6 ms·

Tesla delays Cybertruck's range extender, reduces its range

58 points by doener 2y ago

column 2y ago
Range extender's range extender when ?
- isoprophlex 2y ago
  The Full Self Extending Range Extender: preorder now! Only $7999!
galkk 2y ago
The range downgrade from initial presentation was the sole reason why I cancelled preorder and ended up with hybrid f150 instead.
- beAbU 2y ago
  I find your comment quite strange to be honest, and it's not comment. There are so many "the-final-straw-that-broke-the-camel's-back-I-cancelled-my-order" comments out there, of folks claiming loudly that they're getting an F150 instead. The F150 and the Cybertruck is so far apart in terms of the type of vehicle they are that I can't really understand how they are used in the same conversation. It makes 0 sense to me to say "I'm going with the F150 instead", because it's not the same class of vehicles. I'm keen to understand what you were hoping to get out the Cybertruck, that you are now instead going to get from a hybrid F150, and why you did not consider the F150 in the first place.
  - vasco 2y ago
    They fit perfectly together in the category "cool truck if you don't need a truck" so it's very easy to see why.
    - valval 2y ago
      I find this elitist attitude towards trucks (well, anything to be honest) quite weird. 1. By definition, you need a truck if you’re decided on getting one. 2. There are no objective criteria you need to pass in order to get one, other than having the finances. 3. You’re projecting your own world view on others.
      - j4yav 2y ago
        It isn’t elitist, it’s an answer to the specific question the scenario where someone could substitute a f150 for a cyber truck.
      - watwut 2y ago
        Normal people buy so many things they do not need so often that I find this comment ridiculous. Yep, people buy cars they dont need, furniture they dont need and random crap they dont need.
      - vasco 2y ago
        In this case it makes sense because if you needed the actual truck capabilities they'd buy a different truck because the Cybertruck wouldn't fit the criteria of others from a category that would fit. The only reason people can change between both models is they didn't need truck features in the first place and it was more of an aesthetic choice, which is fine but that's what I meant by "not needing it".
        bryanlarsen 2y ago
        What truck things can an F150 Lightning do that a Cybertruck can't? I can't think of anything other than goose-neck towing, but that's generally an f250+ thing.
        falcolas 2y ago
        Tow without fear of shattering the frame (OK, without the snark, support more than 160 lbs downward force on the hitch). A full sized bed. Better visibility. Go offroad. Go through a carwash. And in a purely cosmetic take: even panel gaps and a finish that doesn't require hand-cleaning after it rains. EDIT: Fixed 150 to 160 lbs to match manual.
  - grecy 2y ago
    Also the Cybertruck is vastly outselling the electric f150, and there is almost no wait now, unlike the f150 which ford don’t seem to be able to scale production
    - the_mitsuhiko 2y ago
      That might be, but the hybrid F150 is outselling the electric one.
      - grecy 2y ago
        Honestly I didn’t even know there was a hybrid f150. It doesn’t make much sense to compare a hybrid with a “no gas” range of almost nothing [1] and a 1.5kwh battery to a fully electric vehicle [1] https://www.f150gen14.com/forum/threads/powerboosts-poll-how-far-can-you-get-on-just-electric.5034/ https://www.f150gen14.com/forum/threads/powerboosts-poll-how...
        the_mitsuhiko 2y ago
        I would guess most customers do not care much about gas vs electric and just care that their use cases are served.
        grecy 2y ago
        Surely people are buying EVs because of the massive savings on gas....
        falcolas 2y ago
        The massive savings aren't always massive. If you use fast chargers frequently, it's going to cost you. In contrast if you use a slow charger regularly at home, then you'll save money. But that's not really an option for road trips.
        dmoy 2y ago
        I'm explicitly not buying an EV yet because there are no massive savings on gas where I am for the amount I drive. My current car cost like $12k used, and at the time a comparable electric used car would have been like $23k (and would have had like a 80-100 mile range, which I would have been fine with). But we spend like an average of $400/yr on gas and $75/yr on oil changes and extra maintenance above what an EV needs, so we'd be looking at 10++ years of difference to break. Even assuming free electricity and no higher licensing fees (which combined would be more like $200/yr). So actually more like 20++ years to break even there (which is basically not happening). If I lived in an area where gas cost $20/gallon instead of $4/gallon, then it would change the math a little - it would be a net of more like $1300/yr, and I might actually spend less on an EV in the long run (7 years to break even, assuming 0 opportunity cost on the $9k). If I spent $20/gallon on gas and also drove 12k miles / yr instead of 3k miles / yr, then it becomes a much better proposition.
