10 ms·

Spinal cord injuries from mountain biking exceed hockey, other high-risk sports

94 points by gone35 2y ago

koromak 2y ago
I follow some mountain bike youtube channels, not professional riders but content creators, and literally every one of them has a yearly major injury. Broken bones are just normal.
- RankingMember 2y ago
  Seth (Alvo, of Berm Peak) is honestly asking for it half the time with the stuff he does for the camera. Trying to 360 a Brompton on a rainy day in a skate park was a recent ridiculous example.
jq-r 2y ago
To add my 2c here. Been riding mountain bikes for at least 20 years, and from 2014 more intensively. The latter on so called enduro, and a little bit of downhill bikes. Had some crashes, both low and high speed. Nothing that I couldn't immediately get up, brush off, and continue on my merry way. Maybe that day and day after I would be a bit sore/stiff, but nothing to write home about. But almost 3 years ago, I got a back pain which wasn't passing and to make long story short, got into two spinal surgeries for herniated disc, the second being a fusion of two vertebras. I'm still recovering to this day, and unfortunately not riding my bikes, only a bike on a trainer. My little pet theory is that people are still not aware that the sport is actually very dangerous. I'm not talking here about some extremes/professionals, I'm talking here about average Joe or his kid, who get a mountain bike and go ride (its a cool sport after all), crash here and there and don't end up in hospital necessarily. I think that the human body is quite resistant to impacts which are at low speed, as in =< running speed, and beyond that things start to break. Or at least break slowly (like a herniated disc). But mountain bikes of today very fast because they are made to be comfortable and stable, which makes crashing on the rough terrain much more dangerous than going slowly on a bike of even 10 years go as others noted in this thread. So as the years go by, we start getting these kind of reports which may be flawed, but from my anecdata (and from the riding club I'm in), those injuries are certainly with us and making me seriously reconsider recommending faster mountain biking disciplines at all (enduro and downhill).
eweise 2y ago
Don't know about spinal injuries but almost everyone I know who mountain bikes, has broken a bone, mostly collar bones.
mjvande 2y ago
Mountain Biking and Trail-Building Destroy Wildlife Habitat! The major harm that mountain biking does is that it greatly extends the human footprint (distance that one can travel) in wildlife habitat. E-bikes multiply that footprint even more. Neither should be allowed on any unpaved trail. Wildlife, if they are to survive, MUST receive top priority! What were you thinking??? Mountain biking and trail-building destroy wildlife habitat! Mountain biking is environmentally, socially, and medically destructive! There is no good reason to allow bicycles on any unpaved trail! Bicycles should not be allowed in any natural area. They are inanimate objects and have no rights. There is also no right to mountain bike. That was settled in federal court in 1996: https://mjvande.info/mtb10.htm https://mjvande.info/mtb10.htm . It's dishonest of mountain bikers to say that they don't have access to trails closed to bikes. They have EXACTLY the same access as everyone else -- ON FOOT! Why isn't that good enough for mountain bikers? They are all capable of walking.... Why do mountain bikers always insist on creating illegal trails? It's simple: they ride so fast that they see almost nothing of what they are passing. Therefore, they quickly get bored with any given trail and want another and another, endlessly! (In other words, mountain biking is inherently boring!) A favorite myth of mountain bikers is that mountain biking is no more harmful to wildlife, people, and the environment than hiking, and that science supports that view. Of course, it's not true. To settle the matter once and for all, I read all of the research they cited, and wrote a review of the research on mountain biking impacts (see https://mjvande.info/scb7.htm https://mjvande.info/scb7.htm ). I found that of the seven studies they cited, (1) all were written by mountain bikers, and (2) in every case, the authors misinterpreted their own data, in order to come to the conclusion that they favored. They also studiously avoided mentioning another scientific study (Wisdom et al) which did not favor mountain biking, and came to the opposite conclusions. Mountain bikers also love to build new trails - legally or illegally. Of course, trail-building destroys wildlife habitat - not just in the trail bed, but in a wide swath to both sides of the trail! E.g. grizzlies can hear a human from one mile away, and smell us from 5 miles away. Thus, a 10-mile trail represents 100 square miles of destroyed or degraded habitat, that animals are inhibited from using. Mountain biking, trail building, and trail maintenance all increase the number of people in the park, thereby preventing the animals' full use of their habitat. See https://mjvande.info/scb9.htm https://mjvande.info/scb9.htm for details. Mountain biking accelerates erosion, creates V-shaped ruts, kills small animals and plants on and next to the trail, drives wildlife and other trail users out of the area, and, worst of all, teaches kids that the rough treatment of nature is okay (it's NOT!). What's good about THAT? To see exactly what harm mountain biking does to the land, watch this 5-minute video: http://vimeo.com/48784297 http://vimeo.com/48784297. In addition to all of this, it is extremely dangerous: https://mjvande.info/mtb_dangerous.htm https://mjvande.info/mtb_dangerous.htm . The latest craze among mountain bikers is the creation of "pump tracks" (bike parks). They are alleged to teach bicycling skills, but what they actually teach are "skills" (skidding, jumping ("getting air"), racing, etc.) that are appropriate nowhere! If you believe that these "skills" won't be practiced throughout the rest of the park and in all other parks, I have a bridge I'd like to sell you! ... For more information: https://mjvande.info/mtbfaq.htm https://mjvande.info/mtbfaq.htm . The common thread among those who want more recreation in our parks is total ignorance about and disinterest in the wildlife whose homes these parks are. Yes, if humans are the only beings that matter, it is simply a conflict among humans (but even then, allowing bikes on trails harms the MAJORITY of park users -- hikers and equestrians -- who can no longer safely and peacefully enjoy their parks). The parks aren't gymnasiums or racetracks or even human playgrounds. They are WILDLIFE HABITAT, which is precisely why they are attractive to humans. Activities such as mountain biking, that destroy habitat, violate the charter of the parks. Even kayaking and rafting, which give humans access to the entirety of a water body, prevent the wildlife that live there from making full use of their habitat, and should not be allowed. Of course those who think that only humans matter won't understand what I am talking about -- an indication of the sad state of our culture and educational system. Mike Vandeman, Ph.D.
xattt 2y ago
Tangential, but it would make sense that areas with more variable terrain (i.e. BC) would likely see more or more severe injuries than flat areas (i.e. Saskatchewan).
Ensorceled 2y ago
