5 ms·

However I think it is important for children to get sick. Humans need pathogens to train their immune system.

AwaAwa 2y ago
While I personally agree with this sentiment, the last few years have made it amply clear that the population prefers padded rooms to icky playground sandlots.
- error_logic 2y ago
  Nuance: They're still getting exposed and thus gaining immunity with the environmental filtering, just not so much viral load as to be out of school [as often]. It's a win-win from that perspective and dismissing that serves no one in the end.
  - Sakos 2y ago
    This tiny but significant factor is also why masks, even surgical masks, are so helpful. They don't need to prevent 100% transmission, just reduce the viral load received or passed on.
WithinReason 2y ago
How often and how sick? The more the better?
- appplication 2y ago
  It’s a good question. Obviously infinite sick is not desirable. If it were possible to induce antibodies via e.g. broad spectrum vaccinations would we see less sick kids in total? After all the merits are supposedly eventual conferred immunity, not physically being ill. No reason to think you need to be sick to benefit.
candiddevmike 2y ago
The hygiene hypothesis is tenuous at best and dangerous (especially for immunocompromised peers!) at worst: https://publichealth.jhu.edu/2022/is-the-hygiene-hypothesis-true https://publichealth.jhu.edu/2022/is-the-hygiene-hypothesis-...
- elevatedastalt 2y ago
  Hardly anyone even thinks about peanut allergies in a nation of 1.4 billion people (India) and kids don't drop dead like flies here. But sure, let's just call the hygiene hypothesis tenuous.
  - candiddevmike 2y ago
    That's not at all the same thing.
  - yreg 2y ago
    Peanut allergy prevalence in India seems to be 0.3%, while in the western countries it's 1.5-3%.
  - kylehotchkiss 2y ago
    Or even seasonal allergies to like pollen too, right? There’s just much more pressing breathing related issues to be concerned with (AQI etc)
  - arresin 2y ago
    A: different genes, B: Different reporting standards, C: different access to healthcare for it to be reported
  - elric 2y ago
    I thought the recommendation was to introduce some peanuts at an early age in order to reduce the risk of getting peanut allergies?
  - consteval 2y ago
    Could it be that people in India have different genetic makeup than people in other countries? I mean, many populations have more/less risk of many physiological things. That's just how it goes. Black men are at much higher risk of prostate cancer. White people of melanoma. As a man, I pretty much don't have to worry about autoimmune disorders because my risk is 1/10th that of a woman's. But, my risk of heart disease is much higher - even at the same weight!
Arnt 2y ago
That sounds plausible, but do you think it's better to be more sick than less? Or do you just think that having a few sick days per year is better than marching into work no matter what state you're in? A very different proposition.
- nradov 2y ago
  I suspect it's probably better to shift the sick days earlier in life. We probably can't significantly reduce the total. There are hundreds of endemic upper respiratory viruses and we all eventually get infected with most of them. It's just a matter of time. Our immune systems generally degrade as we age, so over the long run it's probably better to get infected when we're younger so that we can build immunity that protects us when we're older.
  - coryrc 2y ago
    > We probably can't significantly reduce the total That's ridiculous. During the crisis times of covid, the incidences of other communicable disease dropped significantly. Plus, to be frank, this is just an idiotic suggestion with zero reasons to think there's some set number of days people are sick. Before having kids in daycare I was rarely sick. I had a child not in daycare and was never sick. Now we're sick all the time, which wouldn't happen if my wife could stay home with them or we didn't have kids.
    - nradov 2y ago
      That's ridiculous. The interventions put in place during the crisis times of COVID were obviously unsustainable. When restrictions were lifted, the incidence of all other types of respiratory viruses spiked up. I've had kids in daycare as well. Occasionally you get the sniffles. So what.
      - Arnt 2y ago
        The story describes something that cut the average number of sick days by around 30%. Is 30% significant, in your opinion?
_dain_ 2y ago
Immune system won't help against air pollution from traffic and factories and forest fires.
Etheryte 2y ago
This oversimplifies the original idea behind what you're trying to recall. Being sick in and of itself is not the beneficial part, it's exposure that can be beneficial in certain cases. If you can get the exposure without actually falling ill it's all the better, it's a win-win. Note that not all exposure is good, for example you never want to be exposed to the bubonic plague if at all possible.
duxup 2y ago
They're still getting sick.
switch007 2y ago
I've had COVID multiple times and each time my immune system takes a bigger and bigger battering, leading to many other issues. Are the benefits of this theory meant to start appearing any time soon...?
lbrito 2y ago
Don't worry, there will still be plenty of sickness. The article says 1/3 reduction. If you have kids, you'll know that the resulting number of sick days is still huge.

