7 ms·
A cafe worker: the question customers ask showing disrespect
- rrwo 2y agoThis reminds me of a story that I heard from a tree surgeon. A customer complained about the cost of removing a tree as it was "unskilled" labour, and he asked them if they knew how to remove a 30-metre high tree without it falling on his house or car, or if he even owned the right tools, or if he was able and willing to climb up to the top of that tree and remove branches.
- keepamovin 2y agoA good story that reveals the unconscious (or unashamed!) biases people have in ignorance without actual experience in those fields. edit: hahaha! :) half of all comments on this threads are robots. a bot fest! haha :)
- bombcar 2y agoThe list of so-called skilled labor jobs like lawyer, etc., that I would be willing to fake if I had to is pretty long the list of un skilled labor jobs basically starts with ditchdigger and ends there, and I’m even even scared of that one because of how you can die in a ditch if it collapses.
- jetbalsa 2y agoSome of the boomers I know like to explain that they are paying for a brain. someone who has taken the time in school and is "smart" This of course doesn't really work out as you have explained. I always like to point out that I'm one of those "smart" people and I'm a middle school drop out slacker who is just clever with computers.
- baud147258 2y agoNowadays I'd wager most ditchdigging is done with small excavators and I wouldn't want to operate one without some form of training. But I can use a broom if needed...
- ivm 2y agoNot in developing countries: most small excavations in Chile are done by hand, even during road construction. Very few bobcats around here, so anything where a backhoe would be too big is done with shovels.
- baud147258 2y agoTrue, I was mostly thinking of what I'm seeing here in France
- bryanlarsen 2y agoI was raised a farm boy where a lot of time was spent maintaining buildings, yards, machinery, etc., so I was exposed to most of the trades and could fake them if I had to. Which is why I know that the trades are skilled labour. Because I don't have any of that skill.
- switch007 2y agoAlmost every tradesperson I've ever employed has done a crap job. I have trouble calling it "skilled work"
- soco 2y agoUnfortunately you're quite right. Maybe because those workers are also "trained" to see what they do as unskilled work, like everyone else says? So unskilled work is what they deliver. Now if only the society would give proper attention and value to those jobs... Edit: I'm also a diplomed electrician, but I have never practiced and would not even dream to practice nowadays without proper updated training. I guess not everybody is that self conscious, because hey it's unskilled right, so here we are.
- switch007 2y agoThat's hilarious I hear them in pubs bragging about how great they are and now people need them etc. They're anything but downbeat They deliver shit work because they know they can charge high rates regardless, because of lack of DIY skills and lack of tradespeople. There's not enough competition - bring back the Polish I say.
- pixxel 2y agoSounds like you don’t have a network of friends/family to provide recommendations.
- deleted 2y ago[deleted]
- AlexeyBelov 2y agoSo what if they don't? It sounds like a dunk on them personally.
- switch007 2y agoIndeed. I was forced out of my home town to much further way due to the actions of successive governments to over-inflate house prices. Thank you for reminding me. Stay classy
- gchamonlive 2y agorelated https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29429385 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29429385 in it, the author of the article uses the example of building a stair to motivate the discussion of how in practice, when rubber meets the road, things get complicated in very interesting ways
- apwell23 2y agopaywalled. whats the "one question"?
- deleted 2y ago[deleted]
- diymaker 2y ago“If he’s so smart, why is he working here?”
- 4pkjai 2y ago"Of all the jobs I’ve had – creative agencies in London, content creator for a produce supplier in San Francisco, a digital marketer in Melbourne – nobody has ever breathed a word of interest in where I went to university."
- yuppiepuppie 2y agoCool story bro. I should write the same article but from a SE’s point of view.
- postepowanieadm 2y ago"Where is the toilet?"
- mediumsmart 2y agowhere is the disable javascript on the menu
- shrimp_emoji 2y agoIt's called NoScript, and you bring your own.
- benterix 2y agoIt's in the uBlock Origin dialog, just one click.
- ipython 2y agohttps://archive.ph/zJvZ0 https://archive.ph/zJvZ0
- deleted 2y ago[deleted]
- the__alchemist 2y agoI bounce around between coffee shops as a way to mix up the WFH routine. (Southeast US city). Rule #1 is to be nice to the staff. Be polite, tip well, complement the latte art etc. I'm not very socially adept, but this is easy mode.
- crngefest 2y agoAs someone who worked in service about a decade you would be surprised how many fail this step. I can guarantee you will get much better service if you are nice to the staff. I would go above and beyond to fulfill any request if you are nice about it; if you are rude sorry nothing I can do for you and yes you can speak to my manager, have a good day
- atoav 2y agoAnother good tip is to just be empathic. They are doing each small action all day, every day, repeatedly, probably a hundred times per shift. There is no reason for you to make more work for them than is necessary, even of you pay their bosses well.
- wood_spirit 2y agoIs it not friendly and normal to ask young wait staff what they are studying on the assumption that they are students earning their way though college? (And most young wait staff are? Except for California, where they are aspiring actors?)
- paulcole 2y agoAsk yourself the underlying reason for that assumption? Is it because you can’t imagine someone wanting to be a barista?
- imtringued 2y agoI couldn't think of something more unfriendly. You're assuming that every town is a college town. You're implying that you're willing to be a customer at a place that is so undesirable to work at, that the only reason the staff work this job is that they are lacking alternatives and want to get away from this job as soon as possible. Finally, if they aren't studying anything then you are basically telling them that they are stuck in a dead end job. How friendly!
- moralestapia 2y ago>I couldn't think of something more unfriendly. A punch to the face. There you go. Asking a young folk if/what are they studying is not unfriendly at all. I am the kind of person that engages in conversations with people around me and I have a never had a negative experience from that, quite the opposite, plenty of times I ended up having a joyful conversation where we both learn things about each other's.
