6 ms·

What is a realistic path to this? Being from Europe I visited US last year and was horrified at the quality of your food. You see a lot of documentaries/youtube

What is a realistic path to this? Being from Europe I visited US last year and was horrified at the quality of your food. You see a lot of documentaries/youtube videos/etc... discussing the problem, but how do you even go about this?

supportengineer 2y ago
There's plenty of high quality food, you just have to know where to look. For example, come to the Bay Area and check out Whole Foods and any number of high-end restaurants.
- hyggetrold 2y ago
  +1 to this - what Europeans consider "the basics" for most Americans is filed under "luxury" or "bougie."
  - cultofmetatron 2y ago
    was in greece for three months. the quality of the BASIC fruits and vegetables at the regular local market down the street from where I was staying was on par with wholefoods. It was surreal how cheap it was to eat HEALTHY.
    - fooker 2y ago
      Have you been to Mexican grocery stores in the US?
      - throwup238 2y ago
        Almost any ethnic grocery store will do since they cater to immigrant communities that are likely to be lower income. Here in SoCal some are cheaper than others but they're all way cheaper than Ralphs/Vons/Trader Joes/Costco/etc (I don't shop at WalMart so I'm not sure how they compare) There are also native stores that are increasingly entering into low cost produce like Grocery Outlet and then there are the usual like Food4Less but they tend to eventually move upmarket.
  - fooker 2y ago
    I wonder why, then, Europeans move to the US in such large numbers for academic and tech jobs.
    - torlok 2y ago
      They don't move because the food's better. How is your comment relevant to the discussion?
      - fooker 2y ago
        The food is better though, as long as you are willing to try food you are not familiar with.
    - cruffle_duffle 2y ago
      It’s cool to hate on America. Everything is always better in Europe.
- philipkglass 2y ago
  That's overkill. There are very marginal health benefits to eating organic watercress vs. eating whatever dark leafy green is currently on sale at the discount supermarket. The problem isn't that people go to supermarkets and they can't find any healthful ingredients to cook with. The problem is that they go to supermarkets and pass those over in favor of convenience foods that have been optimized for "craveability" [1]. GLP-1 drugs can alter this behavior by reducing food cravings. Someone who's no longer craving the most craveable food can make more objective by-the-numbers buying decisions the next time they go grocery shopping. [1] https://www.npr.org/sections/thesalt/2015/12/16/459981099/how-the-food-industry-helps-engineer-our-cravings https://www.npr.org/sections/thesalt/2015/12/16/459981099/ho...
- codersfocus 2y ago
  Imagine thinking Whole Foods is high quality. The only way you're going to get high quality food in the US is if you live where the Amish are.
diggan 2y ago
> but how do you even go about this? Maybe I'm too European to understand why not, but seems to me that regulations around food and what companies are allowed to put into it is really helpful in avoiding companies from just stuffing whatever down people's throat.
klaussilveira 2y ago
The US is a huge country (9,833,520 square kilometers!), so I find it curious that such generalization can be made about the food available here, or even the eating habits of 334,914,895 humans. I could say that I visited Amsterdam 2 years ago and I was shocked with the quality of the food. But I would never do that, since I mostly ate at the Red Light District, and I couldn't possibly generalize the country eating habits with stores in a major tourist area.
gcr 2y ago
We have good food, but you won't find it on "The Easy Path." The Easy Path is that gentle encouragement to hit up Chipotle for lunch, because it's "right there." The Easy Path says dinner's hard and you've had a long day, so get something simple, like take-out or microwave. The Easy Path is entropy. The Easy Path is self-care over struggle. The Easy Path is simple carbs shown on prominent display in store shelves. The Easy Path is advertising. Hitting the gym isn't on The Easy Path, but forgetting to cancel your gym membership is. These days, big food companies love "The Easy Path" because it's so easy to commoditize, it's the "Path that Americans are Expected to Take." For financial stewards, being on The Easy Path turns lack of willpower into your ally. On the other hand, getting good food in the US requires passing the marshmallow test: you have to meal prep, or you have to shop around the sides, or you have to get something on the salad menu. You have to say no to advertising. You have to expend willpower, the most limited of resources to the average American. You have to Go Hungry or Suffer, or have An Upset Stomach. You frequently have to spend more money or time. Semaglutides are not currently on The Easy Path. Maybe they will be someday. I personally doubt that, because putting GLP-1 on The Easy Path would require big food companies to rethink their entire portfolio. But you're not wrong in that they could be Easy Path-ajdacent. The dialectic would shift: food companies would shift around to be Organic and Nutritious and Less Calories and find other ways to stay on The Easy Path. Sugar and fat's addictiveness is highly Easy Path-enabling, and that's a pretty big vacuum to fill.
- crooked-v 2y ago
  > I personally doubt that, because putting GLP-1 on The Easy Path would require big food companies to rethink their entire portfolio. I think the drug industry is more powerful than the food industry, these days.
  - gcr 2y ago
    This duel of incentives will be a fascinating battle to watch in the coming years.
  - Scoundreller 2y ago
    Are they? People spend more on food than pharmaceuticals globally, but I do believe they’re converging.
ActorNightly 2y ago
The first thing that would help is actually having a realistic discourse about food, and not the idiotic - "You shouldn't be eating processed food, its not good for you". Like most of the food that we eat is not really that bad. Its not optimal for sure, especially for sedentary lifestyles, but a lot of the health problems are not directly tied into the actual food, rather the over-consumption of it, and passing down of bad genetics (for example, children of obese people are more likely to be obese). European obesity tripled in the last 40 years as well, despite higher quality of food.
- aezart 2y ago
  > (for example, children of obese people are more likely to be obese) I would assume that this is related to gut biome and not genetic makeup.
rootusrootus 2y ago
> Being from Europe Why is the quality of food in Europe so much worse than southeast Asia? Because you guys are way, way, way fatter than e.g. the Japanese. Back on topic -- we have excellent food in the US, but regulations allow for highly processed crap to be sold too. Pretty sure most of the crappy processed foods are easily available in Europe, too.
- r3d0c 2y ago
  lack of regulations* allow, and no not exactly; eu and canada have stringent laws on advertising to children, and laws on nutrition and additives to their products even things like bread in the US have an insane amount of sugar but the other reason is suburban/car culture & zoning, which means more hypermarkets and shopping not every few days for fresh food but every week or two for more processed food that lasts longer because going to the store is a bigger PITA than a quick 5 min walk to the neighborhood stores; which also means mroe walking rather than driving, another area of calorie burning and lean muscle maintenance which maintains high metab

