8 ms·

I guess it speaks more to his utter lack of social skills than anything how he has managed to convince both the far left and far right he is simultaneously an E

by j4coh 2y ago

I guess it speaks more to his utter lack of social skills than anything how he has managed to convince both the far left and far right he is simultaneously an Elder of Zion super-Liberal enemy as well as a white supremacist fascist enemy. Comments supporting both readings keep popping up as replies and then get insta-flagged.

FloorEgg 2y ago
[flagged]
- JumpCrisscross 2y ago
  > Do you really think that being at odds with both extreme ends of the political spectrum is a bad thing? He's also at odds with much of the centre. Musk picks fights, and not particularly strategically. The comment about his lack of social skills is spot on.
- j4coh 2y ago
  He isn’t being read as being at odds with the extremes, he is seen as extreme. I personally don’t think he’s extremist, he reminds me of myself when I was an edgy, poorly socialised 12 year old except with billions of dollars. Hence the comment about social skills. To your second question, I’m not sure where you’re getting that I would think that so I’m unsure how to respond in a helpful way.
- tzs 2y ago
  It's not a bad thing if someone is at odds with both extremes because they are in the center. It is a bad thing if they are at odds with both extremes because they are one extreme on some issues and the other extreme on the rest of the issues. It's like how a house that is averages 68℉ (20℃) by being 68℉ (20℃) all day is a lot more pleasant than house that averages 68℉ (20℃) by being 50℉ (10℃) for half the day and 86℉ (30℃) for the other half of the day.
  - FloorEgg 2y ago
    What issues do you find he is extreme on?
    - llamaimperative 2y ago
      1. The result of the 2020 election is a big one 2. Supporting Germany's AfD, which e.g. backs "complete closure" of EU borders 3. Recently started advocating for a far-right loser in the UK (Tommy Robinson) who has multiple convictions including assault, assault, assault, mortgage fraud, contempt of court, and use of a false passport to enter the US 4. Continuing to insist that the Twitter Files showed that Dems stifled the Biden laptop story even after Matt Taibbi (who Musk hired to release the Twitter Files) wrote: "there’s no evidence - that I've seen - of any government involvement in the laptop story."
      - FloorEgg 2y ago
        [flagged]
        KerrAvon 2y ago
        You are disengaged from consensus reality if you don’t understand why thinking the 2020 election was in any way fraudulent is an extreme view.
        llamaimperative 2y ago
        I agree but I think s/he showed good faith with the rest of the comment and shouldn't be flagged. GP's surprise that Taibbi (author of the Twitter Files, hired by Musk) said "there is no evidence of government involvement in the laptop story" is great evidence of the fact that many people just live in informational wormholes.
        FloorEgg 2y ago
        Thank you. I think someone (or maybe multiple people) just mass flagged all my comments, including ones that I struggle to see as controversial. My curiosity and questioning of the "consensus reality" apparently really upset someone. Doesn't exactly make me more confident in their opinions, if when I question them or try to understand them by comparing my own views people attempt to silence me unjustly (I didn't break any HN rules as far as I can tell, and I checked). I spend about an hour a week on HN, and about another hour a week combined mixed between reddit, twitter, NYT, reuters, and probably a couple others I am forgetting. Just trying to get a pulse of what's going on across a wide range of sources. Most of my time consuming information is reading books and listening to podcasts. I have listened to several Elon musk interviews (Lex Fridman mostly). Does this explain my "information wormhole"?
- LightBug1 2y ago
  [flagged]
  - dang 2y ago
    Could you please stop posting unsubstantive comments and flamebait? You've unfortunately been doing it repeatedly. It's not what this site is for, and destroys what it is for. If you wouldn't mind reviewing https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html and taking the intended spirit of the site more to heart, we'd be grateful.
    - deleted 2y ago
      [deleted]
    - LightBug1 2y ago
      Sure - I'll try harder. But I think the post you're responding to is entirely factual and reasonable under the circumstances.
orwin 2y ago
You have almost no far left in the US. You have extreme ID politics (that are distributed on the far right, the right, the "extreme center" and socdems) and a bastardized radical center[0] that include almost every politicians, even those who appear socdems or far-right. And here i'm using far-right to designate people who want to come back on minority rights, and i separate it from the right. (Because when supposed "far left" organizations use the word "empowerment", i just facepalm, that's "third way" bullshit imho) I think Musk doesn't really understand his politics, and that's what hurt him. He should be in the extreme center (with Hillary, or Bush), but he was caught in ID politics for a long time. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radical_centrism https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radical_centrism
- j4coh 2y ago
  I am not in the US but thanks for the info.
- paulddraper 2y ago
  > You have almost no far left in the US. Overton window. Obviously "left" vs "right" depends on the geography and time period. Otherwise, it becomes very hard to talk about politics.
  - orwin 2y ago
    Not really, historically far-left is the revolutionary left, the one you see organize global strikes (they don't believe in representation democracy, only in direct democracy, bottom up, so it is _very_ rare to see them participate in elections). Since global strikes are forbidden in the US, you'll have to define it by its negative: anti-capitalist and anti-imperialist always, anti-globalist sometime. You have some groups who have a far-left affects in the US, but honestly since the BPP and the Rainbow Coalition they are either ideologically weak or ineffective.
    - paulddraper 2y ago
      So I can understand the distribution of this definition, what % of governments in world history have been far-left?

