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Hitler dismantled a democracy in 53 days through constitutional means
- st-keller 2y agoWhy is this flagged? „How a democracy was hacked“ is not something that should be on Hacker News?
- hagbard_c 2y agoFor the same reason other political articles are flagged, politics is not supposed to be a significant part of the discourse on this site. While it is not possible to keep out all things political, articles like this one do not lend themselves to much else besides political mud slinging. Even though that can be an amusing pastime this is not the place for such, by decree.
- sofixa 2y agoThis is purely history. If there are modern parallels to be found, that's just one of the ways history is useful, but still not "politics".
- draw_down 2y ago[dead]
- bell-cot 2y agoLook at some more nations, and more history. If the people really believe in a system of government, then you don't need any words-on-paper constitutions or laws or stuff. If the people have really lost faith in the system (generally because it repeatedly failed to meet their basic needs), then all the pieces of paper and fancy-looking buildings and robed officials in the world don't count for shit.
- bamboozled 2y agoWhat I think is concerning is the amount of Americans that don't trust government and think most government institutions should be smashed. Hitler was a really smart guy, young and energetic at this time, evil yes, but he definitely had plans, not sure the USA has one right now though...
- dspillett 2y ago> not sure the USA has one right now though... I'm sure there is one. It is just that the Zaphod-like (though devoid of his sense of style) two-headed mess that is President Shart and Rabid Lapdog Musk are doing a good job of being a distraction from the people with the plan.
- sitkack 2y agoTransform it into a proper banana republic owned by Oligarchs. Soon everyone will have dashcams and a bear in their back yard.
- krapp 2y agoThe plan is called Project 2025[0]. Trump has publicly disavowed at least parts of the plan but, Trump being Trump, also just happens to be appointing people who just happen to want to implement it[1,2]. [0]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_2025 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_2025 [1]https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2025/jan/08/trump-project-2025 https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2025/jan/08/trump-projec... [2]https://www.afge.org/article/new-trump-administration-packed-with-project-2025-architects/ https://www.afge.org/article/new-trump-administration-packed...
- draw_down 2y ago[dead]
- roshin 2y agothere were some extremely UNdemocratic things he did, like stabbing all of his political enemies. the democratic institution should have had the police stop the SA gangs that were terrorizing the unpopular people, but there wasn't enough political will to do that, until it was too late.
- spwa4 2y agoWhat people here don't seem to realize very much is that fundamentally, every system depends on people actually doing things. That can be following the rules, that can be enforcing the rules, that can be just being helpful or polite or willing to help others. As demonstrated by a lot of dictators, when people fail, no amount of laws, no matter how clever will protect the state. Every generation again, young people believe differently. The "overwhelming force" of the law is just people. People that can be convinced to ignore or violate the law. I would argue that these days the police ignoring the law (due to lack of personnel and funds) is on full display in almost 100% of the world, though some places are worse than others.
- magic_smoke_ee 2y agoThis. Cults hack groups of people to commit very irrational acts that go against their previously-held individual traditions and values. (There are several new, predominant cult-like factions these days... so this isn't a veiled criticism of one group while ignoring another.)
- thomassmith65 2y agoI gather some readers here are flagging this article - despite it being of general interest - because of the political innuendo? Are we not to submit posts about WWII here for the next four years?
- jgrahamc 2y agoI flagged it because it seems far removed from HN stuff and my assumption is that this is posted as "I'm scared Trump will do something similar" and I can read about Trump stuff pretty much anywhere else. Post an article about cryptanalysis of WWII ciphers and I'll upvote it.
- llamaimperative 2y agoIt’s about Hitler and how governments work though?
- thomassmith65 2y agoOne of the attributes I like about HN is the variety of subjects that get posted. With the amount of reading material on the web, I read fewer books than I used to, so having serious essays pop up here on eclectic subjects makes me feel like I'm not completely frivolous. While I don't find the Trump innuendo ridiculous, I understand why some people would. The thing is, the article itself doesn't 'go there', and is interesting. If the post attracts annoyingly political comments that do 'go there', people can always flag the those comments.
