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Microsoft confirms that Windows 11 Recall AI is not optional
- MisterBastahrd 2y agoSo... we about 5 years out from a Linux desktop, right?
- scblock 2y agoIt's today. I encourage you to actually try it rather than repeat an old trope.
- MisterBastahrd 2y agoNo, it really isn't, and I've been working with Linux on desktops since I installed slackware from floppy disks from the back of a giant book after having used Sparcstations. Every single implementation is terrible and breaks in weird ways.
- leesalminen 2y agon=1 but my mother-in-law has been rocking Mint since late 2019. It does everything she needs and hasn't had a single question about it since 2020. I apply updates when I visit her house every few months. Don't recall any issues with that, either.
- cortesoft 2y agoNot everyone has a son-in-law tech admin.
- skydhash 2y agoEven Apple and Microsoft have to deploy an army of customer support agents to deal with problems, but you expect Linux to be trouble free? I don't expect anyone capable of installing windows to have trouble with Mint, Elementary, or Fedora.
- deleted 2y ago[deleted]
- choeger 2y agoI'm running Linux for decades now without problems. Gaming was Windows' last bastion, but SteamOS is looking more and more attractive. So maybe I can get rid of that crapware personally.
- ziddoap 2y ago>Gaming was Windows' last bastion Not by a long shot. Windows-only enterprise software (QuickBooks, SolidWorks, etc.) is the last bastion, and that bastion is going to hold for a long time.
- talldayo 2y agoThe customers of that particular bastion have LTSC, and enough capital to twist Microsoft's arm into including or excluding whatever features they prefer.
- ziddoap 2y agoThis overlooks every small and medium sized business that is locked-in to Windows some way or another. Unless they all band together, their capital is not enough to sway Microsoft at all.
- fxtentacle 2y agoQuickBooks is now mostly a website, we ditched the client-side app a few years ago. But yeah, SolidWorks is notoriously flaky. It doesn't even work OK in a Windows VM. Or on any modern Laptop with discrete GPU.
- ziddoap 2y ago>QuickBooks is now mostly a website, we ditched the client-side app a few years ago. QuickBooks Online is missing so many features of QuickBooks Enterprise that they probably shouldn't even share the same name. Many places I've consulted for are locked-in to Enterprise. They also conveniently void your support if you use a VM, despite VMs working fine.
- EnergyAmy 2y agoEverything is terrible and breaks in weird ways, including Windows. It has so many weird bugs and broken behavior that people just kind of ignore because it's "default".
- inetknght 2y agoI've been working with Linux on desktops, laptops, and servers for a decade. Use Mint or Fedora for distribution. Use Cinnamon or KDE for GUI. Everything pretty much just works, man. Games work -- Steam, Battle.net, Lutris, and others I am sure. Sleep works -- just as well as it does on Windows anyway. Network works -- better and easier than Windows IMO. Updates work and waaaaay better than Windows. Backups work. LibreOffice works. Browsers work. Tools work. USB thumb drives work. External USB enclosures work. CD/DVD drives work. I haven't tried blu-ray but I imagine that works too. The only things that don't work are the things that lock you in to Microsoft. Those are vanishingly small numbers of things outside of business, and in business it's mostly because of inertia.
- skydhash 2y agoI'm running Sway on Fedora Asahi Remix and I've experienced fewer crashes than in macOS (and the few crashes was software I've installed, the system is rock solid). And these days, I trust Fedora and Debian's maintainers more than Big Corps. If you're only using a few apps and don't really care what the system does as long as you do your $job, macOS and windows are good. But any custom workflows and you're in a lot of pain.
- piafraus 2y ago> Games work This is not a boolean. Games work, just with way less framerates.
- tristor 2y agoNot necessarily. I sometimes get higher framerates on Linux via Proton than I get on Windows for the same games and same system.
- darkwater 2y agoI did the same (installing Slack from floppies in 1996...and failing) and I've been running Linux as my main and only desktop first and laptop then operating system for... 23 years now. Windows Millennium was the last straw for me. My family is Ubuntu-only since 10 years ago, and I have 2 daughters that only know Unity as the graphical UI for a desktop PC (well, the big one is unfortunately starting to see Windows at school).
