18 ms·

How to grow professional relationships

411 points by Liriel 2y ago

eleveriven 2y ago
Abandoning lost causes can be one of the toughest but most freeing decisions in relationships. I once worked with a colleague who seemed completely resistant to collaboration. No matter how much I tried to engage or find common ground, they kept shutting down any attempt at teamwork. But one day, I realized I was investing so much energy into something that wasn’t going anywhere.
- bravetraveler 2y ago
  Having been/am the other side this... they're probably relieved too. It can be counter-intuitive. Despite nature... there is potential for the desired outcome - with less pressure, honest [not forced] engagement. Personally, my apprehension comes from within. It's nothing to do with anything 'outside'. My water level is different, that's all. Most reasonable people feel overbearing - it's on me, not them.
  - eleveriven 2y ago
    Hmm, your analogy about water levels is so relatable. It captures how people’s capacity to engage can differ without it being anyone’s fault
    - bravetraveler 2y ago
      Thank you, indeed. I can't take much credit... I heard it somewhere and think on it too much. We all carry different amounts and it's not all visible :) This affects us differently when things are smooth, rocky, or even just changing. I have been exceedingly lucky so far to have mostly-cooperative environments, perhaps too much. I've been enabled to a few degrees
    - tejaskumar_ 2y ago
      Exactly! And there's billions of people on the planet—at some point, people meet people with similar water levels.
- alexpotato 2y ago
  > No matter how much I tried to engage or find common ground, they kept shutting down any attempt at teamwork. This reminds me of a story from when I was in business school. We were assigned groups for project work and it was very difficult if not impossible to transfer out of a group. This was by design b/c the point was to teach the students to deal with interpersonal issues and group dynamics. My friend was in a group with someone we will call Bob. Bob always showed up late, argued about every assignment, would debate for hours about why he couldn't do a task etc. Eventually, my friend just declared "task bankruptcy" with Bob and gave him no work to do. Why? He realized it was easier to give Bob nothing to do and just redistribute the tasks to the rest of the group versus trying to get Bob to do anything. I should add, it seems that Bob had some kind of special status with the school as he always showed up late to exams, was able to turn in work late etc. In closing, a lot of this is reminding me of the "CIA guide to corporate sabotage": https://www.corporate-rebels.com/blog/cia-field-manual https://www.corporate-rebels.com/blog/cia-field-manual
  - tejaskumar_ 2y ago
    Did they consider kicking Bob out of the group?
    - alexpotato 2y ago
      This was highly discouraged as the whole point of the group projects was to teach how to deal with group dynamics.
      - tejaskumar_ 2y ago
        Isn't a part of dealing with group dynamics though recognizing when there is harm in/to the group and removing it? (sorry)
      - antisthenes 2y ago
        If the whole point was to teach how to deal with group dynamics, then kicking Bob out should have been rewarded with an automatic 100% Grade. But since you mentioned "tasks", I assume there was actual work beyond chatting up your teammates. So your description is inaccurate.
- tejaskumar_ 2y ago
  This, exactly. Glad this point came across clearly and power to you!
- blitzar 2y ago
  he's just not that into you
  - tejaskumar_ 2y ago
    they're*
mkmk 2y ago
On the practical side of things, one important behavior that I see people frequently forget is the importance of following up. This is probably the biggest differentiator between relationships that languish in the early stages, versus those that progress along the author’s continuum. It’s always a bit strange when you only hear from people once every few years, just as they need an intro or career advice or whatever- the beginning of those conversations is usually a bit of sheepish catch-up on what happened after you last spoke with them. Similarly, there have been times when I have felt like a dope after realizing that I failed to follow up myself after a call, and am again reaching out for another reason. However, when you follow up with someone as simple as “Thanks for connecting me with so and so, we had a great chat” or “I tried that thing you suggested, here’s how it worked out”, you build mutual trust and enthusiasm for a successful outcome to the conversation you had. It’s a genuine and thoughtful way to grow your relationship.
- jameshush 2y ago
  I'll add to this: If you want to practice following up but are afraid of "bugging" someone, start by wishing 1-3 people happy birthday every day. I put every person I know birthday on one giant Google calendar and wish people happy every day. It's a super easy way to at least say "hi" to someone once a year.
  - tejaskumar_ 2y ago
    I love this.
  - sfink 2y ago
