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Tesla was hit by a wave of protests, sales are crashing, insiders are waking up
- nashashmi 2y agoRepeating this again: Tesla would be more successful without Elon Musk … leading any longer.
- kcplate 2y agoPerhaps now with all his controversies…but Tesla would not be the company it is today without him. Musk may not be a genius engineer and is a shit human, but what he is—wealthy and willing to make risky bleeding edge tech investments with extremely long ROIs and have the patience to wait them out is what makes Tesla, SpaceX, and Starlink names we all know.
- nashashmi 2y agoIt is that sense of undisciplined risk taking that I am referring to. Model Y was supposed to be a money maker. Instead he let the better part get to him and added so many bells and whistles that it delayed it and was not even cheap. Tesla production had so many problems before. Lots of jobs were lost because of this. Guess who remembers those job cuts? Me. Part of me believes anyone with slightly more discipline could have done a better job.
- kcplate 2y agoWith any other investor those production issues would never had existed because the production lines themselves would have never existed. Most normal capital providers would have not allowed or taken such a bold risk. So is it sad that jobs were lost? Sure. But they existed at one point when otherwise wouldn’t have with the standard more risk averse investor looking for a more immediate ROI. His lack of discipline and departure from conventional wisdom is the reason Tesla, SpaceX exist today. Without his patience and capital they would all be footnotes of failed companies in their respective industries. I think you could probably make the argument that those industries might not even be serious if Musk’s risks and patience didn’t demonstrate their viability.
- nashashmi 2y agoYou are claiming that without Elon, there would be no Tesla. That is acknowledged. He should not be the leader anymore. And should not have been the leader for a while. > His lack of discipline and departure from conventional wisdom is the reason ... ... he is good at startups. Without his resources (network of talent located in Tesla and SpaceX), none of those startups would do anywhere as well. But Tesla and SpaceX would do better!
- johnnyanmac 2y agoThe discipline line isn't even that high. Just stay down and stay quiet until you have a press release. Like every other billionaire did. But given his Twitter habits it's clear that he has this compulsive need to be in the limelight, no matter the method nor perception.
- denverllc 2y agoI count 14 (maybe 15?) people in that first protest photo.
- janesvilleseo 2y agoYeah, but that is where it starts. It’s like people who comment vs just reading/sharing the same opinion. Only a tiny fraction speak out. There are lots more who share the same opinion but just haven’t/don’t voice it. Additionally there are those who attended the other rallies yesterday not at the dealerships but at other locations holding signs declaring their opinion towards Musk. Hell, I just paid off my Tesla and I’m thinking of dumping it because I don’t want to be seen as someone who supports him. The brand is 100% tarnished. Only when sales/stock price take a long sustained hit will there be anything done. They only care about their money.
- jrs235 2y ago>Only when sales/stock price take a long sustained hit will there be anything done. He'll sue everyone for not buying his cars or have the DoJ go after the protesters claiming some sort of illegal boycott...
- kcplate 2y agoYep, it’s a mob of epic proportions. My neighborhood of 250 homes gets at least that many protesting when the HOA sends out nastygrams about dirty mailboxes. We never even make the local community news. Maybe if I can get Musk to join the HOA we could get some exposure.
- johnnyanmac 2y agoI saw other photos in the bay area large enough to ock roads. Other people are also protesting at Capitols all over the country.
- the_duke 2y agoThere's a reason most CEOs and billionaires try to stay out of the spotlight and try to influence things behind the scenes instead. We'll see how things turn out for Musk in a few years. At least Starlink, and hence Spacex, won't be affected too much, the service is too valuable for the US military, various industries (aviation, maritime) and also private customers as long as no credible alternative is in sight.
- InDubioProRubio 2y agoBut the isolationists are devaluing the military industrial complex? If you cant buy protection via shoddy equipment purchases - then war goods what are they good for? The first mafiosi patron running a protection racket into the ground.