  - the_mitsuhiko 2y ago
    > The F150 and the Cybertruck is so far apart in terms of the type of vehicle they are that I can't really understand how they are used in the same conversation. It makes 0 sense to me to say "I'm going with the F150 instead", because it's not the same class of vehicles. Are they not both trucks? What am I missing in that they are not the same class of vehicle?
    - j4yav 2y ago
      Towing and cargo capacity
    - beAbU 2y ago
      A truck is arguably a work machine for many people. It's a tool designed to be used as such. I dont think the Cybertruck is a tool in that regard, because it clearly fails at the most basic "truck things", if the general internet is to be believed. Now, if aesthetic is the primary factor here, the CB probably trumps the F150, by a huge margin, and one would not even consider something like the F150 as a suitable replacement or equivalent. The GP in my thread decided to replace their designer high heels fashion statement for some boring hiking boots, because the heels did not fare well when walking long distances.
      - red-iron-pine 2y ago
        > Now, if aesthetic is the primary factor here, the CB probably trumps the F150 there is no accounting for taste, and IMO all teslas are ugly as sin it's an ugly, overweight, overpriced meme car hyped by tech bros and internet bots. it can't truck, in any meaningful sense, and can't even handle carwashes. like a 2017 Mazda 3 is more rugged and reliable.
  - galkk 2y ago
    > The F150 and the Cybertruck is so far apart in terms of the type of vehicle they are that I can't really understand how they are used in the same conversation. It makes 0 sense to me I am sorry, but you start with flawed premise and the rest doesn't make sense to me, actually. They both are vehicles with crew cab and bed, that are capable of hauling and towing stuff. They shape or the fuel type are not really relevant to me, like I don't care of the fuel type (diesel/gas) of a semi that I see on the road. Let's compare 2023 F150 powerboost supercrew 6.5 bed with characteristics that I wanted and cybertruck tri motor (announced, https://static.wixstatic.com/media/3d2aca_ce63bacb1ff240228ee5fffc6bac89d0~mv2.png/v1/fill/w_740,h_281,al_c,q_85,usm_0.66_1.00_0.01,enc_auto/3d2aca_ce63bacb1ff240228ee5fffc6bac89d0~mv2.png https://static.wixstatic.com/media/3d2aca_ce63bacb1ff240228e...) 1. payload - f150: 2,120lbs, cybertruck: 3500 lbs 2. range - f150: 450+ cybertruck: 500+ 3. towing - f150: 12,700 cybertruck: 14000 4. bed - I wanted something longer than 6'1", so I can lay down in bed. That ruled out F150 short bed and rivian, but cybertruck was very close Judging by numbers, that indicate real truck usage, cybertruck was close or exceeding F150, that is taken as baseline. If you want to draw some arbitrary classes and say that they are different, it's your right, but actually to me you make 0 sense saying "far apart in terms of the type of vehicle they are that I can't really understand how they are used in the same conversation. " or "not the same class of vehicles". Explain to me where they are different classes, actually. Fuel type to me is an implementation detail. I am getting larger range and longer bed. If Ford had F150 lightning with 450+ range and 6.5 bed, I'd strongly consider it too.
- cameldrv 2y ago
  The range downgrade was a significant disappointment. If you figure towing a trailer cuts the range by about half, the Cybertruck at 500/250 miles would be not great but reasonable for pulling a camper on a trip, but at 300/150 miles, it’s just not practical. The off-road performance also is sub-par, so it’s not good at two of the main things people buy a truck for. As a fashion statement I guess it’s still pretty good if you like the styling.
blackeyeblitzar 2y ago
