10 ms·

This happened to me. I was wondering why my internet speeds were slow when I discovered that Microsoft was in the process of uploading my users directory, they

by suby 2y ago

This happened to me. I was wondering why my internet speeds were slow when I discovered that Microsoft was in the process of uploading my users directory, they had already uploaded almost two gigs when I realized. They also changed the path to these directories to something like C:\Users\name\OneDrive\Desktop\. Another poster in this thread claimed it's easy to reverse -- I disagree, it's a pain in the ass to track down the setting, and I shouldn't have to do this. When I did, it gave me an error for one of the directories and refuses to revert (documents?). I don't like leaving negative or hyperbolic comments on HN, but this was enraging and unacceptable to me. It's hard to convey without coming off as unhinged. I only ever boot into Windows nowadays when I need to compile and test a Windows build of software. I understand Microsoft has built up good will through efforts like VS Code, but it's all undone because of things like this. I avoid MS products, they cannot be trusted.

tyleo 2y ago
This is almost my exact experience too.
- sorry_outta_gas 2y ago
  It's annoying but it's a smart move, once they get you to hit that low 5gb onedrive limit it's a easy path to get you on a office365 sub for the extra storage.
A4ET8a8uTh0 2y ago
<< It's hard to convey without coming off as unhinged. I almost wonder if this is by design. I genuinely had people look at me funny when I described relatively minor issues that eventually made me jump from Windows ( in my case I think it was dropping detailed descriptions from updates in Windows 7 ). I kept explaining that even the issues are not the actual issue. The issue is that I am unable to administer my machine as I see fit. I am not anti-tech, I tell people, but the tech has to work for me...
gear54rus 2y ago
Did you login with ms account? if so, why? I don't think it can upload if you aren't logged in.
- lolinder 2y ago
  > if so, why? Have you tried installing Windows 11 without signing in to a Microsoft account? It's very difficult to do and the instructions online keep having to change as Microsoft makes it more and more difficult. What I'm finding now [0] involves using a hotkey to open command prompt at a certain part of the installation process and running a command to disable the internet before you proceed. [0] https://www.tomshardware.com/how-to/install-windows-11-without-microsoft-account https://www.tomshardware.com/how-to/install-windows-11-witho...
  - gear54rus 2y ago
    I guess mine just came pre-installed without that. But my point still stands, just don't interact with the crap and you're still somewhat safer.
    - lolinder 2y ago
      > just don't interact with the crap and you're still somewhat safer You're not wrong, but your initial comment made it sound like it was just a matter of not stepping in a single pile of dog poo. What Microsoft presents users with instead is an entire sewer with a great big EXIT sign pointing straight through the sewage. If you're in the know you can mutter a secret incantation and a ladder will drop down, allowing you to climb up onto a rickety catwalk with lots of warning signs telling you that you're going the wrong way. If you're brave enough to ignore the warning signs then eventually you'll get to the other side without touching the crap. Needless to say, most people follow the path that Microsoft designed for them and end up interacting with at least some of the crap.
    - gleenn 2y ago
      You are definitely right but I still feel like this is Stockholm syndrome, if they keep dark-patterning people more and more into logging in, it doesn't really make this a substantial improvement, they'll update they're way into tracking you and uploading your personal files somehow.
IanKerr 2y ago
I'm imagining this happening to someone on a highly metered connection and blowing through gigs of their limited monthly upload budget before realizing their OS has just gone rogue on them. Treating everyone like they have an unlimited bandwidth budget and greedily using it without permission is just awful behavior.
- deleted 2y ago
  [deleted]
- cyanydeez 2y ago
  All to sell daily users on copilot
- ethagnawl 2y ago
  Proton is an improvement for sure and worth being hopeful about but it takes effort to get/keep games working. I've probably spent 10 hours trying to make Cyberpunk 2077 work with varying levels of success. I finally caved and just started booting into Windows 11 to play -- the only time I ever use it.
- ant6n 2y ago
  Or somebody tethering abroad to do some quick online task, then needing to pay 500$ in roaming fees.
jchw 2y ago
> It's hard to convey without coming off as unhinged Man. I have felt this way a whole lot lately. I think some people see Linux users and genuinely can't fathom how or why they'd want to go through all of the trouble choosing to use Linux and doing real work on it. A lot of us look back just as puzzled, because when I switched to a Linux desktop for the first time in around 2004, it was definitely a choice, but it hasn't felt like a "choice" for a very long time.
