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Will Tesla become the Android, vs say BYD? It's starting to feel more like Tesla will be the Nokia/Blackberry of cars.

• msoad 2y ago
  Americans do not comprehend how advanced BYD and others are in EV. It's no accident that their government is fighting the import of Chinese cars
  • PaulWaldman 2y ago
    I understand the cost to the end user is much less, but in what ways is their technology more advanced?
    • nox101 2y ago
      Cars that change in 10 minutes? https://ev.com/news/byd-and-catl-set-to-introduce-ev-batteries-capable-of-full-charge-in-10-minutes&blogId=3193 https://ev.com/news/byd-and-catl-set-to-introduce-ev-batteri...
      • HeatrayEnjoyer 2y ago
        How would that even be supplied? Megawatt circuits are the domain of industrial factories, not "gas" stations.
        • JumpCrisscross 2y ago
          > How would that even be supplied? Capacitors.
        • deleted 2y ago
          [deleted]
        • andruby 2y ago
          The article states that it would need 650KW to charge at 6C rates. Huawei has already announced 600 kW DC fast chargers: https://asia.nikkei.com/Spotlight/Electric-cars-in-China/China-s-Huawei-launches-alliance-for-ultrafast-EV-charging https://asia.nikkei.com/Spotlight/Electric-cars-in-China/Chi...
          • HeatrayEnjoyer 2y ago
            The bottleneck is the grid not terminal hardware. If a home or small business asks for a multiple MW circuit they're going to be laughed at for preposterousness. Laying harmless gigabit fiber to a new area requires permits, construction, labor, think of what becomes necessary when it's enough electrons to kill a dinosaur.
    • cyberax 2y ago
      The UI is _miles_ ahead. And they are preparing to release a 1000 km (620 mile) range vehicle.
    • JumpCrisscross 2y ago
      > in what ways is their technology more advanced? BYD's technology, not so much--they're better at manufacturing cars in degrees compared to Tesla, not an order of magnitude. The magic is at CATL and friends. There is a Cambrian explosion of battery technology in China that doesn't get reported super well in the mainstream press.
      • HeatrayEnjoyer 2y ago
        What's going on with battery technology?
        • mensetmanusman 2y ago
          Mostly cost reductions, there isn’t much room in the physics for higher energy density. Eg it will always be less than chemical energy density.
        • JumpCrisscross 2y ago
          > What's going on with battery technology? Iron [1] and now sodium [2]. [1] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lithium_iron_phosphate_battery https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lithium_iron_phosphate_batte... [2] https://www.electrive.com/2023/11/20/byd-huaihai-move-on-plans-for-sodium-ion-battery-plant/ https://www.electrive.com/2023/11/20/byd-huaihai-move-on-pla...
    • defrost 2y ago
      Adding to the other peer reasons, staggering range of design styles and price points; executive class, cheap fun young cars, utility vehicles, etc.
    • richardw 2y ago
      Just one example: https://www.drive.com.au/news/byd-to-introduce-new-second-gen-1000km-battery-technology/ https://www.drive.com.au/news/byd-to-introduce-new-second-ge... They’re doing a lot of licensing to western companies.
  • bpodgursky 2y ago
    Tesla is competitive (sales are not dominant, but OK, in China) but the other US automakers are truly f***.
  • mensetmanusman 2y ago
    It actually has more to do with war and realpolitik.
• wazoox 2y ago
  Tesla once looked futuristic, but now they're sorely lacking : automatic windscreen wipers still don't work properly (they work perfectly well on my 2005 Ford Focus, thank you), they now lack basic ergonomic features such as a turn signal lever, their "self driving" feature is horribly lagging behind most other makers (constant phantom braking still a recurring problem after years and years, no proper automatic overtaking, inferior speed control and speed limit enforcement, etc).
  • ripjaygn 2y ago
    > their "self driving" feature is horribly lagging behind most other makers (constant phantom braking still a recurring problem after years and years, no proper automatic overtaking, inferior speed control and speed limit enforcement, etc) Who are these makers that allegedly outclass Autopilot/FSD?
    • blacksmith_tb 2y ago
      Haven't ridden in one, but I think Mercedes' Drive Pilot is supposed to be a contender: https://www.theverge.com/2023/9/27/23892154/mercedes-benz-drive-pilot-autonomous-level-3-test https://www.theverge.com/2023/9/27/23892154/mercedes-benz-dr...
      • ripjaygn 2y ago
        Drive Pilot just follows the car in front and has several limitations, it doesn't even have overtaking, so I would be surprised since the parent poster says lack of automatic overtaking is a limitation. Drive Pilot: Works only when behind another car, it just follows that car Cannot change lanes Works only under 40MPH Works only in daylight, does not work at night Does not work in rain Works only in traffic jams and heavy traffic Works only on a few pre-approved roads How is the world is FSD "severely lagging behind" this tech when FSD has none of these limitations? Something weird about how the Mercedes tech is hyped up in message forums.
        • blacksmith_tb 2y ago
• ripjaygn 2y ago
  So far the story has been Tesla being the Apple of EVs(pioneer, small number of premium models, lots of mindshare), BYD being the Samsung(cheaper copy of Tesla), and GM/Ford etc. being the Nokia/Blackberry(legacy volume manufacturers that did not pivot to the new thing in time).
• ralfd 2y ago
  Tesla is at least profitable, while Rivian is losing $30000 with every sold car.
  • unshavedyak 2y ago
    Was. The Gen 2's have a very different internal cost. In theory it's much better, but i don't know if it's been said how much.