I predict this will get worse as e-bikes increasingly allow people to get to places they do not have the experience, fitness and skill to get their on their own.
- duxup 2y ago
  E-bikes that go too fast are already an issue. Friends wife went for a walk on a pedestrian path, onlookers saw her hit from behind by someone on an e-bike going very fast. She still doesn’t remember anything.
  - Jagerbizzle 2y ago
    I wish there was some sort of permitting required to use one of these things. I love the idea of people getting around quickly without needing a car, but I take serious issue with a large number of people I see on these things in the streets (and more annoyingly sidewalks) of Seattle that think they're a pedestrian that just happens to be going 20+ mph.
    - neocritter 2y ago
      How much of this is the bicycle, and how much of this is that it enables less conscientious people to go more miles at otherwise normal cycling speeds? The e- part is limited to speeds most people can reach on a normal bicycle unless they modify it. /r/IdiotsInCars is a monument to how ineffective permitting is for this purpose. The people rear-ending pedestrians on sidewalks at 20MPH might be the same people who never miss their off ramp.
      - Kon-Peki 2y ago
        > The e- part is limited to speeds that most people can reach on a normal bicycle. Maybe. There are regulations, but the wording is generally such that the bike cannot be sold with a speed capability greater than X. So the bikes ship from the factory with a firmware setting for the max speed of X. But as soon as people buy the bike they go into the bike settings (!) and change it to whatever higher speed that they want. Whenever crashes happen these settings need to be examined and they need to be part of the liability determination.
chuckwfinley 2y ago
This is interesting and I don't doubt the problem exists, but just considering the physics of a person riding a bike, it seems tough to envision an effective safety system. Maybe expanded use of those "bike airbag helmets"? I can't imagine a mountain biker wearing a bunch of bulky padding and still being able to participate in the sport.
- stevage 2y ago
  Downhill mountain bikers do indeed wear a "bunch of bulky padding", often including spine protection. It'd be nice to see how much that helps.
  - bdndndndbve 2y ago
    TFA says most of the injured people were wearing pads and they went head-first over the handlebars. Reading between the lines, it sounds like they landed on their heads and the forces on their spine caused injury. Much like CTEs in football, you're going to have a hard time protecting yourself against inertia.
    - bluGill 2y ago
      The article has most were wearing a helmet, but less than 10% other pads. I'm not clear on what other pads are, but they seem to include things like knee protection which I wouldn't expect to help in this type of accident (but probably help is much more common falls).
- diggan 2y ago
  Aren't there materials out there that can change from "fluid" to "solid" based on electrical signals? Or maybe something like Oobleck instead. Then you could have some sort of spine-protector, that outlines/protects your back and is flexible by default, but if it can tell you're falling through the air somehow/rotating around, it starts being inflexible to protect the structure of your back. I dunno, just brainstorming and have no experience building protective wear/devices.
stevage 2y ago
It'd be good to see the breakdown by types of mountain biking. I imagine downhill has a higher injury rate, but is it like 50% or 90%? I'm very into cycling, and like casual mountain biking. I've tried downhill a couple of times and it feels way too dangerous.
- infecto 2y ago
  That was my first thought too. Certainly this must be skewed towards downhill? Going high speed into jumps that send you 5-10+ft into the air must not have good outcomes if you miss the jump or landing. Most of the rest of mountain biking is fairly tame in my opinion.
- Fricken 2y ago
  Without a doubt it is overwhelmingly downhill riders. Everyone I know who does it has suffered multiple broken bones.
- lonelyasacloud 2y ago
  Almost certainly this, from the article "As a spine surgeon at Vancouver General Hospital, the provincial referral centre for all spinal cord injuries in B.C., Dr. Kwon decided to conduct the study after witnessing the high number of injuries coming out of mountain-bike parks." As others have pointed out, BC is somewhat of a downhill mountain bike Mecca with Whistler and various other parks running on the slopes during the summer https://www.mountainbikingbc.ca/ride-ideas-road-trips/bc-bike-parks/ https://www.mountainbikingbc.ca/ride-ideas-road-trips/bc-bik....
- shanemhansen 2y ago
  I agree. Even within those types there are some types of rides that are massively different. In MTB you have XC (cross country) which can be more about distance and grit. These bikes are lighter and have less suspension because you don't typically do a 10 foot drop on one. Enduro racing is what I think of as similar to skiing or snowboarding. You can go do the green/blue/black at a resort. You can also do the equivalent of taking a helicopter to the top of a crazy mountain pass and jump out. Then there is park stuff. Snowboarders might hop into a rail in the park. Mountain bikers might ride a wooden feature. The point being it's important to distinguish whether you're talking about the danger of taking a flowy green downhill or the danger of going off a 20 foot drop or the danger of hopping onto a narrow piece of Park stuff that's 30 feet off the ground. Because the injury rate of people on double black diamond runs in BC with 30 foot tall one foot wide wooden features is just not relevant to me because I am not riding that kind of terrain.
briandear 2y ago
My kids race GP motorcycles (Ohvale, Honda NSF250/Moto3) and it’s interesting how many well meaning but ignorant parents tell me how dangerous that is, yet they’ll gladly let their kids play soccer, do gymnastics, or (in the U.S.,) play tackle [American] football. Track racing injuries at the semi-pro and pro levels are a lot more rare than in traditional ball sports. Injuries do happen, but the safety gear is so advanced that it’s relatively rare. Far more dangerous riding a bicycle to school than racing at 200+mph on closed course racetracks. 4 kids racing for the past year in Spain and our only injury was a broken wrist while practicing on a supermoto in a parking lot. Countless crashes, but injuries have been rare. The soccer kids at their school though — seems like there is always one on crutches. Anecdotal, sure, but actual safety and perception of safety aren’t always the same. I think last year in racing there were maybe two fatalities in the entire world in organized motorcycle racing. In just August in the USA, 7 kids died playing American football. [1] In MotoGP, only 8 in the history of the sport have died while racing, with Marco Simoncelli being the most recent in 2011. The list of pro soccer players who have died after infield incidents is extensive.[2] My point is that “high risk” in my opinion, isn’t well defined. [1] https://www.npr.org/2024/08/28/nx-s1-5091883/middle-high-school-football-players-deaths-august https://www.npr.org/2024/08/28/nx-s1-5091883/middle-high-sch... [2] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_association_footballers_who_died_after_on-field_incidents https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_association_football...