by j4coh 2y ago

FloorEgg 2y ago

[flagged]

JumpCrisscross 2y ago
> Do you really think that being at odds with both extreme ends of the political spectrum is a bad thing? He's also at odds with much of the centre. Musk picks fights, and not particularly strategically. The comment about his lack of social skills is spot on.
j4coh 2y ago
He isn’t being read as being at odds with the extremes, he is seen as extreme. I personally don’t think he’s extremist, he reminds me of myself when I was an edgy, poorly socialised 12 year old except with billions of dollars. Hence the comment about social skills. To your second question, I’m not sure where you’re getting that I would think that so I’m unsure how to respond in a helpful way.
tzs 2y ago
It's not a bad thing if someone is at odds with both extremes because they are in the center. It is a bad thing if they are at odds with both extremes because they are one extreme on some issues and the other extreme on the rest of the issues. It's like how a house that is averages 68℉ (20℃) by being 68℉ (20℃) all day is a lot more pleasant than house that averages 68℉ (20℃) by being 50℉ (10℃) for half the day and 86℉ (30℃) for the other half of the day.
- FloorEgg 2y ago
  What issues do you find he is extreme on?
  - llamaimperative 2y ago
    1. The result of the 2020 election is a big one 2. Supporting Germany's AfD, which e.g. backs "complete closure" of EU borders 3. Recently started advocating for a far-right loser in the UK (Tommy Robinson) who has multiple convictions including assault, assault, assault, mortgage fraud, contempt of court, and use of a false passport to enter the US 4. Continuing to insist that the Twitter Files showed that Dems stifled the Biden laptop story even after Matt Taibbi (who Musk hired to release the Twitter Files) wrote: "there’s no evidence - that I've seen - of any government involvement in the laptop story."
    - FloorEgg 2y ago
      [flagged]
      - KerrAvon 2y ago
        You are disengaged from consensus reality if you don’t understand why thinking the 2020 election was in any way fraudulent is an extreme view.
        llamaimperative 2y ago
        I agree but I think s/he showed good faith with the rest of the comment and shouldn't be flagged. GP's surprise that Taibbi (author of the Twitter Files, hired by Musk) said "there is no evidence of government involvement in the laptop story" is great evidence of the fact that many people just live in informational wormholes.
        FloorEgg 2y ago
        Thank you. I think someone (or maybe multiple people) just mass flagged all my comments, including ones that I struggle to see as controversial. My curiosity and questioning of the "consensus reality" apparently really upset someone. Doesn't exactly make me more confident in their opinions, if when I question them or try to understand them by comparing my own views people attempt to silence me unjustly (I didn't break any HN rules as far as I can tell, and I checked). I spend about an hour a week on HN, and about another hour a week combined mixed between reddit, twitter, NYT, reuters, and probably a couple others I am forgetting. Just trying to get a pulse of what's going on across a wide range of sources. Most of my time consuming information is reading books and listening to podcasts. I have listened to several Elon musk interviews (Lex Fridman mostly). Does this explain my "information wormhole"?
LightBug1 2y ago
[flagged]
- dang 2y ago
  Could you please stop posting unsubstantive comments and flamebait? You've unfortunately been doing it repeatedly. It's not what this site is for, and destroys what it is for. If you wouldn't mind reviewing https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html and taking the intended spirit of the site more to heart, we'd be grateful.
  - deleted 2y ago
    [deleted]
  - LightBug1 2y ago
    Sure - I'll try harder. But I think the post you're responding to is entirely factual and reasonable under the circumstances.

orwin 2y ago

You have almost no far left in the US. You have extreme ID politics (that are distributed on the far right, the right, the "extreme center" and socdems) and a bastardized radical center[0] that include almost every politicians, even those who appear socdems or far-right. And here i'm using far-right to designate people who want to come back on minority rights, and i separate it from the right. (Because when supposed "far left" organizations use the word "empowerment", i just facepalm, that's "third way" bullshit imho) I think Musk doesn't really understand his politics, and that's what hurt him. He should be in the extreme center (with Hillary, or Bush), but he was caught in ID politics for a long time. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radical_centrism https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radical_centrism

j4coh 2y ago
I am not in the US but thanks for the info.
paulddraper 2y ago
> You have almost no far left in the US. Overton window. Obviously "left" vs "right" depends on the geography and time period. Otherwise, it becomes very hard to talk about politics.
- orwin 2y ago
  Not really, historically far-left is the revolutionary left, the one you see organize global strikes (they don't believe in representation democracy, only in direct democracy, bottom up, so it is _very_ rare to see them participate in elections). Since global strikes are forbidden in the US, you'll have to define it by its negative: anti-capitalist and anti-imperialist always, anti-globalist sometime. You have some groups who have a far-left affects in the US, but honestly since the BPP and the Rainbow Coalition they are either ideologically weak or ineffective.
  - paulddraper 2y ago
    So I can understand the distribution of this definition, what % of governments in world history have been far-left?