- nutrie 2y ago> It taught me a lot about people, and the lack of respect some believe you deserve when wearing an apron. Tell you what: stop looking at the customers as walking wallets, and you'll have your respect. Greater tips too. Guaranteed. 99 % of the time, it's the staff's fault. And repeat this every morning: When the customer receives astonishing service and a mediocre product, it’s likely they give you a tip, maybe try again. If it’s the other way around, unlikely, and the enterprise is just a fluke. Do I expect undergrads working for tips to know this? Yes, god dammit!
- yuppiepuppie 2y agoTotally agree. I live in a country where tipping is not normal but will gladly give tips to staff when they make me feel like they want me there. I have been to a number of places in the post-covid era where they expect me to shell out large sums of money for little value. Just recently being in the US had me feeling this way more than elsewhere, but I can point to other examples in Europe.
- SketchySeaBeast 2y agoI can't remember the last time I felt like I was being treated by any wait staff as a walking wallet.
- Ragnarork 2y ago> stop looking at the customers as walking wallets Maybe that would help if the salary was enough to be self-sustaining and tips weren't necessary to make ends meet. Also, it's a vicious circle. It's harder to be nice to staff when they're not pleasant, it's harder for staff to be pleasant when their customers are brats with copious self-entitlement and condescension towards service workers. Empathy goes a long way here. > 99 % of the time, it's the staff's fault If that's your experience, I'd try looking inwards to find reasons why as well.
- nutrie 2y ago> ...salary That's a discussion you're supposed to have with your manager, customers don't care. > it's a vicious circle Yes. And you, as a member of the staff, your employer's rep, are supposed to quit it, asap.
- Am4TIfIsER0ppos 2y agoPut me in the disrespectful category. > I had a first-class honours degree If you want to pay for your own education then feel free to pursue any field of study you like. Why do you want me to pay for it if you're then going to wait tables? Let me guess you are working on the next big break in theoretical physics like Einstein at his patent clerk job.
- JadeNB 2y ago> Put me in the disrespectful category. > > I had a first-class honours degree > If you want to pay for your own education then feel free to pursue any field of study you like. Why do you want me to pay for it if you're then going to wait tables? Let me guess you are working on the next big break in theoretical physics like Einstein at his patent clerk job. You've started off by saying that you're going to be disrespectful, but let me say all the same, this is profoundly rude and disrespectful. Do you think service workers should not be paid? Unless you think that, what do you think is wrong with working service to pay for an education? (Besides which, notice that this is written by someone who has completed their education, so, even if you are really horrified at the idea of paying for someone's studies, that's not what's happening here.)
- Am4TIfIsER0ppos 2y agoWhere the fuck do you think I say a worker should not get paid? These stink pieces are usually from people who want free this and free that, in this particular case free education. Higher education is subsidized in the UK so naturally I assume this author wants more money to be stolen through taxes to pay for his unused degree and possibly worthless degree. Being a low paid waiter probably means he's under the threshold at which he has to pay back his subsidy.
- jstanley 2y agoI think the assumption is you're paying for the coffee, and what the staff spend their wages on is their own business.
- John23832 2y agoI get paywalling investigative journalism, but paywalling opinion pieces is ridiculous.
- codeulike 2y agoThere's a paywall so if you're wondering, here's the 'one question customers ask that shows a lack of respect': (Although really the article is more about general experiences and the 'one question' part was probably pulled out as a headline by a sub-editor) Customers in restaurants have a fanatical interest in the level of education achieved by the people serving them. In the odd instances where I would have time to talk to a diner about something other than the day’s specials, I would always be asked what I did at school. What did I study? Did I complete a master’s degree? Good grades?
- Tade0 2y ago> Those who like to complain about the delays in getting their decaf skinny lattes during the Saturday morning rush might appreciate their arrival a lot more if they had some experience in making them for other people. I think no, because in plenty of cases it's their value system that's the problem - they believe in a world where some serve and the others are served and that these groups should not mix. Their work experience changes little, as being the former they assume they're just the temporarily embarrassed latter and that is what drives them to do more. In our industry I've seen this attitude displayed towards front-end developers. Somehow for some, if you're doing this as a senior dev, there must be a problematic reason behind it.
- jajko 2y agoAnybody looking down on a fellow hardworking man is either uneducated/inexperienced with life (possible to fix) or lacks basic emotional intelligence (smart folks learn to mimic this the hard way over time, but it can't really be permanently 'gained' as in new situations they still behave like elephant in porcelain shop). I've seen it a lot when backpacking around the world, certain cultures have it at/close to their core, others are the opposite.
- JadeNB 2y agoWhat does "[flagged] [bot thread]" mean? The submitter keepamovin seems to be a legitimate user with plenty of valid submissions (https://news.ycombinator.com/submitted?id=keepamovin https://news.ycombinator.com/submitted?id=keepamovin) (and more reputation than I have!).
- dang 2y agoThe [flagged] bit comes from users having flagged the post. The "[bot thread]" bit came from the submitted title, which was "[bot thread] A cafe worker: the question customers ask showing disrespect". I've taken that out now.
- JadeNB 2y agoThanks! I understood the meaning of [flagged] (sorry, that was definitely unclear from my question). What surprised me was that [bot thread] wasn't in the original submission, so I thought that it had been added automatically.
- geor9e 2y ago"What did you study?" Saved You A Click
- snapplebobapple 2y agoIts weird that they think we are complaining from ignorance. I was the employee of the ywar 25 years ago at my local mcdonalds, and i worked numerous other service jobs theough university. I am complaining precisely because i know how badly they are cocking it up