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> At least the current Labour leader strikes me as a decent man with some actual principles and backbone and this would fundamentally be a decent thing to do.

> At least the current Labour leader strikes me as a decent man with some actual principles and backbone and this would fundamentally be a decent thing to do. (massive sidetrack, but I can't let this sentence go unpunished) The current labour leader is the lamest duck in a group of wet blankets. His policies revolve around not being as corrupt as the Tories whilst doing virtually nothing else to better his constituents. His backbone has a restitution coefficient somewhere in the Oort cloud.

davedx 2y ago
Labour just said they’ll enforce the warrant for Netanyahu’s arrest. You find that lacking backbone?
- locallost 2y ago
  Starmer has absolutely no opinions on anything other than not rattling the cage of conservative voters. This makes him broadly acceptable, but long term nobody is truly supporting him.
- zadler 2y ago
  Have to see if they actually do it. Saying it means very little, it’s not a controversial position.
- vidarh 2y ago
  Yes. He's dragged his feet on the Gaza war and on this for as long as he possibly could, but has increasingly faced outrage in more left-leaning areas and areas with more Muslim voters and all his policy stances appear to be calculated on the basis of what will win more votes/lose fewer votes rather than any kind of backbone. Nothing happens until he has more to lose by doing nothing.
- PlutoIsAPlanet 2y ago
  Keir Starmer is a human rights lawyer, would be a bit weird for him to suddenly have no regard for international law where many human rights (ECHR) come from and likely divide his party. Not saying he's got a backbone, but he's just going for the easier option that keeps his party united.
kybernetikos 2y ago
He's also got a background as a human rights lawyer. He probably has a lot of personal interest in cases like this.
- bob88jg 2y ago
  He literally started the UK side of the persecution - starmer is a cop, always has been always will be....
317070 2y ago
FWIW, I am one of his constituents in Camden, and he helped us out tremendously in a pickle with Home Office when the latest war in Ukraine broke out. The issue went from 6 months in limbo to being resolved within a week. I am not commenting on the backbone, but he is definitely there for his constituents.
vintermann 2y ago
He is also personally responsible for the persecution of Assange. He was head of Crown Prosecution Services in the UK at the time we know (from Stefania Maurizi's FOIA requests) they actually threatened Sweden when Sweden wanted to drop the case. Wet blanked doesn't begin to cover it. I honestly think he's an entryist trying to tank the Labour party on the behalf of some British spy-lord. He's failing, but that's more the Tories' fault.
- zadler 2y ago
  The spy lord is Tony Blair
- baud147258 2y ago
  > an entryist trying to tank the Labour party on the behalf of some British spy-lord I'm far from following current UK politics, but I've heard the same thing about Liz Truss...
- impossiblefork 2y ago
  Do you happen to have these FOIA requests, and what kind of threats against Sweden were these? My attempts to find them by searching the internet have failed.
  - tetris11 2y ago
    https://skwawkbox.org/2023/02/01/swedish-prosecutors-joined-starmers-cps-in-destroying-huge-evidence-in-assange-case/ https://skwawkbox.org/2023/02/01/swedish-prosecutors-joined-...
- CRConrad 2y ago
  What is an entryist?
IshKebab 2y ago
