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We got here because both sides have for the last 8 years consistently failed to treat one another as human beings with opinions rather than the literal devil in
by lolinder 2y ago
We got here because both sides have for the last 8 years consistently failed to treat one another as human beings with opinions rather than the literal devil incarnate.
There are a substantial number of people on this forum who sincerely believe that if Trump is elected there will not be another election. If enough people sincerely believe that, one of them will eventually decide that it's worth it to sacrifice their own life to ensure the survival of democracy in America.
- IAmGraydon 2y agoThat's correct. And the idea that Trump will end democracy is a core part of the left's fear campaign. They share responsibility for this.
- voisin 2y agoOh come on man. He clearly tried to subvert the last election and came within steps of his VP being killed by a mob he encoded while trying to certify the election. This isn’t just a fear campaign.
- lolinder 2y agoIt's a fear campaign, and the leaders of the Democratic party know it. Trump regularly behaves completely irresponsibly and is a terrible loser, and Trump is definitely capable of (intentionally and otherwise) inciting violence, but if you compare the actions of the Democratic leadership to their rhetoric you can clearly see they don't believe the full extent of their own rhetoric about him. They play up the apocalyptic fears for democracy itself because they know it's the only card they have left after nominating Biden. If they were serious about protecting democracy they'd have kicked him out last year when there was still time to build momentum for an electable candidate, rather than continuing to protect his ego. If they were serious about protecting democracy they would have tried harder to court the moderate voters (who are very courtable right now if anyone cared to try). If they were serious about protecting democracy they would have done anything other than focus exclusively on how terrible Trump is for the last four years, because they know that you don't beat a fire by fanning it. They would have deescalated, but instead they escalated, and they absolutely share responsibility for this.
- beaglesss 2y ago[flagged]
- mikewarot 2y agoI'd get Hitler on a boat to the US with an admission to an Art college in 1913. Then I would make sure Bill and Hillary never met. It would be such a better timeline... I think.
- shrimp_emoji 2y agoHe'd be replaced by someone else. It's so stupid to think of Hitler as some anomaly of evil. It's even stupid to think that of the Nazis as a whole. It was just a freak wave of "Evil" that requires no further explanation and that we're magically incapable of. It was a response to their environment. Studying the conditions that led to the Nazis is probably going to be more informative than how you'd shoot Hitler and magically avoid the entire problem. But, hey, that's how all stupid Democrats think about Trump, as some spellcaster who's hypnotized all his voters, which is a colossally miss of why people actually support him and a display of pathetic levels of charity and theory of mind about other people. "Don't you know he's a criminal and a liar?!?!" It's like an NPC talking at you whose programming can't countenance concepts like "protest vote", "humor", or "fear campaigns designed to control you".
- mikewarot 2y agoWilson's absence at the league of nations led to the punitive Treaty of Versailles. As for Trump he does the Gish Gallop, spewing lies so fast you can't argue with him in good faith. He doesn't believe in democracy, and should have never been let near power, ever.
- yongjik 2y agoI remember seeing a comment in HN that went like "So some group of people walked into a government building. Big deal." I guess, for people whose world view is so malleable that they can look at an attempt to overthrow the government and say "Some people walked into a government building," it makes perfect sense to feel sorry for Trump being demonized by the Left.
- mistermann 2y ago> He clearly https://plato.stanford.edu/entries/perception-problem/ https://plato.stanford.edu/entries/perception-problem/ These conversations (this entire thread and all(!) others like it, with perhaps a few exceptional comments here and there) are like listening to my uneducated family members discussing AI at my last family reunion. Noteworthy: they show no signs that they realize the predicament they are in. Why are people like this? How can there be no exceptions? Is this the real life? Is this just fantasy...
- kernal 2y ago[flagged]
- dragontamer 2y agoDonald Trump was in charge of the Army in Jan 6th, 2021. When Donald Trump failed to deploy the National Guard, it was Mike Pence who stepped in and called them in. Donald Trump never lifted a finger to help that day. Speaking of Nanci Pelosi, have you already forgotten the hammer attack and her would-be assassin?