    I tried this, but it didn't work very well for me. Maybe I was just catching people at a bad time? They'd always brush me off with some version of "uh, it isn't my birthday" "you've said that to me every day for a week, please stop" "stay away from me". What could I be doing wrong? Am I just choosing the wrong people to try to befriend?
    - BlueTemplar 2y ago
      > "you've said that to me every day for a week, please stop" Did you, or didn't you ??
MrMcCall 2y ago
I only skimmed it, but the framework is pretty sound, aside from the fact that what should be the focal point Love your neighbor as yourself seems to be buried at the end, so it doesn't look like he really takes that teaching to heart. I hope I'm wrong about this. Still, it's better than anything else I've seen on here in terms of group dynamics. It's a good step in right direction in this fraught world. ETA: And his tech skills are legit. I've been on the internet since before HTML, and his site is very well done. And his smile does not betray any negativity, so he looks like a legitimately good human being. I'm rarely impressed, but am with his site.
- tejaskumar_ 2y ago
  I also hope you're wrong about this, but there's no way for me to know other than what my peers say (https://x.com/kilianvalkhof/status/1864284445584261163 https://x.com/kilianvalkhof/status/1864284445584261163).
  - MrMcCall 2y ago
    We can know the truth of anything, most especially ourselves, as that truth is essential to our spiritual grown. As Rumi says, "The Way goes in." Just before seeing your reply, I had just edited my comment to add my appreciation of your site and visage. In my experience, a person can't fake a smile like yours. People dealing with physical hardship often become close with our Creator, and are then filled with the light of love's radiance. My blessing has been poverty and learning how to love God and others with all my heart. If that interests you, you can read my comment history and see if you find anything to take inspiration from. Or even contact me. The Greatest Command(ment) is my family's North Star. Peace be with you, and may your joy and success be neverending. I am at your service. We love you.
ztlasg 2y ago
I've no idea what to take from this. Large parts sound like carefully planned entryism: Identify the gatekeepers, if they reject you, move on. The situation where the gatekeepers do let you in but their gatekeeping is not apparent until years later is not mentioned. Providing excellent work is not mentioned. Given the political state of software "development", the poster might be on to something, but it is hard to find any concrete advice.
- tejaskumar_ 2y ago
  I apologize. This is good feedback for follow-up work though. Thank you!
- whiplash451 2y ago
  Hard disagree. I found the post inspiring and practical -- and have 15+ years of management in tech. Keep it up, Tejas!
  - tejaskumar_ 2y ago
    Hey, thanks @whiplash451!
whiplash451 2y ago
This is one of the most inspiring and useful read I have come across on this topic in several years. Thanks for sharing!
- tejaskumar_ 2y ago
  I'm glad it was helpful!
fredtalty5 2y ago
[dead]
- mihaic 2y ago
  This type of advice only works in the right environments, of which most countries or social groups don't seem to fall into. I do agree with most of it, but you really need to make sure you're the in right environments before putting in the effort.
  - tejaskumar_ 2y ago
    And sensing early when the environments are wrong and aborting sooner rather than later.
njarboe 2y ago
It is nice if your profession has a yearly conference that most people go to. It is a place and time designated to see those colleagues in person and strengthen/maintain relationships.
that_guy_iain 2y ago
I find this quite funny, I've worked with this author at a company and the stories of his behaviour to other coworkers there make my WTF collection. So to find him talking about growing professional relationships either means he's made massive strides in his behaviour or it's a lot of nonsense. This is the one I always tell people when I explain how WTF IT can be, I wasn't there for it, but it was retold with the author in the room laughing about it. A female coworker joined and on her first day he went up to her and said "You know you're a slut, right?" And there were tons of stories of him saying the craziest of shit. That company had serious culture problems, from a CTO who would take his anger out on juniors, demand complete nonsense that made no technical sense, and a revolving door of employees who were leaving because of the CTO or Tejas. Funny enough, in my personal opinion, Tejas was always well-meaning and rather friendly he just would say the weirdest of shit ever.
- tejaskumar_ 2y ago
  Iain, nice to hear from you after all these years! I still say the weirdest shit ever, but now more in line with my value of honoring people above all else. I indeed, by the grace of God, have made massive strides in my behavior thanks to friends like Gabe Greenberg from G2i.co (where I worked some time ago) and others. I also talk about our shared company where we worked together and the toxic environment in this podcast: https://youtu.be/muS-wQP2lV4?si=XIVpuzc6TzsLUvpp&t=852 https://youtu.be/muS-wQP2lV4?si=XIVpuzc6TzsLUvpp&t=852 if you're interested to catch up a bit.
  - trogdor 2y ago
