11 ms·

This story happened in my backyard. The shootout was about 40 minutes from me but Youngblut and Felix Bauckholt were reported by a hotel clerk dressed in tactic

This story happened in my backyard. The shootout was about 40 minutes from me but Youngblut and Felix Bauckholt were reported by a hotel clerk dressed in tactical gear and sporting firearms in a hotel a few blocks from me. Weird to see a community I followed show up so close to home and negatively like this. I always just read LW and appreciated some of the fundamentals that this group seems to have ignored. Stuff like rationality has to objectively make your life and the world better or its a failed ideology. Edit: I've been following this story for over a week because it was local news. Why is this showing up here on HN now?

wetpaws 2y ago
[dead]
dang 2y ago
(To answer that last procedural question: there have been assorted submissions, but none spent much time on the front page. More at https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42901777 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42901777)
k8sToGo 2y ago
Why does a hotel clerk wear tactical gear and guns?
- tsimionescu 2y ago
  That sentence was slightly awkward, the hotel clerk reported that those two people were in tactical gear with guns.
ddtaylor 2y ago
What is LW?
- thomaslangston 2y ago
  Less Wrong
Aurornis 2y ago
> Weird to see a community I followed show up so close to home and negatively like this. I had some coworkers who were really into LessWrong and rationality. I thought it was fun to read some of the selected writings they would share, but I always felt that online rationalist communities collected a lot of people with reactionary, fascist, misogynistic, and far-right tendencies. There’s a heavily sanitized version of rationality and EA that gets presented online with only the highlights, but there’s a lot more out there in the fringes that is really weird. For example, many know about Roko’s Basilisk as a thought exercise and much has been written about it, but fewer know that Roko has been writing misogynistic rants on Twitter and claiming things like having women in the workforce is “very negative” for GDP. The Slate Star Codex subreddit was a home for rationalists on Reddit, but they had so many problems with culture war topics that they banned discussion of them. The users forked off and created “The Motte” which is a bit of a cesspool dressed up with rationalist prose. Even the SlateStarCodex subreddit has become so toxic that I had to unsubscribe. Many of the posts and comments on women or dating were becoming indistinguishable from incel communities other than the rationalist prose style. Even the real-world rationalist and EA communities aren’t immune, with several high profile sexual misconduct scandals making the news in recent years. It’s a weird space. It felt like a fun internet philosophy community when my coworkers introduced it years ago, but the longer I’ve observed it the more I’ve realized it attracts and accepts a lot of people whose goals aren’t aligned with objectively “make the world better” as long as they can write their prose in the rationalist style. It’s been strange to observe. Of course, at every turn people will argue that the bad actors are not true rationalists, but I’ve seen enough from these communities to know that they don’t really discriminate much until issues boil over into the news.
- meowface 2y ago
  For what it's worth, there's a thriving liberal rationalist-adjacent community on Twitter that despises people like Roko.
- kiba 2y ago
  The community/offshoot I am part of is mostly liberal/left. My impression that lesswrong is also liberal/left.
wesapien 2y ago
After seeing this news, I recall watching a video by Julia Galef about "what is rationality". Would it be fair to say that in this situation, they lack epistemic rationality but are high in instrumental rationality?
- olalonde 2y ago
  If they had high instrumental rationality, they would be effective at achieving their goals. That doesn’t seem to be the case - by conventional standards, they would even be considered "losers": jobless, homeless, imprisoned, or on the run.
  - Muromec 2y ago
    That depends on a goal. The goal of a martyr is not life.
- lukan 2y ago
  Hard to say without hearing them speak for themself. So far I have 0 idea of any motive. Supposedly it should be rational, so I would at least like to hear it, before judging deeper.
datadeft 2y ago
Many people were curious here that the perpetrators were using Vim or Emacs.
- b112 2y ago
  Wait, OR?! Clearly this is a poorly organized movement, with wildly different beliefs. There is no unity of purpose here. Emacs or vi, used without core beliefs being challenged?! And one does not form a rationalist movement, and use emacs after all.
- tbrownaw 2y ago
  ed is the standard editor

wetpaws 2y ago

[dead]

dang 2y ago

(To answer that last procedural question: there have been assorted submissions, but none spent much time on the front page. More at https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42901777 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42901777)

k8sToGo 2y ago

Why does a hotel clerk wear tactical gear and guns?

tsimionescu 2y ago
That sentence was slightly awkward, the hotel clerk reported that those two people were in tactical gear with guns.

ddtaylor 2y ago

What is LW?

thomaslangston 2y ago
Less Wrong

Aurornis 2y ago

> Weird to see a community I followed show up so close to home and negatively like this. I had some coworkers who were really into LessWrong and rationality. I thought it was fun to read some of the selected writings they would share, but I always felt that online rationalist communities collected a lot of people with reactionary, fascist, misogynistic, and far-right tendencies. There’s a heavily sanitized version of rationality and EA that gets presented online with only the highlights, but there’s a lot more out there in the fringes that is really weird. For example, many know about Roko’s Basilisk as a thought exercise and much has been written about it, but fewer know that Roko has been writing misogynistic rants on Twitter and claiming things like having women in the workforce is “very negative” for GDP. The Slate Star Codex subreddit was a home for rationalists on Reddit, but they had so many problems with culture war topics that they banned discussion of them. The users forked off and created “The Motte” which is a bit of a cesspool dressed up with rationalist prose. Even the SlateStarCodex subreddit has become so toxic that I had to unsubscribe. Many of the posts and comments on women or dating were becoming indistinguishable from incel communities other than the rationalist prose style. Even the real-world rationalist and EA communities aren’t immune, with several high profile sexual misconduct scandals making the news in recent years. It’s a weird space. It felt like a fun internet philosophy community when my coworkers introduced it years ago, but the longer I’ve observed it the more I’ve realized it attracts and accepts a lot of people whose goals aren’t aligned with objectively “make the world better” as long as they can write their prose in the rationalist style. It’s been strange to observe. Of course, at every turn people will argue that the bad actors are not true rationalists, but I’ve seen enough from these communities to know that they don’t really discriminate much until issues boil over into the news.

meowface 2y ago
For what it's worth, there's a thriving liberal rationalist-adjacent community on Twitter that despises people like Roko.
kiba 2y ago
The community/offshoot I am part of is mostly liberal/left. My impression that lesswrong is also liberal/left.

wesapien 2y ago

After seeing this news, I recall watching a video by Julia Galef about "what is rationality". Would it be fair to say that in this situation, they lack epistemic rationality but are high in instrumental rationality?

olalonde 2y ago
If they had high instrumental rationality, they would be effective at achieving their goals. That doesn’t seem to be the case - by conventional standards, they would even be considered "losers": jobless, homeless, imprisoned, or on the run.
- Muromec 2y ago
  That depends on a goal. The goal of a martyr is not life.
lukan 2y ago
Hard to say without hearing them speak for themself. So far I have 0 idea of any motive. Supposedly it should be rational, so I would at least like to hear it, before judging deeper.

datadeft 2y ago

Many people were curious here that the perpetrators were using Vim or Emacs.

b112 2y ago
Wait, OR?! Clearly this is a poorly organized movement, with wildly different beliefs. There is no unity of purpose here. Emacs or vi, used without core beliefs being challenged?! And one does not form a rationalist movement, and use emacs after all.
tbrownaw 2y ago
ed is the standard editor