> Tesla has missed on pricing with new vehicle programs before, and inflation has been exceptionally high in the few years between the original unveiling and pricing of the Cybertruck in 2019 and its start of production last year. > But when it comes to specs, Tesla has generally delivered on its promises. Not with the Cybertruck. Agree. The miss on range with the Cybertruck is too big to ignore. I can understand the price increases due to inflation or whatever. But the enticing thing was getting 500+ miles on the tri motor version, which would have made it unlike anything else - a magical mix of power, utility, and range to put it to use (or just help with range anxiety). The drop from “500+” to 320 is HUGE. I don’t know if this range extender really makes sense either. Will people really pay 16K more to get 120 miles more while losing 1/3rd of their bed space? To me that seems like a bad deal. Why not just get a Model X at that point? As an alternative I would prefer a PHEV truck that provides 50 miles of range so most trips are fully electric, but with a gas engine available for longer trips. The 2025 Ram 1500 Ramcharger will provide that, with an engine that works as a generator (to power electric motors).
- kortilla 2y ago
  The drop from 500 to 320 also meant that towing a decent load dropped from like 180 to 80. It became useless for anything but around town towing. > The 2025 Ram 1500 Ramcharger will provide that, with an engine that works as a generator (to power electric motors). I’ve heard so little about this since the announcement I’m really worried it’s going to be killed or pushed out 4 years with the rest of the industry walking back their EV promises.
  - Maken 2y ago
    Is anyone actually using Cybertrucks for towing heavy loads? I'm under the impression it's mostly a recreational vehicle.
    - masklinn 2y ago
      There are definitely pictures of people who try, one bloke put a towing crane thing in the bed of theirs: https://i.redd.it/32fsd1elmfvd1.jpeg https://i.redd.it/32fsd1elmfvd1.jpeg
kleiba 2y ago
Overpromise and underdeliver. But this strategy still has its merit because it often is important in a competetive market just to be "first" somehow and capture a certain notion in people's mind. Just like Tesla in general now personifies electric cars because it was first (which it wasn't, but it certainly kicked off the mainstream EV market in the West). With the Cybertruck reveal, the point was to present something radical. The design, the numbers! Whether Tesla can actually deliver that by the time the truck comes to the market is almost secondary. Sure, some people are going to be pissed off, but in other people's minds, forever there will be this memory engrained of this amazingly radical thing this amazingly different company, Tesla, did back in 2019. Btw, can you believe it's been 5 years since the Cybertruck was first unvealed?
- verzali 2y ago
  Getting first doesn't mean much if you don't keep up with innovation. Just look at Xerox, Kodak, Nokia, Blackberry... Plenty of companies have had good products but were then outpaced by people who took what they did and made it better, cheaper, whatever.
  - kleiba 2y ago
    Most of the example you cite were not outpaced by the competition in the same market - they missed the boat when their tech space got disrupted by a completely new and different alternative to their product.
- ZeroGravitas 2y ago
  Cybertruck was supposed to be first by taking a radically different approach to building a truck that would let them deliver a lighter (structural exoskeleton) and cheaper (no paint) truck to offset the expensive batteries. In the time it took them to do that, cheaper batteries in a standard truck became feasible.
  - kleiba 2y ago
    True. Btw, does anyone have hands-on experience with such a truck like, say, an F150 lightning?
rickdeckard 2y ago
> Tesla has missed on pricing with new vehicle programs before, > But when it comes to specs, Tesla has generally delivered on its promises. That's an easy cop-out. If in good-faith, it just means that Tesla knows how to build the spec but has no idea what it means to scale it. In bad-faith, it's a calculated unfettered media-hype. I would expect a company which reached the stage of presenting a product to have at least a prototype as well as some grasp on its BOM and how this product could be mass-produced. If the company also announces a price, I expect it to have done its homework before involving the public. Letting this expectation continuously slide to allow yet-another media-spectacle of "Tesla announcing a sub-30.000 <whatever>" is quite a weakness in critical journalism (and thinking).
- ilt 2y ago
  This is mentioned right after, which changes the meaning of the words quoted by you. > Not with the Cybertruck.
  - rickdeckard 2y ago
    It doesn't change the meaning. The fact that Tesla generally delivered on spec but not on price is exactly what I was commenting on. It's not a quality, it's still bad management. Especially if you consider that they may have silently reduced spec in other areas to somehow meet their announced price, i.e. reducing material-quality, mounting components with adhesive, etc. The fact that they didn't deliver on price and spec on the Cybertruck is actually proving the assumption that their product-announcements are not sufficiently grounded in reality.
