4 ms·

I googled "Elon Musk nazi salute", and all I'm seeing is "apparent", in the Guardian. You're just flat out wrong.

baobabKoodaa 2y ago
Here's what you said: > the closest the mass media came to calling a spade a spade was saying things like "alleged resemblance to a Roman salute". Here's the Guardian: > ‘The gesture speaks for itself’: Germans respond to Musk’s apparent Nazi salute Can you see how you didn't accurately describe the text "apparent Nazi salute" when you chose the words "alleged resemblance to a Roman salute"? There's a word for what you did. It's "lying".
_heimdall 2y ago
What would you like them to have said? Most would agree what he did appeared similar to a Nazi salute. Describing it as an "apparent" Nazi salute seems accurate.
- baobabKoodaa 2y ago
  His claim is that nobody is calling at an "apparent Nazi salute". According to him, the MOST anyone is claiming is that it is an "apparent Roman salute". This is a lie, as multiple mainstream news outlets are in fact using the word "Nazi" as opposed to the word "Roman".
  - _heimdall 2y ago
    I may have misread the comment chain here, I thought others had already linked to articles referring to it as an apparent Nazi salute. That's my bad if I was mistaken here. There are many references to it in major media outlets though, including this one [1] in the New York Times raising the fact that it was being referred to in strange ways like "Roman salute." [1] https://www.nytimes.com/2025/01/24/world/europe/elon-musk-roman-salute-nazi.html https://www.nytimes.com/2025/01/24/world/europe/elon-musk-ro...
    - wesselbindt 2y ago
      The headline was "Hitler dead", not "Hitler apparently dead". The headline was "Apartheid ended", not "Apartheid ended, allegedly". If a prime minister gets shot and dies, the headline's "prime minister murdered", not "prime minister possibly murdered" or "prime minister dies, possible connection to being shot beforehand". The headline should be "Elon Musk does Hitler salute on stage", but it isn't. It should be a really big deal, but somehow, it isn't.
      - _heimdall 2y ago
        You're confusing what is probable fact and what requires intent. I don't know what Elon's intentions are and wouldn't begin to guess. There is a huge difference, though, in being able to say factually that someone was murdered or that the legal system of apartheid ended and saying why you believe someone made a certain gesture. Anyone could raise their arm and accidentally make a motion similar to a Nazi salute, hell I wouldn't be surprised if you could find a few videos of John McCain making a similar gesture due to his shoulder injuries. Making that gesture doesn't make you a Nazi or it a Nazi salute, why you make that gesture is what decides that.
        wesselbindt 2y ago
        Alright, the guy retweeting eugenics and antisemitic replacement theory content, cozying up to a German neo-nazi party with prominent holocaust denying members threw a gesture twice that is exactly the same in shape and context as the Hitler salute, but we better give him the benefit of the doubt. This is absolutely ridiculous.
        _heimdall 2y ago
        Its not about giving benefit of the doubt. Do you see no difference in assuming intent from a physical gesture and factually stating someone is dead or a sociopolitical system has been officially ended?
        2y ago
synarchefriend 2y ago
You would need to be severely intellectually challenged to think Musk actually intended to give a Nazi salute. The idea is so preposterous I refuse to believe you actually believe that. Or perhaps I am underestimating how detached from reality political fervor can make people.
- lupusreal 2y ago
  Elon Musk's coming was literally prophesied by a certain infamous Nazi rocket scientist. I don't expect rational science-minded materialists to believe in spooky magic but at the very least the psychological impact of that apparent prophesy on the man himself should be considered. He probably meant it. Edit for requested source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_Mars%3A_A_Technical_Tale#The_%22Elon%22 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_Mars%3A_A_Technical_Ta...
  - janderson215 2y ago
    Can you please share more about this prophecy? A like would be helpful.
  - _heimdall 2y ago
    The description linked seems like a real stretch to me for it to be considered a prophecy. The only overlap I see with reality is that both Mars and the name Elon are mentioned together. The author wrote the store around 40 years in his future. We have yet to send a mission to mars, meaning he was off by at least 40 more years. "Elon" in the story is the title used by the martian leader, not the martian's name and definitely not the human billionaire seeking to make the mission happen. How exactly is it a literal prophecy?
- throwaway173738 2y ago
  Look, I think it’s open to some interpretation here. Not being willing to admit the possibility might get us into a very bad situation. Much like following someone in Amsterdam because they offered to show you how to get somewhere might get you mugged.