- duxup 2y ago
  The article does seem to point to a study that tries to determine actual safety.
- goda90 2y ago
  But couldn't these numbers be explained by scale of participation alone? There have got to be way more football and soccer games in the world than motorcycle races by multiple orders of magnitude.
- mech9879876 2y ago
  I don't know entirely why the Isle of Man TT course is so deadly, but it took another life in 2024. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Isle_of_Man_TT_Mountain_Course_fatalities https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Isle_of_Man_TT_Mountai...
sva_ 2y ago
It has a lot to do with the amount of risk some bikers are willing to take. You can be very safe if you're careful. I'd say in general, the risk of getting hit by a car in traffic is much higher than something happening out in the mountains, depending on the city of course.
Toutouxc 2y ago
One thing to note is that British Columbia, especially the bike park in Whistler, is basically the Mecca of [this type of] mountain biking. For most people around the world it's not a cheap trip, riding there might be something they've dreamt about for years, and they intend to make every minute count, even though they're tired and some of the trails are unlike anything they've ever ridden at home.
- jajko 2y ago
  Something like Chamonix, France for many other extreme summer & winter mountain sports (downhill MTB including) then. People keep dying 'en masse' there, long term average is 60 per year in Mont Blanc range alone, but this includes all activities so heart attack during pleasant walk is there too. They compare it to whole US rockies in terms of mortality, not sure if it still holds. If folks focused purely on statistics whole place would be banned ad infinum due to world's easiest access to extreme terrain, luckily French folks have a different attitude to risks in what they consider 'noble' activities (which covers most mountain stuff). I almost contributed to stats there last year too with my medium severity paraglider landing crash (both legs broken but missed massive rock by few cms which would end up much more severe).
  - tim333 2y ago
    I wonder how it compared to off piste snowboarding? I lived in Chamonix a bit and a lot of the shuttle bus drivers seemed to have spinal injuries from going off cliffs accidentally snowboarding off piste. It can be hard to see them in deep powder.
- boringg 2y ago
  It should also be noted that the technology for downhill mountain biking has exploded in quality and price -- probably also money from manufacturers sponsoring pros etc. Making it viable for super sketchy terrain (via tires, suspension, frame dynamics, braking) to be taken on and cliff drops to be attempted. Its probably the quickest advancing "extreme" sport happening right now - which would track with this finding since they are pushing the boundaries and the landings are HARD. For example go see the highlights of red bull rampage for the current mtn biking zeitgeist.
stefantalpalaru 2y ago
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3333333331 2y ago
Would love to see this normalized across the country (or world). Mountain bike trails in the Pacific Northwest are very different than, say, Central Pennsylvania. Riding loamy downhills on a full suspension bike might as well be a different sport than a low-speed rocky/rooty technical trails on a hardtail.
cbseven 2y ago
This article makes it sound like mountain biking is riskier than hockey (in terms of spinal cord injuries), but without relative participation rates, one cannot draw that conclusion.
- maxerickson 2y ago
  There is also a significant amount of personal risk tolerance involved. Casual riders can certainly have severe injuries, but easier trails are indeed easier.
  - cduzz 2y ago
    I think it's way easier to get in over your head mountain biking than playing hockey. A casual hockey player finding themselves in a way too kinetic game of pickup can nope-out pretty quickly, or likely won't ever get into the situation. A casual mountain biker can go on a casual mountain bike ride with his brother and find himself way over his head, then bouncing down the trail on his head, very quickly and without an obvious offramp. Ask me how I know... ;)
    - shanemhansen 2y ago
      I empathize because I literally just finished healing from an injury that came within millimeters of killing me because I followed someone into an area that I wasn't prepared for. The first hospital I went to, after doing X-rays said I needed a level one trauma center and called an ambulance to take me to Seattle harbor view. I broke the cardinal rule of new technical terrain: pre-ride, re-ride, freeride. You get off your bike and walk the feature to see how approachable and rollable it might be. Then you session it (ride just that one feature). Then you ride through it quickly as part of a longer trail. I went 5 years without an injury. This one healed in 3 months. I believe I know what I did wrong and can fairly easily avoid making that same mistake again. Do I expect zero injuries in the future? No. What I expect is years at a time of an activity that very much enriches my life, with occasional injuries. Hopefully more than 5 years at a time since I'm making changes to avoid repeating the same mistake. And I wish people knew that downhill mountain biking is a lot like downhill skiing. You can take the greens down or you can yeet yourself off something that's tougher than a double black diamond. I've gone on many group mountain bike rides with people in their 70s. So like skiing it is something you can shoot for doing into your old age.
davycro 2y ago
This tracks with my own bias as an ER doc. I do feel that the risk of c-spine injuries from mountain biking is understated. As they said in the article, you are especially vulnerable to a hangmans fracture when thrown over the handlebars. I wonder if the ergonomics or geometry of a bicycle could be modified to better protect a rider’s neck.
- mjvande 2y ago
  Why "fix" mountain biking, when it's inevitably environmentally destructive? It needs to be banned, period.
  - cassepipe 2y ago
    I don't know I thought cars would be a bigger priority since they are much more numerous, bigger, dirtier and so is their infrastructure ? It seems weird to concentrate your efforts on biking. What does it do, erode the mountains faster ? Scare away rabbits ?
    - freeride923 2y ago
      Please ignore that guy, he's a schizophrenic. Michael J. Vandeman was arrested by UC Berkeley police on May 28 after he allegedly attacked a bicyclist with a handsaw on a fire trail above the UC Berkeley campus weeks earlier. https://velo.outsideonline.com/mountain/mtb-hater-gets-busted-in-berkeley-hills/ https://velo.outsideonline.com/mountain/mtb-hater-gets-buste...
      - cassepipe 2y ago
        Oh, wow. Thanks for the intel.
- n8henrie 2y ago
  Hey man, funny "seeing" you round these parts!
- engineer_22 2y ago
ourguile 2y ago
I do a lot of road cycling, but this is essentially why I refuse to participate in mountain biking (in my area). I've heard so many horror stories from friends of mine who ride and it sounds like accidents are only a matter of time. Even if someone rides as safe as they can, you can't account for others on the trails or the conditions 100% of the time.
- sojournerc 2y ago
