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Maslow 4: Large format CNC routing made accessible
- mdaniel 2y agoThey had a submission 8 years ago[1] but I came across the YouTube announcement[2] of their new 4.1 Kickstarter campaign[3]. It only seeks $16,000 of which they've currently raised $249,000 based in no small part that they've already shipped several successful releases, I'd guess Their project is open source[4], GPLv3 for the on-device software and CC-BY-SA 4 for the cad files 1: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12705546 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12705546 2: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I5bZfNOZi-A https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I5bZfNOZi-A 3: https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/maslow4/maslow41-accessible-large-format-cnc-router https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/maslow4/maslow41-access... 4: https://www.maslowcnc.com/source https://www.maslowcnc.com/source
- RobotToaster 2y ago> https://www.maslowcnc.com/addendum https://www.maslowcnc.com/addendum I need to know what drama happened to cause this, lol
- leoedin 2y agoThere's a YouTube explainer somewhere. But the basic gist is that after developing the first Maslow device as open hardware, MakerMade sold their own version (with agreement from the original designer, who I don't think wanted to spend all his time manufacturing them). Then MakerMade decided they owned the "Maslow" name and it all got messy.
- giarc 2y agoSounds very "mullenweg"ish.
- lrivers 2y agoThis should become a verb. Mullenweged
- mhb 2y agoThis is what it actually does: https://www.maslowcnc.com/about-maslow4 https://www.maslowcnc.com/about-maslow4
- throwaway81523 2y agoAha, a plunge router attached to a Roomba j/k ;). That page is very helpful. Hard to say what it's good for unless you're a dedicated woodwork buff. Otherwise a jigsaw seems like enough for a lot of this.
- deleted 2y ago[deleted]
- Projectiboga 2y agoI think it can do beveled and rounded edges plus do surface cuts* like for cabinent doors. And this will cut even edges, jigsaws are trickier for curves. *(likely wrong word)
- zharknado 2y agoCapabilities that would be most impressive with a jigsaw: - 50mm of z-axis travel - Cuts in the center of a 4x8’ sheet of material - Repeatable cuts to a decent tolerance - Cuts made while you sleep
- diggan 2y ago> - Cuts made while you sleep Can you leave the Maslow completely unattended? The video examples/timelapses I came across seems to always have a person removing sawdust (or something) every X minutes.
- syntaxing 2y agoIt’s pretty ill advised to leave any subtractive manufacturing machinery unattended
- FlyingAvatar 2y agoI backed the original Maslow and also the Maslow 4, and recently a 4.1 upgrade. The creator is a really dedicated guy and the Maslow is a great CNC for those who cut sheets goods from wood (though folks have adapted it to other materials) and are OK with some tinkering. There is a decent sized community that supports the software as well.
- bradly 2y agoHow straight are its cuts? I've used traditional large 10'x5' woodworking CNCs and found them very challenging if not using them daily.
- FlyingAvatar 2y agoI don't have direct experience with long, straight cuts in my use case, but based on what I have seen in the forums the Maslow 4 is pretty good at them. It has an auto-calibration feature that the original did not have which makes it much less finicky to dial in than the original Maslow. In the forums, I have seen people cutting cabinet parts with it, so I have to assume the straightness is acceptable, but it might be worth asking those who are using it for that purpose specifically.
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- dyauspitr 2y agoI wonder if it’s possible to have a purely portable system like this. So no cables, just omnidirectional wheels and maybe some wireless locators in the corner of the room. It would need to correct for wheels losing traction, slope etc.
- WillAdams 2y agoWhat you are describing is the Goliath CNC: https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/2130625347/goliath-cnc-an-autonomous-robotic-machine-tool-for https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/2130625347/goliath-cnc-... didn't really make it over the long haul. The Shaper Origin seems more successful: https://www.shapertools.com/en-us https://www.shapertools.com/en-us
- hatsix 2y agoShaper Origin took a genius approach. There's very little movement of the cutting head, and the machine itself is moved by the person. You get the precision of CNC, without the complexity of moving a machine that is heavy enough to push a cutter through wood over an uneven surface
- ano-ther 2y agoI guess the wheeled approach quickly loses traction when trying to exert force. The Shaper Origin avoids that by being hand-pushed (with human-level force feedback and control).
- imtringued 2y agoThe entire point of wheels is to provide as little rolling resistance as possible. The very idea of Goliath is contradictory. You want stiffness and rigidity, while also being free to move around. The only way their system could work is by having a vacuum clamping system with a movable gantry.
- sourdoughness 2y agoVacuum clamping would get tricky when the surface you’re trying to slurp onto is also the thing you’re actively cutting holes in, right?
- freeqaz 2y agoAnybody know if there are any accessible large format 3D printers that have big nozzles? (Ie like >1mm) I briefly looked but there were all crazy $$$ so curious if others know!