    Your response to Iain suggests that his account of your interaction with a new female colleague (“You know you're a slut, right?") is generally accurate. Do you really think of that as “saying the weirdest shit ever”? Most people I know would call it overt sexual harassment. I’m struggling to understand how you could have thought that was acceptable conduct. What am I missing?
    - anthonyc 2y ago
      I hate to pile on, but I listened to the podcast OP linked above. It doesn't make the situation sound any better. It is worse, actually. OP is tone deaf going on this podcast talking about the toxic, racist, misogynistic culture with seemingly no awareness of his contribution to it.
rkejeheowje 2y ago
[flagged]
dennis_jeeves2 2y ago
Nearly every professional 'relationship' I've had has been transient after you stop working with them, with people completely failing to reciprocate even after multiple attempts to reach out. From talking to people I know that this experience is not unique to me, this appears to be the norm, may be it's the industry I work in : software development.
- tejaskumar_ 2y ago
  I'm sorry to hear that's your experience and hope this article helps that get a little better!
- askafriend 2y ago
  Allow me to be crude for a second: half the people in software are likely autistic so I'm not surprised they struggle with building or maintaining relationships.
  - dennis_jeeves2 2y ago
    Yes, I did figure that out, they are idiot savants of sorts.
  - chefandy 2y ago
    Some of the most loyal and connected colleagues I've had have been autists. I have a lot in my family so there's probably some amount of "safe person" vibes I give off, but in my experience, many autists realize the value of someone they can feel comfortable talking to and confiding in that can comfortably navigate social situations and professional communication. Lots of "I just don't understand why they reacted like that-- what's your take?" kind of conversations. Most of these folks have been younger than me, though, so there could well be some other cultural factor at play: some way that young people are getting different experiences/skills/comfort levels now, or maybe their interaction style/strategy will change as they get older?
  - mp05 2y ago
    Honest question: has the software profession not been democratized to the point where "neurotypical" people have come to overtake these jobs from those stereotypical "basement dwellers"? Or would you argue that being on the autistic spectrum provides one with abilities that their unaffected counterparts cannot possess?
reubenswartz 2y ago
It took me a long time to realize that conversations are the building blocks of relationships. Want a relationship? You need to have conversations.
- tejaskumar_ 2y ago
  Exactly. My relationships got so much better after learning to be better at conversation.
  - reubenswartz 2y ago
    yes, and you don't have to keep in touch with everyone-- find the people you enjoy talking to, and just make a point to do it.
    - mettamage 2y ago
      Huh, hadn't thought of it that clearly. Thanks!
nextworddev 2y ago
Don’t try to “network”. Try to “attract” instead. People are jaded af these days.
- pphysch 2y ago
  Isn't that just relying on others to establish connection first?
mung_daal 2y ago
evil people have to draw charts on how to interact with their minions rather than being an upstanding human being who has tried to read a few icelandic poems before...
- tejaskumar_ 2y ago
  what are you even saying
throwaway5752 2y ago
If you need to read something like this, consider it a mildly bad sign. If you think this transactionally, it may actively hurt your ability to build these relationships. Simply be nice, be on time, work hard. Treat everyone, boss, colleague or subordinate with high degree of respect. Remember that they are human beings and have families, and respect that. Consider everyone in your company as a member of a team working for a common goal, and presume positive intent. Treat competitors and vendors with respect and act ethically. Just have good manners and empathy, really. This is much better because it works universally, not just in professional relationships.
deleted 2y ago
[deleted]
mrcptthrowaway 2y ago
> A lesson I learned from reading Mark Manson’s “Models” as an awkward stupid teenager who wanted to get girls is that the world is an abundant one full of all kinds of people: some who shun us, others who love us. When someone reveals that there’s no room for a relationship, they do us a huge favor and free us up to go pursue others who are open to it. I’ve seen great success in quickly being thankful for the data and moving on. Getting strong pickup artist vibes here. I needed that sort of knowledge too. Married nowadays, would've been single forever probably if I wouldn't have gone through that phase. It makes sense that you break social interactions down like this. This type of thinking flows from pickup. It also puts into context that you said stuff like "you know you're a slut" (which you don't remember doing but you mentioned having done similar enough things). It seems you mixed pickup with work. I was a high schooler when I learned it and did it solely outside of high school. So I wouldn't run into these things.