nathannecro 2y ago
I'll say this, I preordered both a Rivian and a Cybertruck when they announced and I purchased the Rivian because it was available roughly 2 years before the Cybertruck even started deliveries. I've had some small teething problems with the truck but it has been the best vehicle I've ever driven. It works perfectly as a regular daily driver but I can load my SCUBA gear and tanks into the back, and go off-road, get a bunch of dives in, and be back to my truck that I've outfitted with fresh water for a shower, a fridge in the frunk for snacks and drinks, and a gear tunnel with dry and warm clothes. Now that I can charge on the Supercharger network, the truck has just gotten even better since I no longer have to plan out my charging as carefully. The Rivian is built like a tank, it's handled everything I've thrown at it in stride, and the Rivian software folks have been making progress month after month. I'm so glad that I bought a Rivian but really, I'm even more glad that I didn't buy a Cybertruck given the absolutely disastrous launch that its had. Just off the top of my head, I've heard of wheels falling off, trim falling off, tonneau cover nonfunctional and non removable, 20% less range than marketed, accelerator pedal falling off and sticking, PRNDL falling off, seats that creak and wiggle, poor offroading capabilities, red screen of death, FSD driving the truck into the wrong lanes, and I'm sure there are many other issues that I've not even heard about. As a long time Tesla owner (I was an early adopter of the first gen Model S), I expected the overpromise and underdelivery of their products, but I'm pretty sure I'm never going back to Tesla if Rivian and other auto companies deliver better value and quality EVs.
- masklinn 2y ago
  > I'm sure there are many other issues that I've not even heard about. The windshield wiper committing suicide is a common one.
  - nathannecro 2y ago
    Ah yes, I forgot about that. The windshield spontaneously cracking was also something I forgot to mention.
- rickdeckard 2y ago
  > I'm pretty sure I'm never going back to Tesla if Rivian and other auto companies deliver better value and quality EVs Which is a very sober and reasonable statement. If other companies deliver better value and quality, the only reason to buy a Tesla would be brand-loyalty (which is not a good reason to compromise on value/quality)
mejutoco 2y ago
The title here matches the original title of the article, but I have to say: what is with the comma between subject and predicate in a sentence? Ex. Mary, eats a pie.
- piva00 2y ago
  The comma seems completely fine? Your example is not the same construction, "Mary turns off the oven, eats a pie" is a more similar type of phrasal construction.
  - mejutoco 2y ago
    I somehow misread. No more commenting for me before coffee.
- croisillon 2y ago
  "Tesla delays [and] reduces": the comma is used as an "and" (common in American titles, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comma_splice https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comma_splice)
worstspotgain 2y ago
I used to think no production vehicle could ever be uglier than a PT Cruiser.
- j4yav 2y ago
  The PT cruiser looks like a potato, and the Cybertruck looks like a potato slicer. It's a match made in heaven.
- shiroiushi 2y ago
  You're forgetting the Pontiac Aztek. But yeah, this thing ranks right up there with the worst.
  - worstspotgain 2y ago
    I wonder if it's the same people who buy all three. The people who dress up for Halloween 364 days a year.
- odiroot 2y ago
  Fiat Multipla says hi. https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fiat_Multipla https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fiat_Multipla
  - aitchnyu 2y ago
    Cars which didnt upgrade from shinbone fracture profiles to hip fracture profiles have gone extinct and thats bad.
  - Kye 2y ago
    It looks like a little car riding inside a bigger car.
  - rsynnott 2y ago
    Sadly, the second version of this was far more boring, just looking like a fat hatchback. I kind of liked the first-gen.
  - 2y ago
skavi 2y ago
Is anyone else experiencing repeated crashes when viewing this article via iOS Safari?
- deleted 2y ago
  [deleted]
- mlvljr 2y ago
  Would happen with any browser, just stop driving for a minute if you have to read
postmeta 2y ago
Cybertruck steer-by-wire was really fun and interesting to try, some have FSD for test drives too, would really recommend giving it a try before hating so much: https://www.tesla.com/drive https://www.tesla.com/drive
floppiplopp 2y ago
tesla customer have again been musked.