- scblock 2y agoSure, you're clearly the expert. If we're measuring experience based on the age of ancient software then I guess you win because I only started with RedHat 5.1 from a CD. But in 2024 you clearly are still the true expert and arbiter of what constitutes a working desktop OS. I mean I only use Linux on a desktop and a laptop every single day, so I probably don't really get it. But truly, Linux gives me significantly less "broken in weird ways" issues, as you say, in daily use than Windows 10 does on the same hardware. Both sometimes do stupid things, and both sometimes require stupid incantations when things go wrong (please don't pretend windows doesn't, because it absolutely does).
- twh270 2y agoEvery complex piece of software "breaks in weird ways", that doesn't make it terrible. It will also break if you're trying to do 'weird' things it's not really designed for.
- marcosdumay 2y agoThe current stochastic curve reaches it's maximum rate of change in some 15 years. At 25% of the computers. Linux has been following it very well.
- CalRobert 2y agoI love boring old ubuntu desktop
- simonw 2y ago“Can’t be uninstalled” and “not optional” aren’t the same thing. This headline implies users won’t be able to prevent recall from taking screenshots of what they are doing. I don’t believe that’s true.
- ziddoap 2y ago>I don’t believe that’s true. Indeed, from the article: >Once shipped, Recall will also be something Windows users can disable but not entirely remove.
- elaus 2y agoSadly Microsoft has a history of enabling "features" after updates, even though the user has disabled it before. Of course only to "improve the experience".
- simonw 2y agoThat’s why I called out the headline - it’s a truth universally acknowledged (or should be) that most people won’t read beyond the headline.
- ziddoap 2y ago>it’s a truth universally acknowledged (or should be) that most people won’t read beyond the headline. Sure. That's why I put the relevant part in my comment for the people that skip the article.
- jsheard 2y agoAFAICT it's only going to work on Copilot+ branded systems anyway, and currently only the Snapdragon ARM machines have a beefy enough NPU to meet that criteria. Both Intel and AMD are working towards getting that certification with their upcoming CPUs though.
- dagmx 2y agoAs of yesterday, the latest chips from AMD (stryx point) and Intel (lunar lake) are considered Copilot+ ready
- add-sub-mul-div 2y agoWeird outrage bait over a feature that doesn't have to be used and is off by default. I don't know why people are losing their minds over this other than some pavlovian Microsoft response.
- dgan 2y agoPavlovian response implies a repeated trigger, looks like you answered your own question
- flohofwoe 2y agoApparently it's only disabled by default because of "security concerns". That sounds a lot like after those "concerns" are fixed (or rather "no longer in the news"), it will be enabled by default.
- nehal3m 2y agoThe same was true for signing in to Windows with a Microsoft account. Like my sibling said, this happened before.
- flohofwoe 2y agoSo even when the feature can be disabled (but not uninstalled), Microsoft will at least make sure that "no means no" and not silently enable the feature again after an OS update right? Right?! I guess/hope the EU is already on it though.
- talldayo 2y agoIt's important that Recall is available to all Microsoft Windows users. The Microsoft ecosystem is a great value to its customers, and the obstruction of Microsoft's right to advertise to their users would be another example of how the EU hates their citizens. If you don't want Copilot, why can't you just buy another computer and let Microsoft customers enjoy their vertical integration? /s Edit: Included sarcasm indicator because apparently people think this is a legitimate opinion serious people have in 2024.
- flohofwoe 2y agoAre you the Recall PM? ;) Windows is good for one thing these days: Playing games via Steam. That's about it, and Linux is getting pretty good at that too - but not yet perfect. That's why I have to stick to Windows for my gaming PC for the time being. > If you don't want Copilot, why can't you just buy another computer and let Microsoft customers enjoy their vertical integration? Why doesn't Microsoft simply let me uninstall it? That would be the consumer friendly thing to do.
- fidotron 2y agoMicrosoft are conducting a massive experiment to find just how badly you can treat locked in consumers before they switch. They are plumbing the depths so well it is legitimately hard to imagine what new madness they could come up with next.
- choeger 2y agoI think that's pretty obvious, no? Behavioral controls. You add a web cam screenshot to that desktop screenshot and sell real attention signals to advertisers.