supportengineer 2y ago

There's plenty of high quality food, you just have to know where to look. For example, come to the Bay Area and check out Whole Foods and any number of high-end restaurants.

hyggetrold 2y ago
+1 to this - what Europeans consider "the basics" for most Americans is filed under "luxury" or "bougie."
- cultofmetatron 2y ago
  was in greece for three months. the quality of the BASIC fruits and vegetables at the regular local market down the street from where I was staying was on par with wholefoods. It was surreal how cheap it was to eat HEALTHY.
  - fooker 2y ago
    Have you been to Mexican grocery stores in the US?
    - throwup238 2y ago
      Almost any ethnic grocery store will do since they cater to immigrant communities that are likely to be lower income. Here in SoCal some are cheaper than others but they're all way cheaper than Ralphs/Vons/Trader Joes/Costco/etc (I don't shop at WalMart so I'm not sure how they compare) There are also native stores that are increasingly entering into low cost produce like Grocery Outlet and then there are the usual like Food4Less but they tend to eventually move upmarket.
- fooker 2y ago
  I wonder why, then, Europeans move to the US in such large numbers for academic and tech jobs.
  - torlok 2y ago
    They don't move because the food's better. How is your comment relevant to the discussion?
    - fooker 2y ago
      The food is better though, as long as you are willing to try food you are not familiar with.
  - cruffle_duffle 2y ago
    It’s cool to hate on America. Everything is always better in Europe.
philipkglass 2y ago
That's overkill. There are very marginal health benefits to eating organic watercress vs. eating whatever dark leafy green is currently on sale at the discount supermarket. The problem isn't that people go to supermarkets and they can't find any healthful ingredients to cook with. The problem is that they go to supermarkets and pass those over in favor of convenience foods that have been optimized for "craveability" [1]. GLP-1 drugs can alter this behavior by reducing food cravings. Someone who's no longer craving the most craveable food can make more objective by-the-numbers buying decisions the next time they go grocery shopping. [1] https://www.npr.org/sections/thesalt/2015/12/16/459981099/how-the-food-industry-helps-engineer-our-cravings https://www.npr.org/sections/thesalt/2015/12/16/459981099/ho...
codersfocus 2y ago
Imagine thinking Whole Foods is high quality. The only way you're going to get high quality food in the US is if you live where the Amish are.