58 points by doener 2y ago

column 2y ago

Range extender's range extender when ?

isoprophlex 2y ago
The Full Self Extending Range Extender: preorder now! Only $7999!

galkk 2y ago

The range downgrade from initial presentation was the sole reason why I cancelled preorder and ended up with hybrid f150 instead.

beAbU 2y ago
I find your comment quite strange to be honest, and it's not comment. There are so many "the-final-straw-that-broke-the-camel's-back-I-cancelled-my-order" comments out there, of folks claiming loudly that they're getting an F150 instead. The F150 and the Cybertruck is so far apart in terms of the type of vehicle they are that I can't really understand how they are used in the same conversation. It makes 0 sense to me to say "I'm going with the F150 instead", because it's not the same class of vehicles. I'm keen to understand what you were hoping to get out the Cybertruck, that you are now instead going to get from a hybrid F150, and why you did not consider the F150 in the first place.
- vasco 2y ago
  They fit perfectly together in the category "cool truck if you don't need a truck" so it's very easy to see why.
  - valval 2y ago
    I find this elitist attitude towards trucks (well, anything to be honest) quite weird. 1. By definition, you need a truck if you’re decided on getting one. 2. There are no objective criteria you need to pass in order to get one, other than having the finances. 3. You’re projecting your own world view on others.
    - j4yav 2y ago
      It isn’t elitist, it’s an answer to the specific question the scenario where someone could substitute a f150 for a cyber truck.
    - watwut 2y ago
      Normal people buy so many things they do not need so often that I find this comment ridiculous. Yep, people buy cars they dont need, furniture they dont need and random crap they dont need.
    - vasco 2y ago
      In this case it makes sense because if you needed the actual truck capabilities they'd buy a different truck because the Cybertruck wouldn't fit the criteria of others from a category that would fit. The only reason people can change between both models is they didn't need truck features in the first place and it was more of an aesthetic choice, which is fine but that's what I meant by "not needing it".
      - bryanlarsen 2y ago
        What truck things can an F150 Lightning do that a Cybertruck can't? I can't think of anything other than goose-neck towing, but that's generally an f250+ thing.
        falcolas 2y ago
        Tow without fear of shattering the frame (OK, without the snark, support more than 160 lbs downward force on the hitch). A full sized bed. Better visibility. Go offroad. Go through a carwash. And in a purely cosmetic take: even panel gaps and a finish that doesn't require hand-cleaning after it rains. EDIT: Fixed 150 to 160 lbs to match manual.
- grecy 2y ago
  Also the Cybertruck is vastly outselling the electric f150, and there is almost no wait now, unlike the f150 which ford don’t seem to be able to scale production
  - the_mitsuhiko 2y ago
    That might be, but the hybrid F150 is outselling the electric one.
    - grecy 2y ago
      Honestly I didn’t even know there was a hybrid f150. It doesn’t make much sense to compare a hybrid with a “no gas” range of almost nothing [1] and a 1.5kwh battery to a fully electric vehicle [1] https://www.f150gen14.com/forum/threads/powerboosts-poll-how-far-can-you-get-on-just-electric.5034/ https://www.f150gen14.com/forum/threads/powerboosts-poll-how...
      - the_mitsuhiko 2y ago
        I would guess most customers do not care much about gas vs electric and just care that their use cases are served.
        grecy 2y ago
        Surely people are buying EVs because of the massive savings on gas....
        falcolas 2y ago
        The massive savings aren't always massive. If you use fast chargers frequently, it's going to cost you. In contrast if you use a slow charger regularly at home, then you'll save money. But that's not really an option for road trips.
        dmoy 2y ago