411 points by Liriel 2y ago

Abandoning lost causes can be one of the toughest but most freeing decisions in relationships. I once worked with a colleague who seemed completely resistant to collaboration. No matter how much I tried to engage or find common ground, they kept shutting down any attempt at teamwork. But one day, I realized I was investing so much energy into something that wasn’t going anywhere.

bravetraveler 2y ago
Having been/am the other side this... they're probably relieved too. It can be counter-intuitive. Despite nature... there is potential for the desired outcome - with less pressure, honest [not forced] engagement. Personally, my apprehension comes from within. It's nothing to do with anything 'outside'. My water level is different, that's all. Most reasonable people feel overbearing - it's on me, not them.
- eleveriven 2y ago
  Hmm, your analogy about water levels is so relatable. It captures how people’s capacity to engage can differ without it being anyone’s fault
  - bravetraveler 2y ago
    Thank you, indeed. I can't take much credit... I heard it somewhere and think on it too much. We all carry different amounts and it's not all visible :) This affects us differently when things are smooth, rocky, or even just changing. I have been exceedingly lucky so far to have mostly-cooperative environments, perhaps too much. I've been enabled to a few degrees
  - tejaskumar_ 2y ago
    Exactly! And there's billions of people on the planet—at some point, people meet people with similar water levels.
alexpotato 2y ago
> No matter how much I tried to engage or find common ground, they kept shutting down any attempt at teamwork. This reminds me of a story from when I was in business school. We were assigned groups for project work and it was very difficult if not impossible to transfer out of a group. This was by design b/c the point was to teach the students to deal with interpersonal issues and group dynamics. My friend was in a group with someone we will call Bob. Bob always showed up late, argued about every assignment, would debate for hours about why he couldn't do a task etc. Eventually, my friend just declared "task bankruptcy" with Bob and gave him no work to do. Why? He realized it was easier to give Bob nothing to do and just redistribute the tasks to the rest of the group versus trying to get Bob to do anything. I should add, it seems that Bob had some kind of special status with the school as he always showed up late to exams, was able to turn in work late etc. In closing, a lot of this is reminding me of the "CIA guide to corporate sabotage": https://www.corporate-rebels.com/blog/cia-field-manual https://www.corporate-rebels.com/blog/cia-field-manual
- tejaskumar_ 2y ago
  Did they consider kicking Bob out of the group?
  - alexpotato 2y ago
    This was highly discouraged as the whole point of the group projects was to teach how to deal with group dynamics.
    - tejaskumar_ 2y ago
      Isn't a part of dealing with group dynamics though recognizing when there is harm in/to the group and removing it? (sorry)
    - antisthenes 2y ago
      If the whole point was to teach how to deal with group dynamics, then kicking Bob out should have been rewarded with an automatic 100% Grade. But since you mentioned "tasks", I assume there was actual work beyond chatting up your teammates. So your description is inaccurate.
tejaskumar_ 2y ago
This, exactly. Glad this point came across clearly and power to you!
blitzar 2y ago
he's just not that into you
- tejaskumar_ 2y ago
  they're*

mkmk 2y ago

On the practical side of things, one important behavior that I see people frequently forget is the importance of following up. This is probably the biggest differentiator between relationships that languish in the early stages, versus those that progress along the author’s continuum. It’s always a bit strange when you only hear from people once every few years, just as they need an intro or career advice or whatever- the beginning of those conversations is usually a bit of sheepish catch-up on what happened after you last spoke with them. Similarly, there have been times when I have felt like a dope after realizing that I failed to follow up myself after a call, and am again reaching out for another reason. However, when you follow up with someone as simple as “Thanks for connecting me with so and so, we had a great chat” or “I tried that thing you suggested, here’s how it worked out”, you build mutual trust and enthusiasm for a successful outcome to the conversation you had. It’s a genuine and thoughtful way to grow your relationship.

jameshush 2y ago
I'll add to this: If you want to practice following up but are afraid of "bugging" someone, start by wishing 1-3 people happy birthday every day. I put every person I know birthday on one giant Google calendar and wish people happy every day. It's a super easy way to at least say "hi" to someone once a year.
- tejaskumar_ 2y ago
  I love this.
- sfink 2y ago
  I tried this, but it didn't work very well for me. Maybe I was just catching people at a bad time? They'd always brush me off with some version of "uh, it isn't my birthday" "you've said that to me every day for a week, please stop" "stay away from me". What could I be doing wrong? Am I just choosing the wrong people to try to befriend?
  - BlueTemplar 2y ago
    > "you've said that to me every day for a week, please stop" Did you, or didn't you ??

