6 ms·

Years ago when DDoS tools were being distributed on 4chan I fixed a bug in one of them and redistributed it there. My fixed version also had the handy feature

by aaza 2y ago

Years ago when DDoS tools were being distributed on 4chan I fixed a bug in one of them and redistributed it there. My fixed version also had the handy feature of having a 50% chance of wiping the user's entire drive if they actually used it as part of a DDoS. It was pleasingly brutal. First it would zero out and delete all files in the user's home directory, and then if it had access to the hard disk device it would overwrite the sectors directly from the start onwards. If not, it would iterate through all other files and corrupt whatever it had access to. I'm satisfied to report that hundreds of script kiddies had their data irreversibly destroyed before my handiwork was noticed. I hope it was a valuable lesson to them.

junon 2y ago
Was this a particular tool that required charging up a lazer, by chance? If so, I might have been one of the people you taught a lesson to. :D
- wrs 2y ago
  How did you feel about it? Were you dissuaded from further script-kiddieing?
  - junon 2y ago
    Well, yes and no. I was more interested in what it did and how it worked rather than 'using' it, I just remember it causing a lot of problems. But yes, this was around the time I learned not to run random executables I found on the internet.
    - throwaway5752 2y ago
      I was going to ask you the same thing as wrs, and would have answered similarly. Overall I am grateful for people like aaza for helping others to understand how it felt to be on the receiving end, and also a lesson about trust and maturity. "There is no honor among thieves" is a facile interpretation, but over time I've come to feel like this is necessary tough love for certain problem kids who might be too clever for their own good at certain points of life.
codechicago277 2y ago
I hope you realize what a god complex you had at the time thinking you had the right to harm others just because they were doing the same. This code of ethics is the source of hate in the world. I guarantee these people didn’t learn their lesson but instead started doing the same thing to others even less powerful than themself.
- tgv 2y ago
  It depends on your world view. There was also harm prevented, so that might cancel it out. You could also see it as a punishment, though not delivered by the judicial system. Your solution seems to be to do nothing. That can be construed as silent approval. So it really depends on your world view.
  - zmgsabst 2y ago
    This depends on who the DDOS was targeting, otherwise the DDOS was legitimized by this logic (targeting bad people) and this becomes bad again (harming good people to aid bad people). Of course, that was never considered nor was collateral damage because the ethical justification is just a pretense to excuse harming others.
- deleted 2y ago
  [deleted]
- simplify 2y ago
  "god complex" is very reaching. No one got physically hurt in this scenario. Also unlikely you can "guarantee" this didn't teach anyone any lessons.
  - amelius 2y ago
    > No one got physically hurt in this scenario. This is not certain.
- oliwarner 2y ago
  Anarchic dickbaggery is brand 4chan behaviour. You don't go there expecting ethics. More to the point, I don't understand why you want to spank them for this now. Kids do stupid stuff and this is far less stupid and dangerous than a lot. Indeed a lot of no-effort hackers get burnt on this stuff and stop. I know people who tried and failed. Adding peril to the process scares off a lot of would-be bad behaviour.
hildolfr 2y ago
You're bragging about a cyber crime. One wonders how many parents-of-script-kiddies were affected, having their data or work destroyed by blind retribution for having naive children.
- worstan 2y ago
  Fucking up the family computer is a formative experience for many techies.
  - te_chris 2y ago
    Amen! I still remember the time I tried to install fedora in the late 90’s and set a bios password in the boot loader then forgot it. I was like 11
- threatofrain 2y ago
  One wonders how many parents of non-script kiddies were affected by these destructive criminals, or how many of these script kiddies are professionals making a living. This story concerns 18,000 script kiddies. Imagine the scale of impact we're talking about when magnified to their victims.
  - wink 2y ago
    I think you just can't compare those 2 scenarios, 25 years apart. Back then: We got the 2nd computer in the household in 97, exactly so I would not have to use the family (actually business) computer anymore. Now: I mean ok, maybe it's already swung past a certain point that there is actually only one non-mobile device in the home, but the chance that it is the targeted script kiddie's machine (and not the important family computer) is so much higher.
  - serf 2y ago
    why does this logic make sense to anyone, ever? someone does something bad -- by all means that gives whoever carte blanche to do whatever is just as bad or equally so to the victimizers. This doesn't make sense -- even less sense when you realize that 'script kiddies' is anyone who ran an executable from an image board; you couldn't ask for a lower bar. Half the people who downloaded the thing probably didn't even know what the fuck an IP address is, they probably shouldn't be the ones saddled with taking on the entirety of repercussion that was meant for the person(s) who wrote the tool. tl;dr : I bet half of the '18,000' people were 11 year olds who typed 'google.com' or their least favorite AIM screen-name into the target criteria of this already half-assed 'tool', yet people act righteous for wiping their hard-drives as if they were the real culprit. read : wiping the not-culprits parents hard-drives in many cases, I would bet.
vunderba 2y ago
There were dozens of compromised versions of the LOIC tool back at the height of Anonymous that I'm sure many kids downloaded and in their attempts to "stick it to the man" inadvertently infected themselves.
Ekaros 2y ago
Honestly, probably at time pretty affordable lesson in thinking what you run when you download from web, and importance of backups.