        I'm explicitly not buying an EV yet because there are no massive savings on gas where I am for the amount I drive. My current car cost like $12k used, and at the time a comparable electric used car would have been like $23k (and would have had like a 80-100 mile range, which I would have been fine with). But we spend like an average of $400/yr on gas and $75/yr on oil changes and extra maintenance above what an EV needs, so we'd be looking at 10++ years of difference to break. Even assuming free electricity and no higher licensing fees (which combined would be more like $200/yr). So actually more like 20++ years to break even there (which is basically not happening). If I lived in an area where gas cost $20/gallon instead of $4/gallon, then it would change the math a little - it would be a net of more like $1300/yr, and I might actually spend less on an EV in the long run (7 years to break even, assuming 0 opportunity cost on the $9k). If I spent $20/gallon on gas and also drove 12k miles / yr instead of 3k miles / yr, then it becomes a much better proposition.
- the_mitsuhiko 2y ago
  > The F150 and the Cybertruck is so far apart in terms of the type of vehicle they are that I can't really understand how they are used in the same conversation. It makes 0 sense to me to say "I'm going with the F150 instead", because it's not the same class of vehicles. Are they not both trucks? What am I missing in that they are not the same class of vehicle?
  - j4yav 2y ago
    Towing and cargo capacity
  - beAbU 2y ago
    A truck is arguably a work machine for many people. It's a tool designed to be used as such. I dont think the Cybertruck is a tool in that regard, because it clearly fails at the most basic "truck things", if the general internet is to be believed. Now, if aesthetic is the primary factor here, the CB probably trumps the F150, by a huge margin, and one would not even consider something like the F150 as a suitable replacement or equivalent. The GP in my thread decided to replace their designer high heels fashion statement for some boring hiking boots, because the heels did not fare well when walking long distances.
    - red-iron-pine 2y ago
      > Now, if aesthetic is the primary factor here, the CB probably trumps the F150 there is no accounting for taste, and IMO all teslas are ugly as sin it's an ugly, overweight, overpriced meme car hyped by tech bros and internet bots. it can't truck, in any meaningful sense, and can't even handle carwashes. like a 2017 Mazda 3 is more rugged and reliable.
- galkk 2y ago
  > The F150 and the Cybertruck is so far apart in terms of the type of vehicle they are that I can't really understand how they are used in the same conversation. It makes 0 sense to me I am sorry, but you start with flawed premise and the rest doesn't make sense to me, actually. They both are vehicles with crew cab and bed, that are capable of hauling and towing stuff. They shape or the fuel type are not really relevant to me, like I don't care of the fuel type (diesel/gas) of a semi that I see on the road. Let's compare 2023 F150 powerboost supercrew 6.5 bed with characteristics that I wanted and cybertruck tri motor (announced, https://static.wixstatic.com/media/3d2aca_ce63bacb1ff240228ee5fffc6bac89d0~mv2.png/v1/fill/w_740,h_281,al_c,q_85,usm_0.66_1.00_0.01,enc_auto/3d2aca_ce63bacb1ff240228ee5fffc6bac89d0~mv2.png https://static.wixstatic.com/media/3d2aca_ce63bacb1ff240228e...) 1. payload - f150: 2,120lbs, cybertruck: 3500 lbs 2. range - f150: 450+ cybertruck: 500+ 3. towing - f150: 12,700 cybertruck: 14000 4. bed - I wanted something longer than 6'1", so I can lay down in bed. That ruled out F150 short bed and rivian, but cybertruck was very close Judging by numbers, that indicate real truck usage, cybertruck was close or exceeding F150, that is taken as baseline. If you want to draw some arbitrary classes and say that they are different, it's your right, but actually to me you make 0 sense saying "far apart in terms of the type of vehicle they are that I can't really understand how they are used in the same conversation. " or "not the same class of vehicles". Explain to me where they are different classes, actually. Fuel type to me is an implementation detail. I am getting larger range and longer bed. If Ford had F150 lightning with 450+ range and 6.5 bed, I'd strongly consider it too.
cameldrv 2y ago
The range downgrade was a significant disappointment. If you figure towing a trailer cuts the range by about half, the Cybertruck at 500/250 miles would be not great but reasonable for pulling a camper on a trip, but at 300/150 miles, it’s just not practical. The off-road performance also is sub-par, so it’s not good at two of the main things people buy a truck for. As a fashion statement I guess it’s still pretty good if you like the styling.