- energy123 2y agoLook only at the Trump-Raffensberger phone call. You're asking me to ignore the evidence of my senses. The transcript is there for you to read. The 22nd amendment is the only thing that gives me confidence, but it won't be for lack of trying on his part.
- hindsightbias 2y agoTrump is completely normal - let’s roll the dice after his Jan 6th performance and hope for the best. We’ve got a SCOTUS that says he can be King. Surely he won’t use it, because…
- energy123 2y agoIt's wild how the Overton window has shifted for the worse. Back in 2015-2016, supporting Trump was politically incorrect because of what he theoretically might do. Now after he actually tried to do the thing, the floodgates seem to have opened and all the scum have given each other confidence to come out showing their true colours.
- bamboozled 2y agoI'm quite sure he is open about ending democracy from day one?
- defrost 2y ago[flagged]
- bamboozled 2y agoWell I guess because America is a failing nation, according to him, he might have to be a dictator for a little longer just to "fix it all", right? Don't you know how this works? Never read a history book?
- defrost 2y ago> Don't you know how this works? Is that a loaded question? > Never read a history book? Have you stopped beating your mother? I'll return to my factual deadpan comment above. He did { promise | pinky swear } to only act as a dictator for a day. That stands alone just fine as it is.
- bamboozled 2y agoIs that like a funny thing to joke about ? Do you know how many people have died protecting freedom and democracy ? How many Americans ? Anyway have fun with it if he wins. You’ll find out. Our family are refugees from the Soviet Union, so enjoys your “jokes” and stubbornness to read the signs. Vote wisely is my advice.
- defrost 2y ago[flagged]
- bamboozled 2y ago[flagged]
- bitnasty 2y agoAre you forgetting what happened after the 2020 election? This “both sides” shit is a bunch of fucking baloney.
- Larrikin 2y agoThere were 16 years of bad faith negotiations from one side
- lolinder 2y agoCase in point. Show this comment to either side and they'd heartily agree with you.
- archagon 2y ago[flagged]
- aydyn 2y ago[flagged]
- lolinder 2y agoYep. Political debate has really slid downhill—neither wing feels the need to justify their position anymore, they just assume that you're either already with them or already against them and they're just here to swing blows for the good cause, whichever that may be. I'm a moderate voter who desperately wants someone to vote for. Persuade me! Make me like your position! Give me some reason to trust any candidate for any office! Arguing like a pair of toddlers doesn't leave us in the middle with any good options.
- mistermann 2y ago[flagged]
- mistermann 2y ago[flagged]
- bamboozled 2y ago[flagged]
- mistermann 2y agoWhat is going on has been known of for centuries: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maya_(religion) https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maya_(religion)
- seanmcdirmid 2y agoSocial media is left leaning because people under 40 are left leaning. New culture has always been left leaning, from that new tangled rock and roll in the 50s to whatever happened in the late 60s, you should have seen the conspiracy theories they came up with in those protests against Vietnam (largely proven right over time).
- lr1970 2y ago> Social media is left leaning because people under 40 are left leaning. Attributed to Winston Churchill: "If you are not a liberal when twenty - you have no heart, if you are not conservative when forty - you have no brains."
- seanmcdirmid 2y agoI'm totally that, but one side is nuts right now, so I still have to split my vote.
- 10u152 2y agoWhich side that is definitely will depend on your bias
- seanmcdirmid 2y agoI mean, sure, but one side has a track record of ruining the economy, and pushing for short term, feel good now policies that are irresponsible. Vote for stupid and your retire,ent funds can get burned.
- lolinder 2y agoI realize the phrase "both sides" is triggering for anyone who sees the other side as completely insane and their side as correct and rational, but I stand by what I said. I live among rabid right-wingers and work among rabid left-wingers, and neither group sees the other as anything other than evil or stupidly deluded. They're both wrong on that front and both need to stop and actually try to understand each other before we see more violence.
- bitnasty 2y agoTrump tried to cling to power once after losing a fair election. You don’t think he’ll try again?
- AlgorithmicTime 2y ago[dead]