- nashashmi 2y agoI think for Elon, he has long figured out the same thing Donald Trump figured out that the way to success is by saying brash things that you are always in the spotlight and therefore always known. Tesla and other stocks are not valuated based on the economics. They are meme stocks. Inflated because of gen y/z bros. Uber was the same way a few years ago when Travis was there. For as long as they are doing something "cool" like Tesla Robots, the stock will get attention, nvm that the robots were fake. Without Elon, Starlink would get a more microscopic examination and it would likely not have investors' drive that a stalwart would bring.
- johnnyanmac 2y agoWell it's a good thing he fired the FDA workers who were investigating Starlink. Definitely not something competitors can do.
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- johnnyanmac 2y ago
- twilo 2y ago[flagged]
- unwind 2y agoIn what way doesn't it "make sense"? If supporting such a company (and, thus, owner/CEO/figurehead) makes you feel bad, why should you do it? Perhaps it doesn't make financial sense, assuming the boycotted product is truly the best but that is not the only dimensions humans operate in, right?
- eigart 2y agoI drive a Model X. It is not well engineered.
- sympil 2y ago… well engineered product.. The cybertruck is not well engineered. Maybe their other cars are but not the cybertruck. Why is everything so political… I have no obligation to buy a product that enriches a person as shitty as Elon Musk. Politicization by boycotting his products is warranted though.
- mschuster91 2y ago> Why is everything so political it makes no sense to not buy a well engineered product because you don’t agree with someone’s political views. The "someone" in question literally threw Hitler salutes on an open stage in front of the whole world watching. That's beyond "political views", that's beyond "hysterical takes" - there are lines that plainly should not be crossed. In any case, Tesla and "well engineered" doesn't match up either, at least when looking beyond the drivetrain. Rust, poor fitting of surfaces, the Cybertruck being too unsafe to legally drive on European roads, issues with modern ECUs, long lead times for basic spare parts... need I continue?
- riedel 2y agoTell that to anyone demanding tariffs. I think we are beyond 'making sense' already.
- orwin 2y agoAre you part of the people who said to kids "vote with your wallet if you're unhappy"? Because i'd love to see the Wenn diagram of people who complain about things being "too political" and people saying to two generations "vote with your wallet" or something among the line of "you're free to buy something else/change operator". Probably a nice oblong.
- eigart 2y agoThe stock price is fucked if Musk leaves. The car business might survive, though. I have no faith they can deliver on FSD/optimus/AI/cheap model. But with SEC kneecapped, I think the next rabbit out of Elon’s hat will be spectacular.
- InDubioProRubio 2y agoThe OG Moist von Lipwig
- ninalanyon 2y agoYes and still in his Albert Spangler phase. But would he become a moral person if offered an angel by Lord Vetinari?
- ffsm8 2y agoMore spectacular then the self driving cars in 2014, people on Mars in 2024 and a Hyperloop that's shuffling ppl in a vacuum pipe? Frankly, I'm not sure how much further we can go. It's been full on fantasy tech since he's become well known. While the self driving works surprisingly well in 2025, it's been 11 years since the promised date and you still get the occasional assisted suicide attempt via Tesla in the news. (Near fatal crashes while not paying attention because of "self driving")
- thih9 2y ago> senior managers said that they believe “the company would be better off if Musk resigned.” Would that even help at this point? The association between musk and tesla would still remain - e.g. musk’s ownership of tesla shares is a pop culture topic at this point.
- ryandvm 2y agoIndeed. I wouldn't even consider buying a Tesla if it means that I'll be funding Incel Stark's future forays into political terrorism.
- johnnyanmac 2y agoDepends. for T$LA? It'd be catastrophic since it's a massively overvalued stock propped up by Musk hype. It would drop to slightly above average values and they'd be lucky if they were still in thr fortune 100. For Tesla as a company? It's be a huge wound but the reputation would improve in all metrics if Musk stepped down. Employee morale would go up, there's probably be less corner cutting with build quality, they may actually be able to adopt LiDAR and have a proper FSD one day, and they can start to rebuild their foreign relations So your answer depends on if you think a company is bound to its shareholders or to their customers and workers. Sadly there's a clear answer in America.