  I got off a road bike onto a mountain because I feel I have more control. A motorist plowing me from behind on the highway is something I can't control. How fast or cautious I ride is in my control. It does help to be familiar with whatever trail you're riding however.
  - TremendousJudge 2y ago
    Well you cannot control the trail conditions right? unless you are doing an inspection beforehand But yeah I agree road cycling is extremely dangerous, you are trusting that 100% percent of the drivers on the road will be mindful of cyclists, all the time.
    - sojournerc 2y ago
      Can't control but they are generally predictable. I tend to ride the same trail loop, so know it's condition based on recent weather. For new trails, it's helpful to ride with someone who's done it before, otherwise just take it easy. My cousin had a bad mountain bike accident, and i think it had to do with risk desensitisation. He's an excellent rider, and was just warming up and goofed a bit. Ended up breaking his back and knocking himself out. I don't necessarily think mtb is safer overall, but the risk factors are more apparent, and, as with any sport, user discretion is advised.
- andy_ppp 2y ago
  To be fair the same is true for road cycling and drivers, I've had some very lucky encounters by predicting the worst possible outcomes and managing to get lucky enough to avoid them. Especially in the UK or US where the car rules the road and you don't really count as a vehicle or a pedestrian, just a nuisance.
dukeofdoom 2y ago
I visited by Whistler, watched some of these guys, basically doing somersaults on mountain bikes on a pump track, going at high speed. So not surprising at all. Not exactly sure where I was. All I remember it was like meters away from nudist beach (nudist wooden dock, really). Which being immature dorks, we decided to dive off. But Whistler is kind of like Waikiki to Surfing. So might be sample bias. Most people don't take doing bike tricks that far. So its a thrill seeker place down there, that attracts a certain type of personality. https://www.youtube.com/@riseandalpine https://www.youtube.com/@riseandalpine
Havoc 2y ago
Mountain biking needs to be split into two. There is casual off-roading on a mountain bike and there is the dare devil downhill stuff. Very different risk profiles in my mind
- taude 2y ago
  yeah, agreed: huge difference in downhill, freestyle, etc...and my XC group rides. Also, BC, between Whistler and North Shore on Vancouver Island is pretty much mecca for this type of riding, bike parks, stunts, etc.... I'd be really curious what the stats are elsewhere, and broken out by what the rider was doing at time of injury.
- deltarholamda 2y ago
  My kids do mountain bike racing, and one of the reasons I like they do it is because it is incredibly safe. For one, where I am there aren't "mountains"; it's essentially off-road biking. But additionally, the organization they race in is emphatic about safety. The worst injuries done is to dad's wallet when a wheel gets bent or a derailleur goes blooey. The article says it's mostly men with an average age of 35. These are dudes who are pushing their own limits on some of the most difficult terrain. As you say, a radically different profile.
- deleted 2y ago
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harimau777 2y ago
I recall hearing in the past that equestrianism had the greatest risk of head trauma of any mainstream sport. If I recall correctly, even more than boxing. It's interesting that mountain biking is in many ways a similar activity (e.g. riding a "vehicle" that you straddle and which doesn't have the inherent stability of a car). It might be interesting to compare rates in equestrianism and biking to other sports where falls are a significant risk such as Judo or balance beam. Are falls a particularly dangerous part of sports or might there be something specific to falling from something you are straddling? Might it make a difference that Judo and gymnastics include specific training to develop balance and safe falling but biking and horseback riding do not?
- showerst 2y ago
  In Judo and gymnastics you're generally also traveling slower. Judo falls are also from a lower height and generally under control (just not yours, heh).
- astura 2y ago
  >It might be interesting to compare rates in equestrianism and biking to other sports where falls are a significant risk such as Judo or balance beam. So, in gymnastics you practice falling so you fall safer/more controlled. Falling correctly when you miss a skill was given as much weight as actually performing the skill. There was a policy in my gym that you fall unsafely in class (such as straddling the beam) you were required to do pushups for the rest of class. Gymnastics also has spotters who can prevent catastrophic injuries. Because of this, I think the risk of catastrophic injury in gymnastics is fairly low, especially at the lower levels.
- barrkel 2y ago
  Horse riding is about 10x more dangerous, for time spent, than motorcycling, IIRC. It is a seriously dangerous sport.
- hirvi74 2y ago
  I grew up around horses and even rode some myself when I was in my youth. I think the average person does not realize how horribly dangerous horses are. Think like in the movie/book "Gone with the Wind." While useful animals, horses are responsible for countless deaths. And this is purely conjecture on my part, but I imagine horses were more dangerous than cars ever have been. Even last year, my mother broke her neck from getting thrown, and miraculously made a full recovery despite almost severing her spinal cord. Her horse got spooked, bucked before she could react, and it was almost all over but the crying.
hyperbovine 2y ago
I’m shocked — shocked! — that this sport would have a higher injury rate than hockey. https://youtu.be/PCvrdZOk_kk?si=AwaCHd05eM-XYfV- https://youtu.be/PCvrdZOk_kk?si=AwaCHd05eM-XYfV- Or running your spine through a tree shredder, for that matter.
- jbs789 2y ago
  The article makes no statement about injury rate, just number of injuries.
- dbspin 2y ago
  That's pretty tame next to the courses and weather conditions in BC https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nakoqhu61nI https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nakoqhu61nI
PaulHoule 2y ago
I remember talking to a mountain biker who seemed proud of his injuries including concussions, breaking his shoulder twice, etc.
- RankingMember 2y ago
  In every sport there always seem to be a few who almost get off on abusing their body.
  - liotier 2y ago
    Material proof of bravery (from the point of views of the scarred) or temerity (from everybody else's point of view)... And, less abusive but no less idiotic: the same idea but with broken hardware - a broken frame means limits were properly being pushed. I'm thankful I survived my teenage years... Thirty years later I make a point of keeping my wheels in permanent contact with the ground.
- finnthehuman 2y ago
  Would you rather they be ashamed of it?
deleted 2y ago
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shanemhansen 2y ago
This title is so bad it's basically a lie. Better title: spinal cord injuries from mountain biking in BC exceed other high risk sports. The terrain in that area and parks include things like a lot of 30 foot tall one foot wide wood walkways. And as a MTB destination this terrain is often attempted by basically tourists. This is like saying "hiking injuries exceed other high risk sports" on Mt Everest.