- numpad0 2y ago1mm nozzles and long leadscrews are generally AliExpress available. Frame and Z-axis rigidity, vibration damping are going to be complicated, but super stretching an existing 0.4mm CoreXY to, say, 300x300x600mm, isn't that complicated in principle.
- wespiser_2018 2y agoThe other issue is the heating element. As the nozzle size gets larger, the rate limiting factor is no longer the motion system and whatever adaptive control, but how fast you can melt the plastic. Most consumer 3d printers can't really take advantage of these large size nozzles, although you could print slowly and it'd still be cool!
- CarVac 2y agoYou want a really long meltzone like a Chube hotend.
- postalrat 2y agoI don't think CoreXY scales up nicely because the belts get so long.
- ThatPlayer 2y agoFor the 'consumer' market, Elegoo's OrangeStorm Giga has 800x800mm 3d printer for less than 3000$ USD. Looks it like comes with a 0.6mm nozzle, but optionally can put a 1mm nozzle on it. From what I remember of youtube reviewers, plenty of problems though, as the first of its kind. Hopefully they get fixed, but not sure you'd want to get it now if you just want to print.
- imtringued 2y ago
- ranger_danger 2y ago> The included power supply will work with 110-240 volts. What about 100V for Japan?
- mdaniel 2y agoI had no idea that was a thing - I guess the great thing about standards: so many to choose from :-( That being said, to the very best of my knowledge (all 30 minutes of surfing around their project site :-D ) they only recommend the Dewalt routers, but I'd bet it would work just fine with whatever local router you could get at your Japanese hardware store that is already set up for 100V
- hatsix 2y agoThe Dewalt recommendation is pretty strong. The router needs to be the right size to be clamped into the machine. There are some people on the forums who have had luck adapting a proper CNC cutting head, but you won't find that down at your local hardware store.
- numpad0 2y agoIt's just a cheap brushed motor, it'll run at 100V just fine...
- buildsjets 2y agoIt’s 2024. You can buy a voltage/phase converter off of aliexpress and convert any random input voltage and phase to any random output voltage and phase for a pretty trivial expense. I’m using a 5kW one to run a 208v 3 phase motor off of 220v one phase in my shop, it cost maybe $100 or so.
- ranger_danger 2y ago> It's 2024 Not sure what you are implying with that. Not everyone is an electronics expert.
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- Animats 2y agoI saw something like this about ten years ago. It was vertical, instead of horizontal. The workpiece was set up on a big slanted easel, and the router unit was supported by only two cables, with gravity pulling it downward. The cable drives were fixed, rather than being on the cutting head, so the cutting head was just a router and a mechanism to push it away from the workpiece. Simple.
- Giorgi 2y agoVery limited practical application.
- cjaackie 2y agoI was skeptical of the safety of building this until I saw it was an off the shelf dewalt with special parts installed. It’s more reassuring that it’s core has been through rigorous testing by a reputable manufacturer.
- Suppafly 2y ago>It’s more reassuring that it’s core has been through rigorous testing by a reputable manufacturer. Basically every CNC uses some sort of off the shelf router or router motor.
- ynoxinul 2y agoClassic CNC routers use massive frame and rails to eliminate play. How is this thing supposed to be precise if it just hangs on four cables?
- emilecantin 2y agoCables are kevlar-reinforced belts and the machine knows how long they are and how much tension in on them so it's relatively easy to compute how much they'd stretch under most conditions. The frame these belts are mounted on still needs to be stiff, though. A concrete floor is a pretty good option.
- davidlang 2y agoThe key feature you are missing is that it is a sled that rides on the workpiece, so the cables are just moving it in one plane, while the spindle goes up and down relative to the sled. So it doesn't need the big, rigid gantry of a traditional machine. but it also is limited in that you can't cut away too much of the surface of your workpiece, you need to leave enough to keep the sled from falling into the cut. It's also a lot slower as it's not as rigid.
- debatem1 2y agoI really wanted to love this, but after setting up an older version and spending untold hours debugging it I just can't make myself believe anymore. I am glad to see them move to four cables though-- two + weights was a nice bit of math but not so great as physics. If you're looking at this, think hard about whether it's possible to cut a router template for what you want to do on a normal sized 2.5D CNC router. It's what I do and is good enough to build a business around.
- johnobrien1010 2y agoWhat business did you build around it?
- debatem1 2y agoCustom forms for concrete pours. Also did a little bit of work making supports for plaster casting. I was never really able to sell the advantages to artists, but got some good side gig money for landscaping stuff. (Just to clarify: the business is wound down, but I personally still use the approach in art projects)
- giarc 2y agoAs someone with access to a big 5x10 CNC and a large laser, I much prefer the laser for making forms (acrylic or wood, then use jig saw plus trim router). CNCs are just a step up in terms of complexity for part time use. You have to consider feeds and speed, chip load etc, whereas a laser is much more forgiving. However, I realize accessibility for each tool isn't always easy.