- pbhjpbhj 2y ago
  Installing a mainstream distro on modern hardware (AMD graphics at least; I haven't tested Intel, Nvidia) is way easier and more relaxed than doing the same for Windows 11. Then installing apps, even with WingetUI it's far easier on Linux than trying to find and install apps on Windows... God help me, I hope Microsoft have learnt how to actually do window management this time to make all their crap worthwhile.
  - Choco31415 2y ago
    I just installed Ubuntu on my self built computer with Nvidia GPU. It's working really well!
  - slowmovintarget 2y ago
    Their crap is no longer worthwhile. Each move they make is extractive, not additive.
  - causal 2y ago
    Unfortunately most users will never install their own OS. Until Linux breaks into consumer OEM Microsoft has nothing to worry about.
- chx 2y ago
  Yeah I ran Linux as my daily driver 2004-2017 and I regret it. Since then I run Windows 10 + WSL and life is good. Win10 support ends next year and I am at a complete loss at what to do. Linux desktop never worked, never will, the incentives are not there. It's only free if you don't value your time. As I wrote before , your choices are Ubuntu where an OS upgrade shatters your entire system so throughly it takes days to get back to a working system or you can go with Arch where Bluetooth/multifunction device/etc might break every so often. But at least most of the system remains standing. And if you need to connect to some funny enterprise wifi or VPN, the IT department of the client will have Mac and Windows support but Linux? X Windows doesn't get new features, Wayland is not ready, and the package manager landscape is just getting worse https://media.hachyderm.io/media_attachments/files/112/616/917/049/407/017/original/e212f045118a3f11.png https://media.hachyderm.io/media_attachments/files/112/616/9... Windows 11 is hot garbage. No other way to put it. Send help.
davisr 2y ago
Now you understand why Stallman was right. If you don't want to get shafted, the only way is to control 100% of the software running on your machine. One either does that with totally free/libre software, or they don't. No one can or should trust non-free software. Period.
tomrod 2y ago
Perhaps time for me to leave VS Code. I have suitable replacements for everything else MSoft. The plug-ins ecosystem is helpful, but what the heck!
- cyanydeez 2y ago
  Im surprised its. Not forked yet
  - bsuvc 2y ago
    It's not a fork, but there is VSCodium https://github.com/VSCodium/vscodium https://github.com/VSCodium/vscodium
- bsuvc 2y ago
  If open source is not a requirement, Jetbrains IDEs are very good.
neither_color 2y ago
I don't like leaving negative or hyperbolic comments on HN, but this was enraging and unacceptable to me. It's hard to convey without coming off as unhinged You're not unhinged, there's been a fundamental change in internet culture and the early 2000s free internet people are considered loony now. Ive been laughed out of Discord groups(it's what the under 30s use these days instead of chats and forums, and is itself problematic) for talking about these things.
- dontdoxxme 2y ago
  I think it’s better to see it as not a shift in culture but understand that the internet represents all culture now. There are still under 30s that believe in real freedom but everyone is on the internet now, rather than a set of people that were more biased towards freedom (as that was partly what the internet represented).
  - Multicomp 2y ago
    Agreed. I've had to start being more selective and going to places like Agora Road and the like just to find that subculture flavor once again. It turns out even the 2000s web 2.0 itself can have an Eternal September, who'd of thought?
- bitcharmer 2y ago
  I'm with you. They just don't know any better. Discord is a prime example of how complete garbage software can become dominant because modern day users set the bar really low.
- thewebguyd 2y ago
  This has been a struggle for me as I've gotten older - and I'm not even that old (36) but I've noticed such a big culture shift with the younger generations. I've been accused of holding "far right" views, or at best an overly paranoid nut, for some of my opinions on software and internet freedom, for promoting E2E encryption, and lamenting the loss of public forums to private, hidden from search, discord/Facebook groups, etc. To be honest, it's difficult to sit by and watch the enshittification of everything tech while seeing the younger crowd be totally OK with it, and in a lot of cases even defend it.