94 points by gone35 2y ago

I follow some mountain bike youtube channels, not professional riders but content creators, and literally every one of them has a yearly major injury. Broken bones are just normal.

RankingMember 2y ago
Seth (Alvo, of Berm Peak) is honestly asking for it half the time with the stuff he does for the camera. Trying to 360 a Brompton on a rainy day in a skate park was a recent ridiculous example.

jq-r 2y ago

To add my 2c here. Been riding mountain bikes for at least 20 years, and from 2014 more intensively. The latter on so called enduro, and a little bit of downhill bikes. Had some crashes, both low and high speed. Nothing that I couldn't immediately get up, brush off, and continue on my merry way. Maybe that day and day after I would be a bit sore/stiff, but nothing to write home about. But almost 3 years ago, I got a back pain which wasn't passing and to make long story short, got into two spinal surgeries for herniated disc, the second being a fusion of two vertebras. I'm still recovering to this day, and unfortunately not riding my bikes, only a bike on a trainer. My little pet theory is that people are still not aware that the sport is actually very dangerous. I'm not talking here about some extremes/professionals, I'm talking here about average Joe or his kid, who get a mountain bike and go ride (its a cool sport after all), crash here and there and don't end up in hospital necessarily. I think that the human body is quite resistant to impacts which are at low speed, as in =< running speed, and beyond that things start to break. Or at least break slowly (like a herniated disc). But mountain bikes of today very fast because they are made to be comfortable and stable, which makes crashing on the rough terrain much more dangerous than going slowly on a bike of even 10 years go as others noted in this thread. So as the years go by, we start getting these kind of reports which may be flawed, but from my anecdata (and from the riding club I'm in), those injuries are certainly with us and making me seriously reconsider recommending faster mountain biking disciplines at all (enduro and downhill).

eweise 2y ago

Don't know about spinal injuries but almost everyone I know who mountain bikes, has broken a bone, mostly collar bones.

mjvande 2y ago

Mountain Biking and Trail-Building Destroy Wildlife Habitat! The major harm that mountain biking does is that it greatly extends the human footprint (distance that one can travel) in wildlife habitat. E-bikes multiply that footprint even more. Neither should be allowed on any unpaved trail. Wildlife, if they are to survive, MUST receive top priority! What were you thinking??? Mountain biking and trail-building destroy wildlife habitat! Mountain biking is environmentally, socially, and medically destructive! There is no good reason to allow bicycles on any unpaved trail! Bicycles should not be allowed in any natural area. They are inanimate objects and have no rights. There is also no right to mountain bike. That was settled in federal court in 1996: https://mjvande.info/mtb10.htm https://mjvande.info/mtb10.htm . It's dishonest of mountain bikers to say that they don't have access to trails closed to bikes. They have EXACTLY the same access as everyone else -- ON FOOT! Why isn't that good enough for mountain bikers? They are all capable of walking.... Why do mountain bikers always insist on creating illegal trails? It's simple: they ride so fast that they see almost nothing of what they are passing. Therefore, they quickly get bored with any given trail and want another and another, endlessly! (In other words, mountain biking is inherently boring!) A favorite myth of mountain bikers is that mountain biking is no more harmful to wildlife, people, and the environment than hiking, and that science supports that view. Of course, it's not true. To settle the matter once and for all, I read all of the research they cited, and wrote a review of the research on mountain biking impacts (see https://mjvande.info/scb7.htm https://mjvande.info/scb7.htm ). I found that of the seven studies they cited, (1) all were written by mountain bikers, and (2) in every case, the authors misinterpreted their own data, in order to come to the conclusion that they favored. They also studiously avoided mentioning another scientific study (Wisdom et al) which did not favor mountain biking, and came to the opposite conclusions. Mountain bikers also love to build new trails - legally or illegally. Of course, trail-building destroys wildlife habitat - not just in the trail bed, but in a wide swath to both sides of the trail! E.g. grizzlies can hear a human from one mile away, and smell us from 5 miles away. Thus, a 10-mile trail represents 100 square miles of destroyed or degraded habitat, that animals are inhibited from using. Mountain biking, trail building, and trail maintenance all increase the number of people in the park, thereby preventing the animals' full use of their habitat. See https://mjvande.info/scb9.htm https://mjvande.info/scb9.htm for details. Mountain biking accelerates erosion, creates V-shaped ruts, kills small animals and plants on and next to the trail, drives wildlife and other trail users out of the area, and, worst of all, teaches kids that the rough treatment of nature is okay (it's NOT!). What's good about THAT? To see exactly what harm mountain biking does to the land, watch this 5-minute video: http://vimeo.com/48784297 http://vimeo.com/48784297. In addition to all of this, it is extremely dangerous: https://mjvande.info/mtb_dangerous.htm https://mjvande.info/mtb_dangerous.htm . The latest craze among mountain bikers is the creation of "pump tracks" (bike parks). They are alleged to teach bicycling skills, but what they actually teach are "skills" (skidding, jumping ("getting air"), racing, etc.) that are appropriate nowhere! If you believe that these "skills" won't be practiced throughout the rest of the park and in all other parks, I have a bridge I'd like to sell you! ... For more information: https://mjvande.info/mtbfaq.htm https://mjvande.info/mtbfaq.htm . The common thread among those who want more recreation in our parks is total ignorance about and disinterest in the wildlife whose homes these parks are. Yes, if humans are the only beings that matter, it is simply a conflict among humans (but even then, allowing bikes on trails harms the MAJORITY of park users -- hikers and equestrians -- who can no longer safely and peacefully enjoy their parks). The parks aren't gymnasiums or racetracks or even human playgrounds. They are WILDLIFE HABITAT, which is precisely why they are attractive to humans. Activities such as mountain biking, that destroy habitat, violate the charter of the parks. Even kayaking and rafting, which give humans access to the entirety of a water body, prevent the wildlife that live there from making full use of their habitat, and should not be allowed. Of course those who think that only humans matter won't understand what I am talking about -- an indication of the sad state of our culture and educational system. Mike Vandeman, Ph.D.

xattt 2y ago

Tangential, but it would make sense that areas with more variable terrain (i.e. BC) would likely see more or more severe injuries than flat areas (i.e. Saskatchewan).