While I personally agree with this sentiment, the last few years have made it amply clear that the population prefers padded rooms to icky playground sandlots.

error_logic 2y ago
Nuance: They're still getting exposed and thus gaining immunity with the environmental filtering, just not so much viral load as to be out of school [as often]. It's a win-win from that perspective and dismissing that serves no one in the end.
- Sakos 2y ago
  This tiny but significant factor is also why masks, even surgical masks, are so helpful. They don't need to prevent 100% transmission, just reduce the viral load received or passed on.

WithinReason 2y ago

How often and how sick? The more the better?

appplication 2y ago
It’s a good question. Obviously infinite sick is not desirable. If it were possible to induce antibodies via e.g. broad spectrum vaccinations would we see less sick kids in total? After all the merits are supposedly eventual conferred immunity, not physically being ill. No reason to think you need to be sick to benefit.

candiddevmike 2y ago

The hygiene hypothesis is tenuous at best and dangerous (especially for immunocompromised peers!) at worst: https://publichealth.jhu.edu/2022/is-the-hygiene-hypothesis-true https://publichealth.jhu.edu/2022/is-the-hygiene-hypothesis-...

elevatedastalt 2y ago
Hardly anyone even thinks about peanut allergies in a nation of 1.4 billion people (India) and kids don't drop dead like flies here. But sure, let's just call the hygiene hypothesis tenuous.
- candiddevmike 2y ago
  That's not at all the same thing.
- yreg 2y ago
  Peanut allergy prevalence in India seems to be 0.3%, while in the western countries it's 1.5-3%.
- kylehotchkiss 2y ago
  Or even seasonal allergies to like pollen too, right? There’s just much more pressing breathing related issues to be concerned with (AQI etc)
- arresin 2y ago
  A: different genes, B: Different reporting standards, C: different access to healthcare for it to be reported
- elric 2y ago
  I thought the recommendation was to introduce some peanuts at an early age in order to reduce the risk of getting peanut allergies?
- consteval 2y ago
  Could it be that people in India have different genetic makeup than people in other countries? I mean, many populations have more/less risk of many physiological things. That's just how it goes. Black men are at much higher risk of prostate cancer. White people of melanoma. As a man, I pretty much don't have to worry about autoimmune disorders because my risk is 1/10th that of a woman's. But, my risk of heart disease is much higher - even at the same weight!

Arnt 2y ago

That sounds plausible, but do you think it's better to be more sick than less? Or do you just think that having a few sick days per year is better than marching into work no matter what state you're in? A very different proposition.

nradov 2y ago
I suspect it's probably better to shift the sick days earlier in life. We probably can't significantly reduce the total. There are hundreds of endemic upper respiratory viruses and we all eventually get infected with most of them. It's just a matter of time. Our immune systems generally degrade as we age, so over the long run it's probably better to get infected when we're younger so that we can build immunity that protects us when we're older.
- coryrc 2y ago
  > We probably can't significantly reduce the total That's ridiculous. During the crisis times of covid, the incidences of other communicable disease dropped significantly. Plus, to be frank, this is just an idiotic suggestion with zero reasons to think there's some set number of days people are sick. Before having kids in daycare I was rarely sick. I had a child not in daycare and was never sick. Now we're sick all the time, which wouldn't happen if my wife could stay home with them or we didn't have kids.
  - nradov 2y ago
    That's ridiculous. The interventions put in place during the crisis times of COVID were obviously unsustainable. When restrictions were lifted, the incidence of all other types of respiratory viruses spiked up. I've had kids in daycare as well. Occasionally you get the sniffles. So what.
    - Arnt 2y ago
      The story describes something that cut the average number of sick days by around 30%. Is 30% significant, in your opinion?

_dain_ 2y ago

Immune system won't help against air pollution from traffic and factories and forest fires.

Etheryte 2y ago

This oversimplifies the original idea behind what you're trying to recall. Being sick in and of itself is not the beneficial part, it's exposure that can be beneficial in certain cases. If you can get the exposure without actually falling ill it's all the better, it's a win-win. Note that not all exposure is good, for example you never want to be exposed to the bubonic plague if at all possible.

duxup 2y ago

They're still getting sick.

switch007 2y ago

I've had COVID multiple times and each time my immune system takes a bigger and bigger battering, leading to many other issues. Are the benefits of this theory meant to start appearing any time soon...?

lbrito 2y ago

Don't worry, there will still be plenty of sickness. The article says 1/3 reduction. If you have kids, you'll know that the resulting number of sick days is still huge.