- hatf0 2y agoPaywall bypass link: https://archive.ph/22fpW https://archive.ph/22fpW
- JeanMii 2y ago[dead]
- cherryteastain 2y agoKurt Gödel, famous Austrian mathematician, was afraid that the US constitution has a flaw which makes it vulnerable to a similar seizure of power. Unfortunately, he never wrote down what it is, so we don't know what he was concerned about specifically. Fortunately, the event most similar to the Reichstag fire - January 6th - did not in reality lead the US down that kind of path. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/G%C3%B6del's_Loophole https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/G%C3%B6del's_Loophole
- llamaimperative 2y agoThere seems to be quite a few such loopholes. Another one is POTUS’s ability to suspend Congress indefinitely when there is a “disagreement” between the House and Senate as to whether they’re in recess. It’s not clear what “disagreement” means and hypothetically the courts could disagree, but even in light of that you’re talking about 1 POTUS, 1 Congressional majority leader, and a few Justices required to suspend Congress indefinitely. (Article 2 Section 3)
- Fluorescence 2y agoJan 6th would be the Beer Hall Putsch. Notable this time round for no legal consequences for the main character. A Reichstag Fire would be an inciting event early in the next term, committed by a member of a regime out-group, used to justify radically increasing authoritarian and prejudicial rule. Given the events of the last few weeks, it feels like there will be plentiful opportunities if wanted.
- tharmas 2y agoJan 6th gets a lot of attention. But the Bush v Gore Florida count seems to have been completely forgotten. It ushered in what is quite arguably the worst Presidency in modern history. Jan 6th was blunt and obvious but Florida 2000 was far more surreptitious. I think it deserves more attention. https://www.nytimes.com/2000/12/10/politics/supreme-court-split-54-halts-florida-count-in-blow-to-gore.html https://www.nytimes.com/2000/12/10/politics/supreme-court-sp...
- dkuntz2 2y ago
- sitkack 2y agoSide quip, the H in STEM stands for history. If you look at the schooling of the ruling class, history is one of the most important subjects. And I am not talking about pilgrims and the Louisiana purchase. If you want to understand where you are, how you got there and where things are going there is no better way than to learn from the people before you. One way to pique your interest is to listen to podcasts and lectures. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hardcore_History https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hardcore_History https://www.reddit.com/r/dancarlin/ https://www.reddit.com/r/dancarlin/ https://www.dancarlin.com/hardcore-history-series/ https://www.dancarlin.com/hardcore-history-series/
- thomassmith65 2y ago'The Rest is History' podcast is lots of fun: https://youtube.com/@restishistorypod https://youtube.com/@restishistorypod
- volleyball 2y agoThe name 'hardcore history' keeps popping up now and again so I decided to do a quick Gell-man-amensia check on a topic i am somewhat familiar with it. It seems he hasn't tackled Israel/Palestine on his podcast but so i had to make do with whatever tweets i could find : https://xcancel.com/HardcoreHistory/status/1711181521460363514 https://xcancel.com/HardcoreHistory/status/17111815214603635... https://xcancel.com/HardcoreHistory/status/1712157207486484918 https://xcancel.com/HardcoreHistory/status/17121572074864849... His few tweets and replies are pro-israeli apologia (whose facade has become thinner and indefensible in the past year) with zero incorporation of the palestinian side and glaring misrepresentation and omission of facts. I am sorry but i can't trust him to speak honestly and fairly on the other parts of history i am unfamiliar with.
- sitkack 2y agoI see your point. His analysis of lead up to the start of WWI ws engaging and accurate given what I know. What he offered to me was a way to look at historical events and break them down and see the knock on effects. In a much more profound and connect way, James Burke did this with his Connections Series. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Connections_(British_TV_series) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Connections_(British_TV_series...
- magic_smoke_ee 2y agoMaybe the US needs a bug bounty for the conjecture raised by Gödel's supposed loophole.