by aaza 2y ago

junon 2y ago

Was this a particular tool that required charging up a lazer, by chance? If so, I might have been one of the people you taught a lesson to. :D

wrs 2y ago
How did you feel about it? Were you dissuaded from further script-kiddieing?
- junon 2y ago
  Well, yes and no. I was more interested in what it did and how it worked rather than 'using' it, I just remember it causing a lot of problems. But yes, this was around the time I learned not to run random executables I found on the internet.
  - throwaway5752 2y ago
    I was going to ask you the same thing as wrs, and would have answered similarly. Overall I am grateful for people like aaza for helping others to understand how it felt to be on the receiving end, and also a lesson about trust and maturity. "There is no honor among thieves" is a facile interpretation, but over time I've come to feel like this is necessary tough love for certain problem kids who might be too clever for their own good at certain points of life.

codechicago277 2y ago

I hope you realize what a god complex you had at the time thinking you had the right to harm others just because they were doing the same. This code of ethics is the source of hate in the world. I guarantee these people didn’t learn their lesson but instead started doing the same thing to others even less powerful than themself.

tgv 2y ago
It depends on your world view. There was also harm prevented, so that might cancel it out. You could also see it as a punishment, though not delivered by the judicial system. Your solution seems to be to do nothing. That can be construed as silent approval. So it really depends on your world view.
- zmgsabst 2y ago
  This depends on who the DDOS was targeting, otherwise the DDOS was legitimized by this logic (targeting bad people) and this becomes bad again (harming good people to aid bad people). Of course, that was never considered nor was collateral damage because the ethical justification is just a pretense to excuse harming others.
deleted 2y ago
[deleted]
simplify 2y ago
"god complex" is very reaching. No one got physically hurt in this scenario. Also unlikely you can "guarantee" this didn't teach anyone any lessons.
- amelius 2y ago
  > No one got physically hurt in this scenario. This is not certain.
oliwarner 2y ago
Anarchic dickbaggery is brand 4chan behaviour. You don't go there expecting ethics. More to the point, I don't understand why you want to spank them for this now. Kids do stupid stuff and this is far less stupid and dangerous than a lot. Indeed a lot of no-effort hackers get burnt on this stuff and stop. I know people who tried and failed. Adding peril to the process scares off a lot of would-be bad behaviour.

hildolfr 2y ago

You're bragging about a cyber crime. One wonders how many parents-of-script-kiddies were affected, having their data or work destroyed by blind retribution for having naive children.

worstan 2y ago
Fucking up the family computer is a formative experience for many techies.
- te_chris 2y ago
  Amen! I still remember the time I tried to install fedora in the late 90’s and set a bios password in the boot loader then forgot it. I was like 11
threatofrain 2y ago
One wonders how many parents of non-script kiddies were affected by these destructive criminals, or how many of these script kiddies are professionals making a living. This story concerns 18,000 script kiddies. Imagine the scale of impact we're talking about when magnified to their victims.
- wink 2y ago
  I think you just can't compare those 2 scenarios, 25 years apart. Back then: We got the 2nd computer in the household in 97, exactly so I would not have to use the family (actually business) computer anymore. Now: I mean ok, maybe it's already swung past a certain point that there is actually only one non-mobile device in the home, but the chance that it is the targeted script kiddie's machine (and not the important family computer) is so much higher.
- serf 2y ago
  why does this logic make sense to anyone, ever? someone does something bad -- by all means that gives whoever carte blanche to do whatever is just as bad or equally so to the victimizers. This doesn't make sense -- even less sense when you realize that 'script kiddies' is anyone who ran an executable from an image board; you couldn't ask for a lower bar. Half the people who downloaded the thing probably didn't even know what the fuck an IP address is, they probably shouldn't be the ones saddled with taking on the entirety of repercussion that was meant for the person(s) who wrote the tool. tl;dr : I bet half of the '18,000' people were 11 year olds who typed 'google.com' or their least favorite AIM screen-name into the target criteria of this already half-assed 'tool', yet people act righteous for wiping their hard-drives as if they were the real culprit. read : wiping the not-culprits parents hard-drives in many cases, I would bet.

vunderba 2y ago

There were dozens of compromised versions of the LOIC tool back at the height of Anonymous that I'm sure many kids downloaded and in their attempts to "stick it to the man" inadvertently infected themselves.

Ekaros 2y ago

Honestly, probably at time pretty affordable lesson in thinking what you run when you download from web, and importance of backups.