandel 2y ago
I ask my friends and colleagues. Lots of them have Bosch dishwashers and they all love them, without exception. That's why I bought mine. Ask me in 10 years whether that was wise...
odysseus 2y ago
Where can you find these service/warranty reports?
- btbuildem 2y ago
  It's been a while, so these may be out of date: - https://blog.puls.com/top-appliance-brands-2020-guide https://blog.puls.com/top-appliance-brands-2020-guide - https://cdn2.hubspot.net/hubfs/4039866/National%20Appliance%20Repair%20Report%20FINAL_EDITS.pdf https://cdn2.hubspot.net/hubfs/4039866/National%20Appliance%... - https://blog.yaleappliance.com/is-consumer-reports-accurate-for-reliability https://blog.yaleappliance.com/is-consumer-reports-accurate-... Also: please do your own homework, you should be able to find all this once pointed in the right direction.
  - MetaWhirledPeas 2y ago
    That first link lists Bosch as the #1 recommended dishwasher by technicians, haha. Thanks for the links though.
m463 2y ago
> Needless to say, none of these ever even got anywhere near being set up, I have an LG soundbar never set up, or connected to any wifi. and when my phone gets near it, it asks to connect to an airplay device. I think that might be a fatal flaw to even getting a wifi enabled device - maybe someone in the adjacent apartment can do the initial setup if you didn't. hopefully these devices have a physical component to initial setup, and are not succeptible to denial-of-service type attacks.
- leonidasv 2y ago
  I live in an apartment. When I go to my living room, a pop-up shows on my phone (Samsung Galaxy) asking if I want to connect to a Samsung TV and cast my phone. The catch is: I don't have any Samsung TV in my home. It's the neighbours TV. It happened even when my Bluetooth was disabled, somehow the phone still reached the TV wirelessly. Thank God there's a setting to turn this "feature" off.
  - account42 2y ago
    I have a Samsung TV (never connected to the the internet in any form, just connected to my PC via HDMI) and a Samsung phone and never had either ask anything about the other. Curious what would trigger that. Possible that I disabled things I know I won't need and forgot about it.
- atoav 2y ago
  I have wifi enables debices that I decided to build myself because in that market segment nobody offered a no-bullshit option that works with home-assistant.
paradox460 2y ago
The best friend you can make is an appliance repair man. Ask him which brands are good and which bad, and you'll rarely be steered awry
- alt227 2y ago
  I asked the local appliance repair man which was the best brand for kitchen appliance reliability and he said Bosch.
  - addandsubtract 2y ago
    Isn't the best appliance one that a repair man hasn't heard of?
brikym 2y ago
Where do you find this data? The average person is going to use Google and because Google sucks they'll end up on some shill review site.
- btbuildem 2y ago
  It's been a while, so these may be out of date: - https://blog.puls.com/top-appliance-brands-2020-guide https://blog.puls.com/top-appliance-brands-2020-guide - https://cdn2.hubspot.net/hubfs/4039866/National%20Appliance%20Repair%20Report%20FINAL_EDITS.pdf https://cdn2.hubspot.net/hubfs/4039866/National%20Appliance%... - https://blog.yaleappliance.com/is-consumer-reports-accurate-for-reliability https://blog.yaleappliance.com/is-consumer-reports-accurate-... Also: please do your own homework, you should be able to find all this once pointed in the right direction.
StrLght 2y ago
I usually go through manuals if I’m worried about something specific. There’s no need to rely on reviews when you can get an answer directly from the manufacturer. Jeff shows manual explicitly saying when you need an app, so this could have been avoided.
potato3732842 2y ago
Consumer reports has been not just bad but actively untrustworthy ever since they framed the Samurai, probably before.
- catigula 2y ago
  Consumer reports for me embodies the phenomenon where, whenever I have even cursory familiarity with the subject material, their reporting (ratings/reviews) become laughably inaccurate and misinformed from my perspective.
nikcub 2y ago
Download and read the manual before buying a product. I avoided buying an air filter recently because the manual made it clear that there was no auto mode, which I would have expected at the price. Downloading the manual may have helped Jeff dodge this product. Web search has become a nightmare for consumer purchase research - it's all affiliate driven. Even the old traditional trusted names are just phoning it in with affiliate content churn.
Izkata 2y ago
> The idea of remotely preheating my oven while I am not home still makes me shudder. Electric ovens can be terrifying when they fail: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UrL_9K7rCz8 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UrL_9K7rCz8 Mine was throwing a lot more sparks than in this video. It sounded like fireworks were going off in my kitchen.
- account42 2y ago
  What's the failure mode here? Heating coil making contact with the outer casing? Shouldn't that be caught by a residual-current circuit breaker? In any case, generating lots of heat inside the oven is probably safer than doing it outside it.
  - saltcured 2y ago
    That looks like a fractured heating element that now identifies as a welder.
tchalla 2y ago
It would help if you’d have posted an example of reports for service and warranty.
- btbuildem 2y ago
  It's been a while, so these may be out of date: - https://blog.puls.com/top-appliance-brands-2020-guide https://blog.puls.com/top-appliance-brands-2020-guide - https://cdn2.hubspot.net/hubfs/4039866/National%20Appliance%20Repair%20Report%20FINAL_EDITS.pdf https://cdn2.hubspot.net/hubfs/4039866/National%20Appliance%... - https://blog.yaleappliance.com/is-consumer-reports-accurate-for-reliability https://blog.yaleappliance.com/is-consumer-reports-accurate-... Also: please do your own homework, you should be able to find all this once pointed in the right direction.
oblio 2y ago
> instead, go to industry literature, and read reports by/for service and warranty providers. I'm joining the others in saying I don't know where to find this info...
- btbuildem 2y ago
  It's been a while, so these may be out of date: - https://blog.puls.com/top-appliance-brands-2020-guide https://blog.puls.com/top-appliance-brands-2020-guide - https://cdn2.hubspot.net/hubfs/4039866/National%20Appliance%20Repair%20Report%20FINAL_EDITS.pdf https://cdn2.hubspot.net/hubfs/4039866/National%20Appliance%... - https://blog.yaleappliance.com/is-consumer-reports-accurate-for-reliability https://blog.yaleappliance.com/is-consumer-reports-accurate-... Also: please do your own homework, you should be able to find all this once pointed in the right direction.
jjice 2y ago
> don't read consumer reports or reviews by randos on the internet I like the idea of using industry literature, but I think consumer reviews have value too. Much smaller purchase, but I was considering a new travel thermos and all the professional review were praising it. As soon as I pulled up some consumer reviews though, it was almost universal that after washing it for the first time, it smelled of garlic and soy sauce. Apparently this issue was around for at least three years (into today). Not sure why that got passed over by all the professionals (maybe a lack of time spent with the product), but I was glad I read the consumer reviews as well.
- account42 2y ago
  I don't gp was suggesting to trust professional reviewers but rather professionals who actually have to work with/repair the product in question. But I do agree that that won't cover everything. Issues that need repair are a big concern but so is usability when the damned things are working "properly".