- OutOfHere 2y agoOr it could be rewritten in a bug-proof formal system for assertions. (Think Rust but better.)
- Arnt 2y agohttps://verfassungsblog.de/ein-volkskanzler/ https://verfassungsblog.de/ein-volkskanzler/ is a quite readable story of how the same thing might play out now in a possible democracy. If reading it scares you, that makes two of us. In German, I'm sure it's been translated but I link to the original.
- erikig 2y agoThe Google translation of the story holds up quite well and is a thrilling read even if the intricacies of German government might not be clear to the reader.
- daft_pink 2y agoGodwin’s law is alive and in force.
- archagon 2y ago“Yes, it’s okay to compare Trump to Hitler. Don’t let me stop you.” -Mike Godwin https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2023/12/20/godwins-law-trump-hitler-comparisons/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2023/12/20/godwins-l...
- daft_pink 2y agoHitler killed millions of people and started numerous wars. Trump started no wars and isn’t on a campaign of mass murder. Taking basic similarities between virtually all politicians on how they lie and become popular doesn’t make Trump Hitler.
- archagon 2y agoI have to wonder if responses like this are genuine. Do you really think Hitler came into power on promises of war and mass murder? Do you think that "virtually all politicians" promise things like this? "Mass deportations, detention camps, troops on the street: Trump spells out migrant plan" — https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/article/2024/may/03/trump-mass-deportations-detention-camps-military-migrants https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/article/2024/may/03/trum... "Trump has made more than 100 threats to prosecute or punish perceived enemies" — https://www.npr.org/2024/10/21/nx-s1-5134924/trump-election-2024-kamala-harris-elizabeth-cheney-threat-civil-liberties https://www.npr.org/2024/10/21/nx-s1-5134924/trump-election-... "Trump says ‘violent day’ of policing will end crime" — https://www.politico.com/news/2024/09/29/trump-violent-day-policing-crime-00181619 https://www.politico.com/news/2024/09/29/trump-violent-day-p... "Trump said Hitler ‘did some good things’ and wanted generals like the Nazis, former chief of staff Kelly claims" — https://www.pbs.org/newshour/politics/trump-said-hitler-did-some-good-things-and-wanted-generals-like-the-nazis-former-chief-of-staff-kelly-claims https://www.pbs.org/newshour/politics/trump-said-hitler-did-... Hand a charismatic egomaniac absolute power and he can accomplish some truly depraved things. Hitler wasn't a particularly special breed of monster, I'm afraid.
- orwin 2y agoI heavily dislike the article. It misses at least two points. One, the Nazi (or rather, the nationalist coalition) was on the decline, as were the conservatives in power, and were set to loose multiple seats in the next elections. Seizing power, fast, was needed. Two, Hitler used laws set in by the radical center and the conservatives to take power. Yes, he used violence, but the holes that allowed the takeover were set before, by judges and previous governments.
- mostlysimilar 2y ago> One, the Nazi (or rather, the nationalist coalition) was on the decline, as were the conservatives in power, and were set to loose multiple seats in the next elections. Seizing power, fast, was needed. The Republicans are going to run the US into the ground in the next couple of years. Midterm elections are 2026.
- anthony_d 2y agoOh! How thrilling! Do you have any details about how they’re going to do that?
- mostlysimilar 2y agoSure. Policies that enrich the oligarchs and further erode the quality of life for everyday Americans. They can't help themselves, it's in their blood.
- sofixa 2y agoIt addresses the first point quite well, multiple times (it's even one of the first things discussed in the story, one of Hitler's coalition partners was bound to lose from elections).
- beej71 2y agoI can't find the expression "den parlamentarischen Sumpf" anywhere. The article seems to imply that Hitler used it. Does anyone have a source of him saying it or writing it?
- thread_id 2y agohttps://www.yahoo.com/news/hitler-dismantled-democracy-53-days-133000255.html https://www.yahoo.com/news/hitler-dismantled-democracy-53-da...