Ensorceled 2y ago

I predict this will get worse as e-bikes increasingly allow people to get to places they do not have the experience, fitness and skill to get their on their own.

duxup 2y ago
E-bikes that go too fast are already an issue. Friends wife went for a walk on a pedestrian path, onlookers saw her hit from behind by someone on an e-bike going very fast. She still doesn’t remember anything.
- Jagerbizzle 2y ago
  I wish there was some sort of permitting required to use one of these things. I love the idea of people getting around quickly without needing a car, but I take serious issue with a large number of people I see on these things in the streets (and more annoyingly sidewalks) of Seattle that think they're a pedestrian that just happens to be going 20+ mph.
  - neocritter 2y ago
    How much of this is the bicycle, and how much of this is that it enables less conscientious people to go more miles at otherwise normal cycling speeds? The e- part is limited to speeds most people can reach on a normal bicycle unless they modify it. /r/IdiotsInCars is a monument to how ineffective permitting is for this purpose. The people rear-ending pedestrians on sidewalks at 20MPH might be the same people who never miss their off ramp.
    - Kon-Peki 2y ago
      > The e- part is limited to speeds that most people can reach on a normal bicycle. Maybe. There are regulations, but the wording is generally such that the bike cannot be sold with a speed capability greater than X. So the bikes ship from the factory with a firmware setting for the max speed of X. But as soon as people buy the bike they go into the bike settings (!) and change it to whatever higher speed that they want. Whenever crashes happen these settings need to be examined and they need to be part of the liability determination.

chuckwfinley 2y ago

This is interesting and I don't doubt the problem exists, but just considering the physics of a person riding a bike, it seems tough to envision an effective safety system. Maybe expanded use of those "bike airbag helmets"? I can't imagine a mountain biker wearing a bunch of bulky padding and still being able to participate in the sport.

stevage 2y ago
Downhill mountain bikers do indeed wear a "bunch of bulky padding", often including spine protection. It'd be nice to see how much that helps.
- bdndndndbve 2y ago
  TFA says most of the injured people were wearing pads and they went head-first over the handlebars. Reading between the lines, it sounds like they landed on their heads and the forces on their spine caused injury. Much like CTEs in football, you're going to have a hard time protecting yourself against inertia.
  - bluGill 2y ago
    The article has most were wearing a helmet, but less than 10% other pads. I'm not clear on what other pads are, but they seem to include things like knee protection which I wouldn't expect to help in this type of accident (but probably help is much more common falls).
diggan 2y ago
Aren't there materials out there that can change from "fluid" to "solid" based on electrical signals? Or maybe something like Oobleck instead. Then you could have some sort of spine-protector, that outlines/protects your back and is flexible by default, but if it can tell you're falling through the air somehow/rotating around, it starts being inflexible to protect the structure of your back. I dunno, just brainstorming and have no experience building protective wear/devices.

stevage 2y ago

It'd be good to see the breakdown by types of mountain biking. I imagine downhill has a higher injury rate, but is it like 50% or 90%? I'm very into cycling, and like casual mountain biking. I've tried downhill a couple of times and it feels way too dangerous.

infecto 2y ago
That was my first thought too. Certainly this must be skewed towards downhill? Going high speed into jumps that send you 5-10+ft into the air must not have good outcomes if you miss the jump or landing. Most of the rest of mountain biking is fairly tame in my opinion.
Fricken 2y ago
Without a doubt it is overwhelmingly downhill riders. Everyone I know who does it has suffered multiple broken bones.
lonelyasacloud 2y ago
Almost certainly this, from the article "As a spine surgeon at Vancouver General Hospital, the provincial referral centre for all spinal cord injuries in B.C., Dr. Kwon decided to conduct the study after witnessing the high number of injuries coming out of mountain-bike parks." As others have pointed out, BC is somewhat of a downhill mountain bike Mecca with Whistler and various other parks running on the slopes during the summer https://www.mountainbikingbc.ca/ride-ideas-road-trips/bc-bike-parks/ https://www.mountainbikingbc.ca/ride-ideas-road-trips/bc-bik....
shanemhansen 2y ago
I agree. Even within those types there are some types of rides that are massively different. In MTB you have XC (cross country) which can be more about distance and grit. These bikes are lighter and have less suspension because you don't typically do a 10 foot drop on one. Enduro racing is what I think of as similar to skiing or snowboarding. You can go do the green/blue/black at a resort. You can also do the equivalent of taking a helicopter to the top of a crazy mountain pass and jump out. Then there is park stuff. Snowboarders might hop into a rail in the park. Mountain bikers might ride a wooden feature. The point being it's important to distinguish whether you're talking about the danger of taking a flowy green downhill or the danger of going off a 20 foot drop or the danger of hopping onto a narrow piece of Park stuff that's 30 feet off the ground. Because the injury rate of people on double black diamond runs in BC with 30 foot tall one foot wide wooden features is just not relevant to me because I am not riding that kind of terrain.

briandear 2y ago

My kids race GP motorcycles (Ohvale, Honda NSF250/Moto3) and it’s interesting how many well meaning but ignorant parents tell me how dangerous that is, yet they’ll gladly let their kids play soccer, do gymnastics, or (in the U.S.,) play tackle [American] football. Track racing injuries at the semi-pro and pro levels are a lot more rare than in traditional ball sports. Injuries do happen, but the safety gear is so advanced that it’s relatively rare. Far more dangerous riding a bicycle to school than racing at 200+mph on closed course racetracks. 4 kids racing for the past year in Spain and our only injury was a broken wrist while practicing on a supermoto in a parking lot. Countless crashes, but injuries have been rare. The soccer kids at their school though — seems like there is always one on crutches. Anecdotal, sure, but actual safety and perception of safety aren’t always the same. I think last year in racing there were maybe two fatalities in the entire world in organized motorcycle racing. In just August in the USA, 7 kids died playing American football. [1] In MotoGP, only 8 in the history of the sport have died while racing, with Marco Simoncelli being the most recent in 2011. The list of pro soccer players who have died after infield incidents is extensive.[2] My point is that “high risk” in my opinion, isn’t well defined. [1] https://www.npr.org/2024/08/28/nx-s1-5091883/middle-high-school-football-players-deaths-august https://www.npr.org/2024/08/28/nx-s1-5091883/middle-high-sch... [2] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_association_footballers_who_died_after_on-field_incidents https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_association_football...

duxup 2y ago
The article does seem to point to a study that tries to determine actual safety.
goda90 2y ago
But couldn't these numbers be explained by scale of participation alone? There have got to be way more football and soccer games in the world than motorcycle races by multiple orders of magnitude.
mech9879876 2y ago
I don't know entirely why the Isle of Man TT course is so deadly, but it took another life in 2024. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Isle_of_Man_TT_Mountain_Course_fatalities https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Isle_of_Man_TT_Mountai...

sva_ 2y ago

It has a lot to do with the amount of risk some bikers are willing to take. You can be very safe if you're careful. I'd say in general, the risk of getting hit by a car in traffic is much higher than something happening out in the mountains, depending on the city of course.