diggan 2y ago

> but how do you even go about this? Maybe I'm too European to understand why not, but seems to me that regulations around food and what companies are allowed to put into it is really helpful in avoiding companies from just stuffing whatever down people's throat.

klaussilveira 2y ago

The US is a huge country (9,833,520 square kilometers!), so I find it curious that such generalization can be made about the food available here, or even the eating habits of 334,914,895 humans. I could say that I visited Amsterdam 2 years ago and I was shocked with the quality of the food. But I would never do that, since I mostly ate at the Red Light District, and I couldn't possibly generalize the country eating habits with stores in a major tourist area.

gcr 2y ago

We have good food, but you won't find it on "The Easy Path." The Easy Path is that gentle encouragement to hit up Chipotle for lunch, because it's "right there." The Easy Path says dinner's hard and you've had a long day, so get something simple, like take-out or microwave. The Easy Path is entropy. The Easy Path is self-care over struggle. The Easy Path is simple carbs shown on prominent display in store shelves. The Easy Path is advertising. Hitting the gym isn't on The Easy Path, but forgetting to cancel your gym membership is. These days, big food companies love "The Easy Path" because it's so easy to commoditize, it's the "Path that Americans are Expected to Take." For financial stewards, being on The Easy Path turns lack of willpower into your ally. On the other hand, getting good food in the US requires passing the marshmallow test: you have to meal prep, or you have to shop around the sides, or you have to get something on the salad menu. You have to say no to advertising. You have to expend willpower, the most limited of resources to the average American. You have to Go Hungry or Suffer, or have An Upset Stomach. You frequently have to spend more money or time. Semaglutides are not currently on The Easy Path. Maybe they will be someday. I personally doubt that, because putting GLP-1 on The Easy Path would require big food companies to rethink their entire portfolio. But you're not wrong in that they could be Easy Path-ajdacent. The dialectic would shift: food companies would shift around to be Organic and Nutritious and Less Calories and find other ways to stay on The Easy Path. Sugar and fat's addictiveness is highly Easy Path-enabling, and that's a pretty big vacuum to fill.

crooked-v 2y ago
> I personally doubt that, because putting GLP-1 on The Easy Path would require big food companies to rethink their entire portfolio. I think the drug industry is more powerful than the food industry, these days.
- gcr 2y ago
  This duel of incentives will be a fascinating battle to watch in the coming years.
- Scoundreller 2y ago
  Are they? People spend more on food than pharmaceuticals globally, but I do believe they’re converging.

ActorNightly 2y ago

The first thing that would help is actually having a realistic discourse about food, and not the idiotic - "You shouldn't be eating processed food, its not good for you". Like most of the food that we eat is not really that bad. Its not optimal for sure, especially for sedentary lifestyles, but a lot of the health problems are not directly tied into the actual food, rather the over-consumption of it, and passing down of bad genetics (for example, children of obese people are more likely to be obese). European obesity tripled in the last 40 years as well, despite higher quality of food.

aezart 2y ago
> (for example, children of obese people are more likely to be obese) I would assume that this is related to gut biome and not genetic makeup.

rootusrootus 2y ago

> Being from Europe Why is the quality of food in Europe so much worse than southeast Asia? Because you guys are way, way, way fatter than e.g. the Japanese. Back on topic -- we have excellent food in the US, but regulations allow for highly processed crap to be sold too. Pretty sure most of the crappy processed foods are easily available in Europe, too.

r3d0c 2y ago
lack of regulations* allow, and no not exactly; eu and canada have stringent laws on advertising to children, and laws on nutrition and additives to their products even things like bread in the US have an insane amount of sugar but the other reason is suburban/car culture & zoning, which means more hypermarkets and shopping not every few days for fresh food but every week or two for more processed food that lasts longer because going to the store is a bigger PITA than a quick 5 min walk to the neighborhood stores; which also means mroe walking rather than driving, another area of calorie burning and lean muscle maintenance which maintains high metab