MrMcCall 2y ago

I only skimmed it, but the framework is pretty sound, aside from the fact that what should be the focal point Love your neighbor as yourself seems to be buried at the end, so it doesn't look like he really takes that teaching to heart. I hope I'm wrong about this. Still, it's better than anything else I've seen on here in terms of group dynamics. It's a good step in right direction in this fraught world. ETA: And his tech skills are legit. I've been on the internet since before HTML, and his site is very well done. And his smile does not betray any negativity, so he looks like a legitimately good human being. I'm rarely impressed, but am with his site.

tejaskumar_ 2y ago
I also hope you're wrong about this, but there's no way for me to know other than what my peers say (https://x.com/kilianvalkhof/status/1864284445584261163 https://x.com/kilianvalkhof/status/1864284445584261163).
- MrMcCall 2y ago
  We can know the truth of anything, most especially ourselves, as that truth is essential to our spiritual grown. As Rumi says, "The Way goes in." Just before seeing your reply, I had just edited my comment to add my appreciation of your site and visage. In my experience, a person can't fake a smile like yours. People dealing with physical hardship often become close with our Creator, and are then filled with the light of love's radiance. My blessing has been poverty and learning how to love God and others with all my heart. If that interests you, you can read my comment history and see if you find anything to take inspiration from. Or even contact me. The Greatest Command(ment) is my family's North Star. Peace be with you, and may your joy and success be neverending. I am at your service. We love you.

ztlasg 2y ago

I've no idea what to take from this. Large parts sound like carefully planned entryism: Identify the gatekeepers, if they reject you, move on. The situation where the gatekeepers do let you in but their gatekeeping is not apparent until years later is not mentioned. Providing excellent work is not mentioned. Given the political state of software "development", the poster might be on to something, but it is hard to find any concrete advice.

tejaskumar_ 2y ago
I apologize. This is good feedback for follow-up work though. Thank you!
whiplash451 2y ago
Hard disagree. I found the post inspiring and practical -- and have 15+ years of management in tech. Keep it up, Tejas!
- tejaskumar_ 2y ago
  Hey, thanks @whiplash451!

whiplash451 2y ago

This is one of the most inspiring and useful read I have come across on this topic in several years. Thanks for sharing!

tejaskumar_ 2y ago
I'm glad it was helpful!

fredtalty5 2y ago

[dead]

mihaic 2y ago
This type of advice only works in the right environments, of which most countries or social groups don't seem to fall into. I do agree with most of it, but you really need to make sure you're the in right environments before putting in the effort.
- tejaskumar_ 2y ago
  And sensing early when the environments are wrong and aborting sooner rather than later.

njarboe 2y ago

It is nice if your profession has a yearly conference that most people go to. It is a place and time designated to see those colleagues in person and strengthen/maintain relationships.

that_guy_iain 2y ago

I find this quite funny, I've worked with this author at a company and the stories of his behaviour to other coworkers there make my WTF collection. So to find him talking about growing professional relationships either means he's made massive strides in his behaviour or it's a lot of nonsense. This is the one I always tell people when I explain how WTF IT can be, I wasn't there for it, but it was retold with the author in the room laughing about it. A female coworker joined and on her first day he went up to her and said "You know you're a slut, right?" And there were tons of stories of him saying the craziest of shit. That company had serious culture problems, from a CTO who would take his anger out on juniors, demand complete nonsense that made no technical sense, and a revolving door of employees who were leaving because of the CTO or Tejas. Funny enough, in my personal opinion, Tejas was always well-meaning and rather friendly he just would say the weirdest of shit ever.