Have you actually read their policies? There are plenty of big changes. Maybe you are referring to them not stating that they will change taxes significantly? Well, yeah no shit. a) they can't, taxes are at their highest level since WW2, and b) they don't want to destabilise things like Truss did. I think his biggest issue is that his voice sounds a bit wet and that makes people think he is wet.
- omnimus 2y ago
  He is Tony Blair / New Left all over again. Labour bleached from left wing policies. Nothing will change as they are on board to keep status quo. This (just like the New Left) will pave way for even more populist right candidates get in to power. Namely it paves way for Farage to be PM.
  - bad_good_guy 2y ago
    Good, Tony Blair / New Labour were amazing for the country.
    - hardlianotion 2y ago
      I am always very curious of hugely enthusiastic New Labour supporters. Happy to share my own opinion, but what are the achievements you laude them for, and what failures are they to be weighed against?
      - gnfargbl 2y ago
        Off the top of my head: saving the NHS from decades of under-investment; introducing the National Minimum Wage; putting in place a huge school repair programme; ending the Troubles in NI; writing off the debts of poorer countries; Scottish devolution; and, for the majority of their term at least, fiscal stability and consistent economic growth. The other side of the coin is, of course, the Iraq War. We needn't debate that, because we'll surely violently agree, but let's not pretend the Blair/Brown partnership didn't lead to many positive things for the UK. It did.
dmje 2y ago
The question is whether his backbone will grow back once he's in power. I'm in two minds. In our house I'm of the opinion that Labour should go "Full Left" and be strong and confident about it; my wife thinks they should get in using whatever means possible (including the slightly pathetic not-very-left agenda they're currently sporting) and then hope they'll make proper changes once in. Let's see what 4th July brings. At least it'll be the end of the current horrorshow.
- GordonS 2y ago
  I'm sorry, but I find this kind of ridiculous - Starmer is being pretty clear about the kind of man he is. Fervent capitalist, previous member of the CIA-linked Trilateral Commission, notorious U-turner, War on Drugs(TM) supporter, outright liar, genocide supporter, and absolutely completely beholden to Israel (he has even said he'll put Israel lobbiests into the highest echelons of gov - he's practically a foreign agent at this point). He's telling you who he is, so please believe him - the idea that this man will become PM and then suddenly turn into Jeremy Corbyn is, frankly, delusional. I can understand why someone would want to believe that, but in all likelihood we're just getting more of the same.
  - Closi 2y ago
    People on the whole don't want a Jeremy Corbyn anyway - he led his party to the biggest labour defeat since 1935. Don't know why the labour party would want to replicate that shit-show.
    - GordonS 2y ago
      He was smeared with false antisemitism claims, hence the massive defeat. One of those involved in the smearing was... Starmer. Corbyn was never going to be "allowed" to be Prime Minister. Also, listen to his recent interview where he says he was asked by a committee if he would guarantee to be 100% behind any military action instigated by Israel.
      - fathyb 2y ago
rjzzleep 2y ago
I would genuinely love to know which media your parent watches and reads to come to such a conclusion. It is remarkable. I've never heard such a statement about Stamer, but it's clear that I don't read the same sources.