Toutouxc 2y ago

One thing to note is that British Columbia, especially the bike park in Whistler, is basically the Mecca of [this type of] mountain biking. For most people around the world it's not a cheap trip, riding there might be something they've dreamt about for years, and they intend to make every minute count, even though they're tired and some of the trails are unlike anything they've ever ridden at home.

jajko 2y ago
Something like Chamonix, France for many other extreme summer & winter mountain sports (downhill MTB including) then. People keep dying 'en masse' there, long term average is 60 per year in Mont Blanc range alone, but this includes all activities so heart attack during pleasant walk is there too. They compare it to whole US rockies in terms of mortality, not sure if it still holds. If folks focused purely on statistics whole place would be banned ad infinum due to world's easiest access to extreme terrain, luckily French folks have a different attitude to risks in what they consider 'noble' activities (which covers most mountain stuff). I almost contributed to stats there last year too with my medium severity paraglider landing crash (both legs broken but missed massive rock by few cms which would end up much more severe).
- tim333 2y ago
  I wonder how it compared to off piste snowboarding? I lived in Chamonix a bit and a lot of the shuttle bus drivers seemed to have spinal injuries from going off cliffs accidentally snowboarding off piste. It can be hard to see them in deep powder.
boringg 2y ago
It should also be noted that the technology for downhill mountain biking has exploded in quality and price -- probably also money from manufacturers sponsoring pros etc. Making it viable for super sketchy terrain (via tires, suspension, frame dynamics, braking) to be taken on and cliff drops to be attempted. Its probably the quickest advancing "extreme" sport happening right now - which would track with this finding since they are pushing the boundaries and the landings are HARD. For example go see the highlights of red bull rampage for the current mtn biking zeitgeist.

stefantalpalaru 2y ago

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3333333331 2y ago

Would love to see this normalized across the country (or world). Mountain bike trails in the Pacific Northwest are very different than, say, Central Pennsylvania. Riding loamy downhills on a full suspension bike might as well be a different sport than a low-speed rocky/rooty technical trails on a hardtail.

cbseven 2y ago

This article makes it sound like mountain biking is riskier than hockey (in terms of spinal cord injuries), but without relative participation rates, one cannot draw that conclusion.

maxerickson 2y ago
There is also a significant amount of personal risk tolerance involved. Casual riders can certainly have severe injuries, but easier trails are indeed easier.
- cduzz 2y ago
  I think it's way easier to get in over your head mountain biking than playing hockey. A casual hockey player finding themselves in a way too kinetic game of pickup can nope-out pretty quickly, or likely won't ever get into the situation. A casual mountain biker can go on a casual mountain bike ride with his brother and find himself way over his head, then bouncing down the trail on his head, very quickly and without an obvious offramp. Ask me how I know... ;)
  - shanemhansen 2y ago
    I empathize because I literally just finished healing from an injury that came within millimeters of killing me because I followed someone into an area that I wasn't prepared for. The first hospital I went to, after doing X-rays said I needed a level one trauma center and called an ambulance to take me to Seattle harbor view. I broke the cardinal rule of new technical terrain: pre-ride, re-ride, freeride. You get off your bike and walk the feature to see how approachable and rollable it might be. Then you session it (ride just that one feature). Then you ride through it quickly as part of a longer trail. I went 5 years without an injury. This one healed in 3 months. I believe I know what I did wrong and can fairly easily avoid making that same mistake again. Do I expect zero injuries in the future? No. What I expect is years at a time of an activity that very much enriches my life, with occasional injuries. Hopefully more than 5 years at a time since I'm making changes to avoid repeating the same mistake. And I wish people knew that downhill mountain biking is a lot like downhill skiing. You can take the greens down or you can yeet yourself off something that's tougher than a double black diamond. I've gone on many group mountain bike rides with people in their 70s. So like skiing it is something you can shoot for doing into your old age.

davycro 2y ago

This tracks with my own bias as an ER doc. I do feel that the risk of c-spine injuries from mountain biking is understated. As they said in the article, you are especially vulnerable to a hangmans fracture when thrown over the handlebars. I wonder if the ergonomics or geometry of a bicycle could be modified to better protect a rider’s neck.

mjvande 2y ago
Why "fix" mountain biking, when it's inevitably environmentally destructive? It needs to be banned, period.
- cassepipe 2y ago
  I don't know I thought cars would be a bigger priority since they are much more numerous, bigger, dirtier and so is their infrastructure ? It seems weird to concentrate your efforts on biking. What does it do, erode the mountains faster ? Scare away rabbits ?
  - freeride923 2y ago
    Please ignore that guy, he's a schizophrenic. Michael J. Vandeman was arrested by UC Berkeley police on May 28 after he allegedly attacked a bicyclist with a handsaw on a fire trail above the UC Berkeley campus weeks earlier. https://velo.outsideonline.com/mountain/mtb-hater-gets-busted-in-berkeley-hills/ https://velo.outsideonline.com/mountain/mtb-hater-gets-buste...
    - cassepipe 2y ago
      Oh, wow. Thanks for the intel.
n8henrie 2y ago
Hey man, funny "seeing" you round these parts!
engineer_22 2y ago

ourguile 2y ago

I do a lot of road cycling, but this is essentially why I refuse to participate in mountain biking (in my area). I've heard so many horror stories from friends of mine who ride and it sounds like accidents are only a matter of time. Even if someone rides as safe as they can, you can't account for others on the trails or the conditions 100% of the time.