- fidotron 2y agoThey already tried that with the XBox One Kinect. That one did backfire quite hard.
- Diederich 2y agoWhy do something annoying once when you can do it twice for twice the outrage?
- RobotToaster 2y agoThat was then, this is now. Everyone abandoned Digg because of a level of censorship that modern reddit makes look benign.
- vkou 2y agoIf censorship is the problem, why hasn't reddit been abandoned for no-censorship alternatives? Are things not all sunshine and roses and a million flowers blooming in them?
- Narishma 2y agoJust because it failed in the past doesn't mean they won't retry again and again. It only needs to succeed once.
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- tamiral 2y agoi hate this so much, i hope the ability to disable/delete this will come soon.
- crowcroft 2y agoAt this point the problem isn’t really the feature and if it’s optional or not, the problem is the comms and roll out are such a dumpster fire that it’s confusing everyone.
- delegate 2y agoGenuine question: I've been hearing good things about PopOS. How realistic is it as a windows replacement ?
- fxtentacle 2y agoI'm using it as a daily driver now: https://hajo.me/blog/2024/07/02/the-year-of-the-linux-desktop-in-retrospect/ https://hajo.me/blog/2024/07/02/the-year-of-the-linux-deskto... Biggest issue is printer drivers, I'd say.
- mattl 2y agoAnd that's not a PopOS issue, that's an issue with CUPS... it seems CUPS was forked by the original developer after his time with Apple. https://openprinting.github.io/cups/ https://openprinting.github.io/cups/
- deleted 2y ago[deleted]
- srik 2y agoA couple years ago I wanted to try something simple for a daily driver and gave it a shot but it didn’t take long before its inadequacies became unbearable and I switched back; but they’ve been improving, so hopefully it’s much better now.
- robrtsql 2y agoIs the question about Linux in general or about Pop_OS specifically? I've used it--the differences are going to increase once their new desktop environment releases, but right now it's comparable to Ubuntu except with some nice-to-haves (proprietary NVIDIA drivers are installed automatically, no software is delivered via Canonical's 'snaps' which are almost universally hated). I enjoyed it, but in my opinion, popular distros are more similar than they are different. If you mean just replacing Windows with Linux in general: it's great, unless you need to run, say, Adobe Photoshop, Microsoft Excel, or Fortnite.
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- zoobab 2y agoGDPR lawsuit no one?
- progval 2y agoWhat part of GDPR does it infringe?
- CatWChainsaw 2y agoThe P part. It's taking screenshots of your screen every few seconds. When enabled, yes, but it makes you wonder why Microsoft is making it so you can only disable it, but not uninstall it. If you wanted to be sure it was disabled, you'd uninstall it... but you can't. I'm sure Microsoft would never enable it by default after an update.
- progval 2y agoI meant what article(s)/paragraph(s) of GDPR. GDPR is a specific law, not a general principle. You can read it here: https://eur-lex.europa.eu/eli/reg/2016/679/oj#d1e1374-1-1 https://eur-lex.europa.eu/eli/reg/2016/679/oj#d1e1374-1-1
- import_awesome 2y agoMost of your steam games will run on linux with proton.
- exabrial 2y agoI intend to fully support System76: https://system76.com/cosmic https://system76.com/cosmic and their new Cosmic Desktop environment! Their laptop offerings look amazing. I hope they have some ARM options available in the future!
- electricdreams 2y ago[dead]
- mythz 2y agoWhich we have to thank for Linux Desktop market share hitting all time highs this year. My decision to switch to a Fedora Desktop earlier this year after 25 years of Windows gets reinforced with every new "Windows Feature". It's been a refreshing change, native versions of JetBrains IDEs, Docker and most Daily Apps (e.g. VS Code, Discord, GitHub Desktop, Obsidian, etc) were available on Day 1, surprisingly all my flagship Windows Steam Games I tried also just worked, there's also a lot more developer tools and command line enhancements available for Linux without the weird uncanny valley context switching I used to live with when using WSL. Linux Desktop is in great shape if you're thinking of switching away from Windows.
- vee2xx 2y agoI switched to Ubuntu a few years ago and have 0 regrets. I have run into rare cases where something I am working on and need to test can only run on Windows but that's what VMs are for.