- KeplerBoy 2y agoI would love to see an opensource handheld cnc router akin to the shaper origin. https://www.shapertools.com/en-us/origin https://www.shapertools.com/en-us/origin
- sjpb 2y agoI loved that idea & tried prototyping one using two "laser" mice instead of the tape/vision approach but the accuracy wasn't anywhere near good enough
- TKnab 2y agoThere is this https://www.compassrouter.com https://www.compassrouter.com Repo here: https://github.com/camchaney/handheld-cnc https://github.com/camchaney/handheld-cnc Not at all associated with the project, just came across it the other day. Look like it uses a single optical mouse sensor and corrects in a single dimension at a time.
- camchaney 2y agoOh hey, that's my device! Thanks for sharing. It actually uses 4 optical mouse sensors so that there is redundancy to minimize error. Very much a work in progress at the moment, but there are lots of stuff I'm hoping to improve in the coming weeks to make it more suitable for useful woodworking projects.
- inm 2y agoHave had the parts for one of these sat in a box for a good few years now, but unfortunately have never managed to make room to build a frame. Discovered the Lowrider 3d printed CNC a couple of months back which better fit the bill for me to be able to store (printing gantry on a shelf, bed suspended from the ceiling!) so hoping soon that'll enable some of the projects I had in mind for the Maslow.
- jollyllama 2y agoA noble goal, but what is the tradeoffs on a home/small biz hacker setting up one of these vs. trying to pick up a comparable used solution? Existing CNCs can run for decades with the right maintenance. It's not my area of expertise but gcode seems pretty standard too.
- jkestner 2y agoI got the Maslow because I didn’t see any other solutions to let me cut a 4 x 8 sheet in a small space for that cost.
- achierius 2y agoDefinitely cost. $525 for the kit, $150 for the D26200, <$100 for the frame: that's less than $1000, while an equivalent COTS CNC would go for over $20k new and probably $5-10k for used-but-in-good-condition. Plus it'd be much more compact. In the course of my former life as a small-"biz" hacker I had to move a one-ton router three or four times, and none of them were pleasant. Moreover, when later COVID hit we 'temporarily' stashed it in storage, and as things dragged on we ended up having to destroy it -- and let me tell you, even with people rotating off on the angle grinder it still took a full weekend to cut the thing apart, while a wood frame like the Maslow uses would take at most half an hour with a sawzall.
- Simon_ORourke 2y agoI'm sure folks like myself living in a city townhouse without the luck of having a woodworking studio "out back" are cursing our lack of facilities for having this kind of fun.
- giarc 2y agoOn the flip side, if you live in a city townhouse, there's likely a makerspace with all this and more. For the cost of that Maslow, I get a year membership to my makerspace that has a full woodshop, metal shop, electronic benches, sewing, 3D printers, large format printers, laser cutters, CNCs etc etc.
- buildsjets 2y agoThis looks like it provides an amazing amount of capability for the price, if it meets your needs. ($525 kit + $125 motor, saved you some clicking). For comparison I have an Avid 48x96 bed type CNC router that I am into for close to $10k. Obviously the more expensive machine has more cutting capability, but I am curious what the actual accuracy of this machine is. I am getting +/- 0.010” or so for large parts, cutting .032” thick aluminum 6061-T3. Probably doing better than that on wood due to lower cutting forces and less machine deflection.
- emilecantin 2y ago$125 motor? What are you talking about? The kit costs $525, and yes you need to supply a trim router (they recommend the Dewalt DWP611 which I paid $269 CAD for, but members of the community have successfully used other ones) which you might already have. You also need to build a frame, or add anchors to your shop floor. This can run you from a few tens of dollars for concrete anchors to $300+ if you want to build something fancier.
- buildsjets 2y agoA Dewalt DWP611 costs me $128.99 USD with free shipping and it can be on my doorstop by 4AM. I’m sorry that you live in a country with an economy is managed such that that the same motor costs you more than double, but you are the outlier in this dataset. Maybe next year when the tariffs kick in, we in the US can be lucky enough to pay 269 USD for something that costs 129 USD currently. https://a.co/d/6LVfRAI https://a.co/d/6LVfRAI
- emilecantin 2y agoOh okay, you call routers "motors"; that's what threw me off. But yeah, price-gouging in Canada is nothing new; even factoring exchange rates it should be ~180 CAD.
- davidlang 2y agoThere are also people using the cheap chinese spindles instead of the Dewalt router. any spindle <67mm diameter at least 4" long can be made to work by putting a sleeve on it.
- penneyd 2y agoFor a full sheet low cost CNC the v4 LowRider is hard to beat https://docs.v1e.com/lowrider/ https://docs.v1e.com/lowrider/
- jes5199 2y agoI still have the original Maslow in the box it came in :-/ I just never had the capacity to get it running, there are steps
- dylan604 2y agoSo essentially, the SpiderCam minus z-axis? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spidercam https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spidercam
- n0id34 2y agoIf you struggle to make a working website, I'm going to pass on the CNC router.