MarkusWandel 2y ago

I ask my friends and colleagues. Lots of them have Bosch dishwashers and they all love them, without exception. That's why I bought mine. Ask me in 10 years whether that was wise...

odysseus 2y ago

Where can you find these service/warranty reports?

btbuildem 2y ago
It's been a while, so these may be out of date: - https://blog.puls.com/top-appliance-brands-2020-guide https://blog.puls.com/top-appliance-brands-2020-guide - https://cdn2.hubspot.net/hubfs/4039866/National%20Appliance%20Repair%20Report%20FINAL_EDITS.pdf https://cdn2.hubspot.net/hubfs/4039866/National%20Appliance%... - https://blog.yaleappliance.com/is-consumer-reports-accurate-for-reliability https://blog.yaleappliance.com/is-consumer-reports-accurate-... Also: please do your own homework, you should be able to find all this once pointed in the right direction.
- MetaWhirledPeas 2y ago
  That first link lists Bosch as the #1 recommended dishwasher by technicians, haha. Thanks for the links though.

m463 2y ago

> Needless to say, none of these ever even got anywhere near being set up, I have an LG soundbar never set up, or connected to any wifi. and when my phone gets near it, it asks to connect to an airplay device. I think that might be a fatal flaw to even getting a wifi enabled device - maybe someone in the adjacent apartment can do the initial setup if you didn't. hopefully these devices have a physical component to initial setup, and are not succeptible to denial-of-service type attacks.

leonidasv 2y ago
I live in an apartment. When I go to my living room, a pop-up shows on my phone (Samsung Galaxy) asking if I want to connect to a Samsung TV and cast my phone. The catch is: I don't have any Samsung TV in my home. It's the neighbours TV. It happened even when my Bluetooth was disabled, somehow the phone still reached the TV wirelessly. Thank God there's a setting to turn this "feature" off.
- account42 2y ago
  I have a Samsung TV (never connected to the the internet in any form, just connected to my PC via HDMI) and a Samsung phone and never had either ask anything about the other. Curious what would trigger that. Possible that I disabled things I know I won't need and forgot about it.
atoav 2y ago
I have wifi enables debices that I decided to build myself because in that market segment nobody offered a no-bullshit option that works with home-assistant.