sojournerc 2y ago
I got off a road bike onto a mountain because I feel I have more control. A motorist plowing me from behind on the highway is something I can't control. How fast or cautious I ride is in my control. It does help to be familiar with whatever trail you're riding however.
- TremendousJudge 2y ago
  Well you cannot control the trail conditions right? unless you are doing an inspection beforehand But yeah I agree road cycling is extremely dangerous, you are trusting that 100% percent of the drivers on the road will be mindful of cyclists, all the time.
  - sojournerc 2y ago
    Can't control but they are generally predictable. I tend to ride the same trail loop, so know it's condition based on recent weather. For new trails, it's helpful to ride with someone who's done it before, otherwise just take it easy. My cousin had a bad mountain bike accident, and i think it had to do with risk desensitisation. He's an excellent rider, and was just warming up and goofed a bit. Ended up breaking his back and knocking himself out. I don't necessarily think mtb is safer overall, but the risk factors are more apparent, and, as with any sport, user discretion is advised.
andy_ppp 2y ago
To be fair the same is true for road cycling and drivers, I've had some very lucky encounters by predicting the worst possible outcomes and managing to get lucky enough to avoid them. Especially in the UK or US where the car rules the road and you don't really count as a vehicle or a pedestrian, just a nuisance.

dukeofdoom 2y ago

I visited by Whistler, watched some of these guys, basically doing somersaults on mountain bikes on a pump track, going at high speed. So not surprising at all. Not exactly sure where I was. All I remember it was like meters away from nudist beach (nudist wooden dock, really). Which being immature dorks, we decided to dive off. But Whistler is kind of like Waikiki to Surfing. So might be sample bias. Most people don't take doing bike tricks that far. So its a thrill seeker place down there, that attracts a certain type of personality. https://www.youtube.com/@riseandalpine https://www.youtube.com/@riseandalpine

Havoc 2y ago

Mountain biking needs to be split into two. There is casual off-roading on a mountain bike and there is the dare devil downhill stuff. Very different risk profiles in my mind

taude 2y ago
yeah, agreed: huge difference in downhill, freestyle, etc...and my XC group rides. Also, BC, between Whistler and North Shore on Vancouver Island is pretty much mecca for this type of riding, bike parks, stunts, etc.... I'd be really curious what the stats are elsewhere, and broken out by what the rider was doing at time of injury.
deltarholamda 2y ago
My kids do mountain bike racing, and one of the reasons I like they do it is because it is incredibly safe. For one, where I am there aren't "mountains"; it's essentially off-road biking. But additionally, the organization they race in is emphatic about safety. The worst injuries done is to dad's wallet when a wheel gets bent or a derailleur goes blooey. The article says it's mostly men with an average age of 35. These are dudes who are pushing their own limits on some of the most difficult terrain. As you say, a radically different profile.
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harimau777 2y ago

I recall hearing in the past that equestrianism had the greatest risk of head trauma of any mainstream sport. If I recall correctly, even more than boxing. It's interesting that mountain biking is in many ways a similar activity (e.g. riding a "vehicle" that you straddle and which doesn't have the inherent stability of a car). It might be interesting to compare rates in equestrianism and biking to other sports where falls are a significant risk such as Judo or balance beam. Are falls a particularly dangerous part of sports or might there be something specific to falling from something you are straddling? Might it make a difference that Judo and gymnastics include specific training to develop balance and safe falling but biking and horseback riding do not?

showerst 2y ago
In Judo and gymnastics you're generally also traveling slower. Judo falls are also from a lower height and generally under control (just not yours, heh).
astura 2y ago
>It might be interesting to compare rates in equestrianism and biking to other sports where falls are a significant risk such as Judo or balance beam. So, in gymnastics you practice falling so you fall safer/more controlled. Falling correctly when you miss a skill was given as much weight as actually performing the skill. There was a policy in my gym that you fall unsafely in class (such as straddling the beam) you were required to do pushups for the rest of class. Gymnastics also has spotters who can prevent catastrophic injuries. Because of this, I think the risk of catastrophic injury in gymnastics is fairly low, especially at the lower levels.
barrkel 2y ago
Horse riding is about 10x more dangerous, for time spent, than motorcycling, IIRC. It is a seriously dangerous sport.
hirvi74 2y ago
I grew up around horses and even rode some myself when I was in my youth. I think the average person does not realize how horribly dangerous horses are. Think like in the movie/book "Gone with the Wind." While useful animals, horses are responsible for countless deaths. And this is purely conjecture on my part, but I imagine horses were more dangerous than cars ever have been. Even last year, my mother broke her neck from getting thrown, and miraculously made a full recovery despite almost severing her spinal cord. Her horse got spooked, bucked before she could react, and it was almost all over but the crying.

hyperbovine 2y ago

I’m shocked — shocked! — that this sport would have a higher injury rate than hockey. https://youtu.be/PCvrdZOk_kk?si=AwaCHd05eM-XYfV- https://youtu.be/PCvrdZOk_kk?si=AwaCHd05eM-XYfV- Or running your spine through a tree shredder, for that matter.

jbs789 2y ago
The article makes no statement about injury rate, just number of injuries.
dbspin 2y ago
That's pretty tame next to the courses and weather conditions in BC https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nakoqhu61nI https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nakoqhu61nI

PaulHoule 2y ago

I remember talking to a mountain biker who seemed proud of his injuries including concussions, breaking his shoulder twice, etc.

RankingMember 2y ago
In every sport there always seem to be a few who almost get off on abusing their body.
- liotier 2y ago
  Material proof of bravery (from the point of views of the scarred) or temerity (from everybody else's point of view)... And, less abusive but no less idiotic: the same idea but with broken hardware - a broken frame means limits were properly being pushed. I'm thankful I survived my teenage years... Thirty years later I make a point of keeping my wheels in permanent contact with the ground.
finnthehuman 2y ago
Would you rather they be ashamed of it?

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shanemhansen 2y ago

This title is so bad it's basically a lie. Better title: spinal cord injuries from mountain biking in BC exceed other high risk sports. The terrain in that area and parks include things like a lot of 30 foot tall one foot wide wood walkways. And as a MTB destination this terrain is often attempted by basically tourists. This is like saying "hiking injuries exceed other high risk sports" on Mt Everest.