- spacemadness 2y agoI wish gaming was better. That’s the only reason I’m still on Windows for my gaming PC. I know it’s vastly improved (Proton, etc) but I’d still have to ditch quite a few games in my library.
- deleted 2y ago[deleted]
- CalRobert 2y agoAgreed! Maybe we can push chrome down too… Where are you getting Linux desktop share data?
- mythz 2y agoJust off StatsCounter [1] where its reached ~4.55% in August, its growth has been getting highlighted a few times in my YouTube video stream [1] https://gs.statcounter.com/os-market-share/desktop/worldwide/ https://gs.statcounter.com/os-market-share/desktop/worldwide...
- exabrial 2y ago[flagged]
- soapdog 2y agoprobably most people in the world using a computer for work or school...
- nuforia 2y agoTerminally HN brained
- vkou 2y agoIt's way too crowded these days, nobody comes here anymore. Serious answer: Almost everyone who owns a PC or laptop. Almost everyone who does work on a computer.
- enlyth 2y agoAbout 70% of the world's people using computers, or anyone that wants to play PC games, so yeah, literally no one
- onemoresoop 2y agoI do use it for work. Hate it but my employer loves it.
- mysterydip 2y agoAnd they'll love it more, once Analytics for Recall gets deployed to their middle managers
- ddingus 2y agoI will not use Windows 11 with that feature present. Regular screen captures are a completely unacceptable intrusion.
- deleted 2y ago[deleted]
- crmd 2y ago[flagged]
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- BikeShuester 2y agoThe unfortunate current state of the OS market: If you want a system that generally works without much hassle, Windows is the go-to choice, albeit with increasingly intrusive policies. For those who prefer customization, Linux offers a wealth of options, but be warned: if you lack a developer's background, your custom setups might break after an update. On the other hand, if you're looking for a rock-solid OS with minimal customization, macOS is your best bet, though you'll pay a premium and be locked into specific hardware. Personally, I wish Linux could take the lead in this battle, but it really needs to consolidate its resources to make a stronger impact.
- ChrisArchitect 2y ago[dupe] Discussion: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=41430757 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=41430757
- multimoon 2y agoI never understand Microsoft’s strategy with being absolutely full bore focused on locking in 100% of everyone to this crap, consistently. It has to be cheaper to let the .03% of people who want to do their own thing just do their own thing than it does spend engineering work to try to constantly capture them. The average user already doesn’t know what “an ai” is and doesn’t care, and therefore will never change your defaults. I can’t tell you how many times I’ve had to re-disable copilot because MS has invalidated my registry and/or group policy changes to get rid of it If I don’t want the feature even installed on my system, then let me make that choice. Gaming is the only thing holding a windows install in my house anymore and the second DRM in proton is figured out I’m gone.
- benterix 2y agoHardware is so cheap these days you can just have a separate machine for Windows-only tasks like gaming in your case (in my case it's macOS for music production) - and enjoy the freedom for all other tasks.
- multimoon 2y agoThis is my current setup yes, the only thing windows is on is a gaming PC for gaming only.
- SirMaster 2y agoGuess I will stick with Windows 10 IoT Enterprise LTSC 2021 which is supported until 2032, and just home some better option is available by then.
- davidy123 2y agoI don't understand how they can roll out this feature across all regions. Call recording laws are different in many jurisdictions, and this is like a superset of call recording. I think it's a useful feature for a person, but to collect info on other people (in calls, emails, etc that appear on screen) and be able to process it is like an evil superpower.
- theanonymousone 2y agoIf regularly taking a screenshot is acceptable, then what prevents Windows 12 (or whatever), to capture a live feed of the webcam?
- hagbard_c 2y agoIt is a good thing that Windows 11 is optional. Microsoft seems to insist on making it an option which is relegated way back into the catalogue in the section where hardly anyone looks but that is their prerogative just like it is mine to avoid them and their products. The times of Windows dominance are over, mostly due to the rise of web and cloud offerings which have shifted the tech nexus from the operating system to the browser.
- uslic001 2y agoLooks like the Blob will know everything you do on Windows 11 now if it already doesn't have that amount of access.