paradox460 2y ago

The best friend you can make is an appliance repair man. Ask him which brands are good and which bad, and you'll rarely be steered awry

alt227 2y ago
I asked the local appliance repair man which was the best brand for kitchen appliance reliability and he said Bosch.
- addandsubtract 2y ago
  Isn't the best appliance one that a repair man hasn't heard of?

brikym 2y ago

Where do you find this data? The average person is going to use Google and because Google sucks they'll end up on some shill review site.

btbuildem 2y ago
It's been a while, so these may be out of date: - https://blog.puls.com/top-appliance-brands-2020-guide https://blog.puls.com/top-appliance-brands-2020-guide - https://cdn2.hubspot.net/hubfs/4039866/National%20Appliance%20Repair%20Report%20FINAL_EDITS.pdf https://cdn2.hubspot.net/hubfs/4039866/National%20Appliance%... - https://blog.yaleappliance.com/is-consumer-reports-accurate-for-reliability https://blog.yaleappliance.com/is-consumer-reports-accurate-... Also: please do your own homework, you should be able to find all this once pointed in the right direction.

StrLght 2y ago

I usually go through manuals if I’m worried about something specific. There’s no need to rely on reviews when you can get an answer directly from the manufacturer. Jeff shows manual explicitly saying when you need an app, so this could have been avoided.

potato3732842 2y ago

Consumer reports has been not just bad but actively untrustworthy ever since they framed the Samurai, probably before.

catigula 2y ago
Consumer reports for me embodies the phenomenon where, whenever I have even cursory familiarity with the subject material, their reporting (ratings/reviews) become laughably inaccurate and misinformed from my perspective.

nikcub 2y ago

Download and read the manual before buying a product. I avoided buying an air filter recently because the manual made it clear that there was no auto mode, which I would have expected at the price. Downloading the manual may have helped Jeff dodge this product. Web search has become a nightmare for consumer purchase research - it's all affiliate driven. Even the old traditional trusted names are just phoning it in with affiliate content churn.

Izkata 2y ago

> The idea of remotely preheating my oven while I am not home still makes me shudder. Electric ovens can be terrifying when they fail: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UrL_9K7rCz8 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UrL_9K7rCz8 Mine was throwing a lot more sparks than in this video. It sounded like fireworks were going off in my kitchen.

account42 2y ago
What's the failure mode here? Heating coil making contact with the outer casing? Shouldn't that be caught by a residual-current circuit breaker? In any case, generating lots of heat inside the oven is probably safer than doing it outside it.
- saltcured 2y ago
  That looks like a fractured heating element that now identifies as a welder.

tchalla 2y ago

It would help if you’d have posted an example of reports for service and warranty.

btbuildem 2y ago
It's been a while, so these may be out of date: - https://blog.puls.com/top-appliance-brands-2020-guide https://blog.puls.com/top-appliance-brands-2020-guide - https://cdn2.hubspot.net/hubfs/4039866/National%20Appliance%20Repair%20Report%20FINAL_EDITS.pdf https://cdn2.hubspot.net/hubfs/4039866/National%20Appliance%... - https://blog.yaleappliance.com/is-consumer-reports-accurate-for-reliability https://blog.yaleappliance.com/is-consumer-reports-accurate-... Also: please do your own homework, you should be able to find all this once pointed in the right direction.

oblio 2y ago

> instead, go to industry literature, and read reports by/for service and warranty providers. I'm joining the others in saying I don't know where to find this info...

btbuildem 2y ago
It's been a while, so these may be out of date: - https://blog.puls.com/top-appliance-brands-2020-guide https://blog.puls.com/top-appliance-brands-2020-guide - https://cdn2.hubspot.net/hubfs/4039866/National%20Appliance%20Repair%20Report%20FINAL_EDITS.pdf https://cdn2.hubspot.net/hubfs/4039866/National%20Appliance%... - https://blog.yaleappliance.com/is-consumer-reports-accurate-for-reliability https://blog.yaleappliance.com/is-consumer-reports-accurate-... Also: please do your own homework, you should be able to find all this once pointed in the right direction.

jjice 2y ago

> don't read consumer reports or reviews by randos on the internet I like the idea of using industry literature, but I think consumer reviews have value too. Much smaller purchase, but I was considering a new travel thermos and all the professional review were praising it. As soon as I pulled up some consumer reviews though, it was almost universal that after washing it for the first time, it smelled of garlic and soy sauce. Apparently this issue was around for at least three years (into today). Not sure why that got passed over by all the professionals (maybe a lack of time spent with the product), but I was glad I read the consumer reviews as well.

account42 2y ago
I don't gp was suggesting to trust professional reviewers but rather professionals who actually have to work with/repair the product in question. But I do agree that that won't cover everything. Issues that need repair are a big concern but so is usability when the damned things are working "properly".