blackeyeblitzar 2y ago

> Tesla has missed on pricing with new vehicle programs before, and inflation has been exceptionally high in the few years between the original unveiling and pricing of the Cybertruck in 2019 and its start of production last year. > But when it comes to specs, Tesla has generally delivered on its promises. Not with the Cybertruck. Agree. The miss on range with the Cybertruck is too big to ignore. I can understand the price increases due to inflation or whatever. But the enticing thing was getting 500+ miles on the tri motor version, which would have made it unlike anything else - a magical mix of power, utility, and range to put it to use (or just help with range anxiety). The drop from “500+” to 320 is HUGE. I don’t know if this range extender really makes sense either. Will people really pay 16K more to get 120 miles more while losing 1/3rd of their bed space? To me that seems like a bad deal. Why not just get a Model X at that point? As an alternative I would prefer a PHEV truck that provides 50 miles of range so most trips are fully electric, but with a gas engine available for longer trips. The 2025 Ram 1500 Ramcharger will provide that, with an engine that works as a generator (to power electric motors).

kortilla 2y ago
The drop from 500 to 320 also meant that towing a decent load dropped from like 180 to 80. It became useless for anything but around town towing. > The 2025 Ram 1500 Ramcharger will provide that, with an engine that works as a generator (to power electric motors). I’ve heard so little about this since the announcement I’m really worried it’s going to be killed or pushed out 4 years with the rest of the industry walking back their EV promises.
- Maken 2y ago
  Is anyone actually using Cybertrucks for towing heavy loads? I'm under the impression it's mostly a recreational vehicle.
  - masklinn 2y ago
    There are definitely pictures of people who try, one bloke put a towing crane thing in the bed of theirs: https://i.redd.it/32fsd1elmfvd1.jpeg https://i.redd.it/32fsd1elmfvd1.jpeg

kleiba 2y ago

Overpromise and underdeliver. But this strategy still has its merit because it often is important in a competetive market just to be "first" somehow and capture a certain notion in people's mind. Just like Tesla in general now personifies electric cars because it was first (which it wasn't, but it certainly kicked off the mainstream EV market in the West). With the Cybertruck reveal, the point was to present something radical. The design, the numbers! Whether Tesla can actually deliver that by the time the truck comes to the market is almost secondary. Sure, some people are going to be pissed off, but in other people's minds, forever there will be this memory engrained of this amazingly radical thing this amazingly different company, Tesla, did back in 2019. Btw, can you believe it's been 5 years since the Cybertruck was first unvealed?

verzali 2y ago
Getting first doesn't mean much if you don't keep up with innovation. Just look at Xerox, Kodak, Nokia, Blackberry... Plenty of companies have had good products but were then outpaced by people who took what they did and made it better, cheaper, whatever.
- kleiba 2y ago
  Most of the example you cite were not outpaced by the competition in the same market - they missed the boat when their tech space got disrupted by a completely new and different alternative to their product.
ZeroGravitas 2y ago
Cybertruck was supposed to be first by taking a radically different approach to building a truck that would let them deliver a lighter (structural exoskeleton) and cheaper (no paint) truck to offset the expensive batteries. In the time it took them to do that, cheaper batteries in a standard truck became feasible.
- kleiba 2y ago
  True. Btw, does anyone have hands-on experience with such a truck like, say, an F150 lightning?

rickdeckard 2y ago

> Tesla has missed on pricing with new vehicle programs before, > But when it comes to specs, Tesla has generally delivered on its promises. That's an easy cop-out. If in good-faith, it just means that Tesla knows how to build the spec but has no idea what it means to scale it. In bad-faith, it's a calculated unfettered media-hype. I would expect a company which reached the stage of presenting a product to have at least a prototype as well as some grasp on its BOM and how this product could be mass-produced. If the company also announces a price, I expect it to have done its homework before involving the public. Letting this expectation continuously slide to allow yet-another media-spectacle of "Tesla announcing a sub-30.000 <whatever>" is quite a weakness in critical journalism (and thinking).

ilt 2y ago
This is mentioned right after, which changes the meaning of the words quoted by you. > Not with the Cybertruck.
- rickdeckard 2y ago
  It doesn't change the meaning. The fact that Tesla generally delivered on spec but not on price is exactly what I was commenting on. It's not a quality, it's still bad management. Especially if you consider that they may have silently reduced spec in other areas to somehow meet their announced price, i.e. reducing material-quality, mounting components with adhesive, etc. The fact that they didn't deliver on price and spec on the Cybertruck is actually proving the assumption that their product-announcements are not sufficiently grounded in reality.