- mrtksn 2y agoLike 2 years ago I wrote: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=34158126 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=34158126 >Many people don't like what the owners of Chick-fil-A are up to but apparently they do really good chicken at fair price so people keep buying it anyway. I would guess that Tesla is losing the premium they can put to their prices and that is pushing Tesla value to a transactional value. No more apologists for the build quality or features that are pay now get it next year(every year, next year), if Tesla makes good cars and sell them at good price people will buy and if they don't people won't I still think its true, if Tesla makes good cars they will sell at fair value(no more premium to save the planet). In Turkey for example, no one is protesting Tesla even though there were huge protests in support of Palestine. Musk is literally in the US government, literally was the biggest supporter of Trump who announced ethnic cleansing intentions and no one in Turkey associate the brand with this stuff. For some reason they associate Coca-Cola, Starbucks, McDonald's, Burger King etc but never Tesla. Influencers close to the organizations doing the protests even work with Tesla on promotional content. I tried mentioning this to see what they think in automotive forums, it gained no traction. Tesla's are good value in Turkey thanks to the tax breaks on electric cars, no one wants to hear the political aspects.
- taylodl 2y agoThere's a huge difference between spending $10 at Chick-fil-A and spending $50K on a Tesla. Automobiles are the second most expensive item people purchase. They think a little more about that purchase than they do a chicken sandwich. I don't know specifically what's going on in Turkey, but I have seen that January sales in Europe had dropped an average of 50%. That kind of sales decline should make anyone sit up and take notice.
- mrtksn 2y agoI don't disagree, it's just that in UK people have plenty of options and can choose to make a political statement but I would be surprised if they still will do that if Tesla was such a good deal like in Turkey(in the Turkish case, the taxes on ICE are outrageous and as a result a Model 3 would cost about the same as VW Golf).
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- janesvilleseo 2y agoInteresting, this post was removed (shadow delisted). I don't see it on the in the first 3 pages anymore after it was at number 11 just a few minutes ago.
- cglace 2y agoMost doge/musk things are disappearing.
- beretguy 2y ago[flagged]
- hyperbrainer 2y ago[flagged]
- eigart 2y agoAren’t they normally marked with “flagged” or something?
- stavros 2y agoIt's on the front page for me.
- jrs235 2y agoTo see and find popular but flagged stories use hckrnews.com as your entry point.
- ryandvm 2y agoMan, for a place that supposedly considers itself a bastion of free thinkers, we sure do spend a lot of time quarreling about self-censorship.
- jkmcf 2y agoIsn’t that the way politics is now? Freedom of speech for me, but not for thee? Or is it, My speech is free, but yours are lies? Hypocrisy everywhere.
- nprateem 2y agoMeh for every 1 person who cares, 10 people don't. Plus the media loves a fall from grace story. I think they'll be fine once the new model is out.
- wtcactus 2y ago[flagged]
- hollywood_court 2y agoMy coworker is an avid MAGA type or at least he was. He kept a framed photo of Trump in his office. He and his wife own two Teslas. My coworker's combat veteran son lost his job in Huntsville last week. A direct result of Elon and his meddling. Two weeks ago, my coworker's elderly neighbored committed suicide after learning that they wouldn't be able to afford their medication each month. My coworker took his Trump photo down the next day and he has been trying to sell both of his Teslas. People are definitely waking up and changing.
- jrs235 2y agoBut are they just trying to hide and conceal they still support him, trying to hide and conceal that they supported him, or do they truly regret and repent for supporting him?
- hollywood_court 2y agoBased on my anecdotes, most probably fit in the former category. It takes a great deal of hate and bigotry to be able to support someone like Trump in the first place. That doesn't go away over night. But I think a lot of them are trying to hide their support because they know that their votes are actively making America worse. But the original hatred and bigotry remain.
- protimewaster 2y agoI think one of the problems Tesla is going to have is that those who agree with Musk are often conservatives who are on average not very interested in buying any electric car. And those who are interested in buying an electric car are more likely to be liberal and dislike Musk.