tejaskumar_ 2y ago
Iain, nice to hear from you after all these years! I still say the weirdest shit ever, but now more in line with my value of honoring people above all else. I indeed, by the grace of God, have made massive strides in my behavior thanks to friends like Gabe Greenberg from G2i.co (where I worked some time ago) and others. I also talk about our shared company where we worked together and the toxic environment in this podcast: https://youtu.be/muS-wQP2lV4?si=XIVpuzc6TzsLUvpp&t=852 https://youtu.be/muS-wQP2lV4?si=XIVpuzc6TzsLUvpp&t=852 if you're interested to catch up a bit.
- trogdor 2y ago
  Your response to Iain suggests that his account of your interaction with a new female colleague (“You know you're a slut, right?") is generally accurate. Do you really think of that as “saying the weirdest shit ever”? Most people I know would call it overt sexual harassment. I’m struggling to understand how you could have thought that was acceptable conduct. What am I missing?
  - anthonyc 2y ago
    I hate to pile on, but I listened to the podcast OP linked above. It doesn't make the situation sound any better. It is worse, actually. OP is tone deaf going on this podcast talking about the toxic, racist, misogynistic culture with seemingly no awareness of his contribution to it.

rkejeheowje 2y ago

[flagged]

dennis_jeeves2 2y ago

Nearly every professional 'relationship' I've had has been transient after you stop working with them, with people completely failing to reciprocate even after multiple attempts to reach out. From talking to people I know that this experience is not unique to me, this appears to be the norm, may be it's the industry I work in : software development.

tejaskumar_ 2y ago
I'm sorry to hear that's your experience and hope this article helps that get a little better!
askafriend 2y ago
Allow me to be crude for a second: half the people in software are likely autistic so I'm not surprised they struggle with building or maintaining relationships.
- dennis_jeeves2 2y ago
  Yes, I did figure that out, they are idiot savants of sorts.
- chefandy 2y ago
  Some of the most loyal and connected colleagues I've had have been autists. I have a lot in my family so there's probably some amount of "safe person" vibes I give off, but in my experience, many autists realize the value of someone they can feel comfortable talking to and confiding in that can comfortably navigate social situations and professional communication. Lots of "I just don't understand why they reacted like that-- what's your take?" kind of conversations. Most of these folks have been younger than me, though, so there could well be some other cultural factor at play: some way that young people are getting different experiences/skills/comfort levels now, or maybe their interaction style/strategy will change as they get older?
- mp05 2y ago
  Honest question: has the software profession not been democratized to the point where "neurotypical" people have come to overtake these jobs from those stereotypical "basement dwellers"? Or would you argue that being on the autistic spectrum provides one with abilities that their unaffected counterparts cannot possess?

reubenswartz 2y ago

It took me a long time to realize that conversations are the building blocks of relationships. Want a relationship? You need to have conversations.

tejaskumar_ 2y ago
Exactly. My relationships got so much better after learning to be better at conversation.
- reubenswartz 2y ago
  yes, and you don't have to keep in touch with everyone-- find the people you enjoy talking to, and just make a point to do it.
  - mettamage 2y ago
    Huh, hadn't thought of it that clearly. Thanks!

nextworddev 2y ago

Don’t try to “network”. Try to “attract” instead. People are jaded af these days.

pphysch 2y ago
Isn't that just relying on others to establish connection first?

mung_daal 2y ago

evil people have to draw charts on how to interact with their minions rather than being an upstanding human being who has tried to read a few icelandic poems before...

tejaskumar_ 2y ago
what are you even saying

throwaway5752 2y ago

If you need to read something like this, consider it a mildly bad sign. If you think this transactionally, it may actively hurt your ability to build these relationships. Simply be nice, be on time, work hard. Treat everyone, boss, colleague or subordinate with high degree of respect. Remember that they are human beings and have families, and respect that. Consider everyone in your company as a member of a team working for a common goal, and presume positive intent. Treat competitors and vendors with respect and act ethically. Just have good manners and empathy, really. This is much better because it works universally, not just in professional relationships.

deleted 2y ago

[deleted]

mrcptthrowaway 2y ago

> A lesson I learned from reading Mark Manson’s “Models” as an awkward stupid teenager who wanted to get girls is that the world is an abundant one full of all kinds of people: some who shun us, others who love us. When someone reveals that there’s no room for a relationship, they do us a huge favor and free us up to go pursue others who are open to it. I’ve seen great success in quickly being thankful for the data and moving on. Getting strong pickup artist vibes here. I needed that sort of knowledge too. Married nowadays, would've been single forever probably if I wouldn't have gone through that phase. It makes sense that you break social interactions down like this. This type of thinking flows from pickup. It also puts into context that you said stuff like "you know you're a slut" (which you don't remember doing but you mentioned having done similar enough things). It seems you mixed pickup with work. I was a high schooler when I learned it and did it solely outside of high school. So I wouldn't run into these things.