Here's what you said: > the closest the mass media came to calling a spade a spade was saying things like "alleged resemblance to a Roman salute". Here's the Guardian: > ‘The gesture speaks for itself’: Germans respond to Musk’s apparent Nazi salute Can you see how you didn't accurately describe the text "apparent Nazi salute" when you chose the words "alleged resemblance to a Roman salute"? There's a word for what you did. It's "lying".

_heimdall 2y ago

What would you like them to have said? Most would agree what he did appeared similar to a Nazi salute. Describing it as an "apparent" Nazi salute seems accurate.

baobabKoodaa 2y ago
His claim is that nobody is calling at an "apparent Nazi salute". According to him, the MOST anyone is claiming is that it is an "apparent Roman salute". This is a lie, as multiple mainstream news outlets are in fact using the word "Nazi" as opposed to the word "Roman".
- _heimdall 2y ago
  I may have misread the comment chain here, I thought others had already linked to articles referring to it as an apparent Nazi salute. That's my bad if I was mistaken here. There are many references to it in major media outlets though, including this one [1] in the New York Times raising the fact that it was being referred to in strange ways like "Roman salute." [1] https://www.nytimes.com/2025/01/24/world/europe/elon-musk-roman-salute-nazi.html https://www.nytimes.com/2025/01/24/world/europe/elon-musk-ro...
  - wesselbindt 2y ago
    The headline was "Hitler dead", not "Hitler apparently dead". The headline was "Apartheid ended", not "Apartheid ended, allegedly". If a prime minister gets shot and dies, the headline's "prime minister murdered", not "prime minister possibly murdered" or "prime minister dies, possible connection to being shot beforehand". The headline should be "Elon Musk does Hitler salute on stage", but it isn't. It should be a really big deal, but somehow, it isn't.
    - _heimdall 2y ago
      You're confusing what is probable fact and what requires intent. I don't know what Elon's intentions are and wouldn't begin to guess. There is a huge difference, though, in being able to say factually that someone was murdered or that the legal system of apartheid ended and saying why you believe someone made a certain gesture. Anyone could raise their arm and accidentally make a motion similar to a Nazi salute, hell I wouldn't be surprised if you could find a few videos of John McCain making a similar gesture due to his shoulder injuries. Making that gesture doesn't make you a Nazi or it a Nazi salute, why you make that gesture is what decides that.
      - wesselbindt 2y ago
        Alright, the guy retweeting eugenics and antisemitic replacement theory content, cozying up to a German neo-nazi party with prominent holocaust denying members threw a gesture twice that is exactly the same in shape and context as the Hitler salute, but we better give him the benefit of the doubt. This is absolutely ridiculous.
        _heimdall 2y ago
        Its not about giving benefit of the doubt. Do you see no difference in assuming intent from a physical gesture and factually stating someone is dead or a sociopolitical system has been officially ended?
        2y ago

synarchefriend 2y ago

You would need to be severely intellectually challenged to think Musk actually intended to give a Nazi salute. The idea is so preposterous I refuse to believe you actually believe that. Or perhaps I am underestimating how detached from reality political fervor can make people.

lupusreal 2y ago
Elon Musk's coming was literally prophesied by a certain infamous Nazi rocket scientist. I don't expect rational science-minded materialists to believe in spooky magic but at the very least the psychological impact of that apparent prophesy on the man himself should be considered. He probably meant it. Edit for requested source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_Mars%3A_A_Technical_Tale#The_%22Elon%22 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_Mars%3A_A_Technical_Ta...
- janderson215 2y ago
  Can you please share more about this prophecy? A like would be helpful.
- _heimdall 2y ago
  The description linked seems like a real stretch to me for it to be considered a prophecy. The only overlap I see with reality is that both Mars and the name Elon are mentioned together. The author wrote the store around 40 years in his future. We have yet to send a mission to mars, meaning he was off by at least 40 more years. "Elon" in the story is the title used by the martian leader, not the martian's name and definitely not the human billionaire seeking to make the mission happen. How exactly is it a literal prophecy?
throwaway173738 2y ago
Look, I think it’s open to some interpretation here. Not being willing to admit the possibility might get us into a very bad situation. Much like following someone in Amsterdam because they offered to show you how to get somewhere might get you mugged.