- 762236 2y agoI can't wait to buy the new Model Y. Fantastic car. If I were to choose products based on the CEO's behavior outside the company (vs their behavior running the company), I'd have no time left to live, and I wouldn't be buying anything from communist and other authoritarian countries.
- johnnyanmac 2y agoIs Korea and Japan communist, authoritarian companies? My impression is that Hyundai and Kia has more than caught up on Evs now. Japan isnt that far back either. You can't buy a Chinese car even if you wanted to because we have like 200% tarriffs on them. Great response to competition, America.
- 762236 2y agoTo clarify, I make decisions based on how good the product is, not who the CEO is, nor what country it is coming from. I think it is hypocritical of people to reject Teslas because of Musk's opinions or civic contributions.
- johnnyanmac 2y agoOkay, that's your opinion to have. Meanwhile, reality is based on reputation and contracts are lost over behavior all the time. The original form of "politically correct" was an etiquette meant to minimize those odds of losses due to bad PR. I do think the opinion of this clashes with your stance on not wanting to buy "communist" country products though.
- dikaio 2y ago[flagged]
- bryanlarsen 2y agoYou do realize that Trump increased the deficit almost twice as much as Biden did? (Trump: $8.3T, Biden: $4.6T) Anyone truly concerned about the deficit should have voted Democrat. As for corruption, you realize that the 2nd largest donor to the Democratic party (SBF) is in jail now. OTOH, the largest donors to the Trump campaign were appointed to positions of power.
- hollywood_court 2y agoFacts and truth don't matter to these types. It's all about 'owning the libs' regardless of what it costs. These types love to shoot themselves in the foot.
- dikaio 2y ago[flagged]
- hollywood_court 2y agoWas this designed to be some kind of personal attack because you read that I was divorced? I wish my ex would find a new man so she'd stop texting me and asking me to help her with random stuff.
- dikaio 2y ago[flagged]
- ivewonyoung 2y ago> You do realize that Trump increased the deficit almost twice as much as Biden did? (Trump: $8.3T, Biden: $4.6T) Why is that talking point, I mean statistic, not adjusted for the pandemic? I think I know why. Also deficit spending and govt spending continued to be high or increasing during 2022/2023 when inflation was taking off because the post covid economy was heating up, resulting in stubborn inflation that hurt the most vulnerable folks.
- akagusu 2y agoIncredible how everything about Musk is been censored and people don't care.
- nh23423fefe 2y ago[flagged]
- butterlettuce 2y agoThank you! It seems like the people from r/politics are coming over here to astroturf and it needs to stop. To hell with their "bastion of free thinkers" attitude when the discussions surrounding such divisive topics aren't even productive. It's just rage bait. If I want to stress myself out, I'll go and read world news.
- johnnyanmac 2y agoNo, the people who talked about Elon Musk for 12+ years are continuing to talk about Elon Musk. Just because you don't like the stories doesn't mean people will stop posting about him.
- johnnyanmac 2y agoI always prescribed to "don't like it, don't read it" personally. And it's not my fault Musk decided to go political. I remember the cravings from years back. >It just means you read boring shit. Life isn't candy and rainbows. Gotta eat your veggies and be aware of the world around you.
- nh23423fefe 2y agoI don't like posts about privacy or drm for example. But those are on topic. This place was obsessed with snowden for years. On topic. Live tweeting the ongoing "coup" isnt vegetables or awareness. It's deranged political obsession masquerading as social responsibility. I don't need someone to mash F5 on cnn.com and sprint here to tell me the sky is falling. No really this time its different because <current administration> blah blah
- RickJWagner 2y ago“ When a true genius appears, you can know him by this sign: that all the dunces are in a confederacy against him.” Jonathan Swift
- scblock 2y agoAnd when all the dunces celebrate someone, what does that mean?
- throw16180339 2y agoIt often means that they're elected to public office.
- johnnyanmac 2y agoThey didn't conspire against him until he did things unrelated to his renown that is simply in bad taste.
- Vaslo 2y ago[flagged]