nathannecro 2y ago

I'll say this, I preordered both a Rivian and a Cybertruck when they announced and I purchased the Rivian because it was available roughly 2 years before the Cybertruck even started deliveries. I've had some small teething problems with the truck but it has been the best vehicle I've ever driven. It works perfectly as a regular daily driver but I can load my SCUBA gear and tanks into the back, and go off-road, get a bunch of dives in, and be back to my truck that I've outfitted with fresh water for a shower, a fridge in the frunk for snacks and drinks, and a gear tunnel with dry and warm clothes. Now that I can charge on the Supercharger network, the truck has just gotten even better since I no longer have to plan out my charging as carefully. The Rivian is built like a tank, it's handled everything I've thrown at it in stride, and the Rivian software folks have been making progress month after month. I'm so glad that I bought a Rivian but really, I'm even more glad that I didn't buy a Cybertruck given the absolutely disastrous launch that its had. Just off the top of my head, I've heard of wheels falling off, trim falling off, tonneau cover nonfunctional and non removable, 20% less range than marketed, accelerator pedal falling off and sticking, PRNDL falling off, seats that creak and wiggle, poor offroading capabilities, red screen of death, FSD driving the truck into the wrong lanes, and I'm sure there are many other issues that I've not even heard about. As a long time Tesla owner (I was an early adopter of the first gen Model S), I expected the overpromise and underdelivery of their products, but I'm pretty sure I'm never going back to Tesla if Rivian and other auto companies deliver better value and quality EVs.

masklinn 2y ago
> I'm sure there are many other issues that I've not even heard about. The windshield wiper committing suicide is a common one.
- nathannecro 2y ago
  Ah yes, I forgot about that. The windshield spontaneously cracking was also something I forgot to mention.
rickdeckard 2y ago
> I'm pretty sure I'm never going back to Tesla if Rivian and other auto companies deliver better value and quality EVs Which is a very sober and reasonable statement. If other companies deliver better value and quality, the only reason to buy a Tesla would be brand-loyalty (which is not a good reason to compromise on value/quality)

mejutoco 2y ago

The title here matches the original title of the article, but I have to say: what is with the comma between subject and predicate in a sentence? Ex. Mary, eats a pie.

piva00 2y ago
The comma seems completely fine? Your example is not the same construction, "Mary turns off the oven, eats a pie" is a more similar type of phrasal construction.
- mejutoco 2y ago
  I somehow misread. No more commenting for me before coffee.
croisillon 2y ago
"Tesla delays [and] reduces": the comma is used as an "and" (common in American titles, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comma_splice https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comma_splice)

worstspotgain 2y ago

I used to think no production vehicle could ever be uglier than a PT Cruiser.

j4yav 2y ago
The PT cruiser looks like a potato, and the Cybertruck looks like a potato slicer. It's a match made in heaven.
shiroiushi 2y ago
You're forgetting the Pontiac Aztek. But yeah, this thing ranks right up there with the worst.
- worstspotgain 2y ago
  I wonder if it's the same people who buy all three. The people who dress up for Halloween 364 days a year.
odiroot 2y ago
Fiat Multipla says hi. https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fiat_Multipla https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fiat_Multipla
- aitchnyu 2y ago
  Cars which didnt upgrade from shinbone fracture profiles to hip fracture profiles have gone extinct and thats bad.
- Kye 2y ago
  It looks like a little car riding inside a bigger car.
- rsynnott 2y ago
  Sadly, the second version of this was far more boring, just looking like a fat hatchback. I kind of liked the first-gen.
- 2y ago

skavi 2y ago

Is anyone else experiencing repeated crashes when viewing this article via iOS Safari?

deleted 2y ago
[deleted]
mlvljr 2y ago
Would happen with any browser, just stop driving for a minute if you have to read

postmeta 2y ago

Cybertruck steer-by-wire was really fun and interesting to try, some have FSD for test drives too, would really recommend giving it a try before hating so much: https://www.tesla.com/drive https://www.tesla.com/drive

floppiplopp 2y ago

tesla customer have again been musked.