davedx 2y ago

Labour just said they’ll enforce the warrant for Netanyahu’s arrest. You find that lacking backbone?

locallost 2y ago
Starmer has absolutely no opinions on anything other than not rattling the cage of conservative voters. This makes him broadly acceptable, but long term nobody is truly supporting him.
zadler 2y ago
Have to see if they actually do it. Saying it means very little, it’s not a controversial position.
vidarh 2y ago
Yes. He's dragged his feet on the Gaza war and on this for as long as he possibly could, but has increasingly faced outrage in more left-leaning areas and areas with more Muslim voters and all his policy stances appear to be calculated on the basis of what will win more votes/lose fewer votes rather than any kind of backbone. Nothing happens until he has more to lose by doing nothing.
PlutoIsAPlanet 2y ago
Keir Starmer is a human rights lawyer, would be a bit weird for him to suddenly have no regard for international law where many human rights (ECHR) come from and likely divide his party. Not saying he's got a backbone, but he's just going for the easier option that keeps his party united.

kybernetikos 2y ago

He's also got a background as a human rights lawyer. He probably has a lot of personal interest in cases like this.

bob88jg 2y ago
He literally started the UK side of the persecution - starmer is a cop, always has been always will be....

317070 2y ago

FWIW, I am one of his constituents in Camden, and he helped us out tremendously in a pickle with Home Office when the latest war in Ukraine broke out. The issue went from 6 months in limbo to being resolved within a week. I am not commenting on the backbone, but he is definitely there for his constituents.

vintermann 2y ago

He is also personally responsible for the persecution of Assange. He was head of Crown Prosecution Services in the UK at the time we know (from Stefania Maurizi's FOIA requests) they actually threatened Sweden when Sweden wanted to drop the case. Wet blanked doesn't begin to cover it. I honestly think he's an entryist trying to tank the Labour party on the behalf of some British spy-lord. He's failing, but that's more the Tories' fault.

zadler 2y ago
The spy lord is Tony Blair
baud147258 2y ago
> an entryist trying to tank the Labour party on the behalf of some British spy-lord I'm far from following current UK politics, but I've heard the same thing about Liz Truss...
impossiblefork 2y ago
Do you happen to have these FOIA requests, and what kind of threats against Sweden were these? My attempts to find them by searching the internet have failed.
- tetris11 2y ago
  https://skwawkbox.org/2023/02/01/swedish-prosecutors-joined-starmers-cps-in-destroying-huge-evidence-in-assange-case/ https://skwawkbox.org/2023/02/01/swedish-prosecutors-joined-...
CRConrad 2y ago
What is an entryist?

IshKebab 2y ago

Have you actually read their policies? There are plenty of big changes. Maybe you are referring to them not stating that they will change taxes significantly? Well, yeah no shit. a) they can't, taxes are at their highest level since WW2, and b) they don't want to destabilise things like Truss did. I think his biggest issue is that his voice sounds a bit wet and that makes people think he is wet.

omnimus 2y ago
He is Tony Blair / New Left all over again. Labour bleached from left wing policies. Nothing will change as they are on board to keep status quo. This (just like the New Left) will pave way for even more populist right candidates get in to power. Namely it paves way for Farage to be PM.
- bad_good_guy 2y ago
  Good, Tony Blair / New Labour were amazing for the country.
  - hardlianotion 2y ago
    I am always very curious of hugely enthusiastic New Labour supporters. Happy to share my own opinion, but what are the achievements you laude them for, and what failures are they to be weighed against?
    - gnfargbl 2y ago
      Off the top of my head: saving the NHS from decades of under-investment; introducing the National Minimum Wage; putting in place a huge school repair programme; ending the Troubles in NI; writing off the debts of poorer countries; Scottish devolution; and, for the majority of their term at least, fiscal stability and consistent economic growth. The other side of the coin is, of course, the Iraq War. We needn't debate that, because we'll surely violently agree, but let's not pretend the Blair/Brown partnership didn't lead to many positive things for the UK. It did.

dmje 2y ago

The question is whether his backbone will grow back once he's in power. I'm in two minds. In our house I'm of the opinion that Labour should go "Full Left" and be strong and confident about it; my wife thinks they should get in using whatever means possible (including the slightly pathetic not-very-left agenda they're currently sporting) and then hope they'll make proper changes once in. Let's see what 4th July brings. At least it'll be the end of the current horrorshow.

GordonS 2y ago
I'm sorry, but I find this kind of ridiculous - Starmer is being pretty clear about the kind of man he is. Fervent capitalist, previous member of the CIA-linked Trilateral Commission, notorious U-turner, War on Drugs(TM) supporter, outright liar, genocide supporter, and absolutely completely beholden to Israel (he has even said he'll put Israel lobbiests into the highest echelons of gov - he's practically a foreign agent at this point). He's telling you who he is, so please believe him - the idea that this man will become PM and then suddenly turn into Jeremy Corbyn is, frankly, delusional. I can understand why someone would want to believe that, but in all likelihood we're just getting more of the same.
- Closi 2y ago
  People on the whole don't want a Jeremy Corbyn anyway - he led his party to the biggest labour defeat since 1935. Don't know why the labour party would want to replicate that shit-show.
  - GordonS 2y ago
    He was smeared with false antisemitism claims, hence the massive defeat. One of those involved in the smearing was... Starmer. Corbyn was never going to be "allowed" to be Prime Minister. Also, listen to his recent interview where he says he was asked by a committee if he would guarantee to be 100% behind any military action instigated by Israel.
    - fathyb 2y ago

rjzzleep 2y ago

I would genuinely love to know which media your parent watches and reads to come to such a conclusion. It is remarkable. I've never heard such a statement about Stamer, but it's clear that I don't read the same sources.