II2II 2y ago
> I understand Microsoft has built up good will through efforts like VS Code, but it's all undone because of things like this. Someone in Microsoft should look into who is making these decisions, why these decisions are are being made, and why they are being received so negatively. Then they need to address them. Even though I'm not much of a fan of Microsoft products, I get the impression that they have some excellent developers making excellent products that end up being undermined by business decisions. These are decisions that will probably end up undermining the business itself. We don't live in the 1990's anymore. Microsoft has plenty of competitors who are nibbling away at their edges.
- jtriangle 2y ago
  Oh, I mean, the "why" is pretty simple. They're going to enable onedrive upload by default, wait until the sync finishes, then change the EULA to allow them to scrape everyone's onedrive for machine learning data that they can then sell. >>Welcome to hell.
  - marcosdumay 2y ago
    > change the EULA Have you read the Windows privacy policy any time in the last decade? They don't need to change anything.
    - jtriangle 2y ago
      I can't tell you the last time I read a EULA. Probably back when software still came in a box and they put the EULA in said box, and I was stuck on the toilet without any other reading materials.
      - silverquiet 2y ago
        I assume that every EULA basically says, “we can do whatever we want and there’s nothing you can do about it. Also, fuck you. Also, you’re ugly.”
      - account42 2y ago
chx 2y ago
> Microsoft has built up good will through efforts like VS Code That's the Trojan Horse https://ghuntley.com/fracture/ https://ghuntley.com/fracture/
- squarefoot 2y ago
  Don't forget WSL. Step 1: "Why do I need to run Linux? I already have it in Windows" Step 2: "Oh, and now this software runs better on WSL or requires WSL to work properly"
  - bsuvc 2y ago
    WSL seems like a variation of the Embrace, Extend, Extinguish tactic Microsoft has used in the past. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Embrace,_extend,_and_extinguish https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Embrace,_extend,_and_extingu...
  - chx 2y ago
    Win 10 + WSL is currently the only working desktop OS I am aware of. See https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40782058 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40782058
    - PawgerZ 2y ago
      Can you explain what you mean when you say that it's the "only working desktop OS I am aware of"
amluto 2y ago
Maybe write to the FTC? This is a privacy violation. It’s also arguably anticompetitive— they’re auto-enrolling you in an MS product you didn’t want to use, and this comes at the expense of either just local use or of any competing system. IMO this is also something that the US should shut down hard for a very different reason: every time anyone complains about a vendor, usually Chinese, misusing American data, the US is implicitly making a comparison to American vendors, which are supposedly better. But here’s MS being every bit as bad, if not worse. Foreign countries can, and should, stop using MS over this. Things like NDAA look pretty dumb in light of this behavior. The US’s technological dominance is somewhat at risk due to this crap.
- cyanydeez 2y ago
  Its probably worse. Theyre doing tbis to get people using copilot.
  - hparadiz 2y ago
    I've tried copilot and the code it generates is far worse than the free version ChatGPT. The idea that they want people to pay for it is frankly absurd.
  - Loxicon 2y ago
    Honest question, how is this related to CoPilot?
- ethagnawl 2y ago
  I'm sure anyone using Windows implicitly agreed to this "feature" via EULA but it sounds to me like data theft and something state attorneys general might want to start looking into. It stinks whichever way you approach it.
  - ranger_danger 2y ago
    EULA's are quite often unenforceable though, and it didn't save them from the IE browser monopoly in the EU.
Marvy_a 2y ago
I had this happen about a year ago. OneDrive changed the default path for the Documents folder to the one you mentioned above, but I only noticed it when I wasn't able to find some files in the Documents folder. It turned out that some files were being saved to the default path C:\Users\username\Documents. So I tried to move the Documents folder from the directory made by OneDrive back to the default one, but it gave me an error. Then I tried to fix it in the registry, but there were quite a lot of different entries for the default path, and I wasn't able to figure out which one I should change or remove. In the end, I had to reinstall Windows. Now each time I install Windows on any PC, the first thing I do is remove OneDrive. Unfortunately, this problem somehow happened again on my current Windows installation. Maybe I forgot to remove OneDrive this time, or it was automatically reinstalled during some update.
- Technetium 2y ago
  This problem CONSTANTLY haunts me and my customers. (1) Uninstall OneDrive (2) Reboot (3) Apply policy to block OneDrive reinstallation (linked below) (4) Attempt to change your folders with Explorer: right-click the library folder, then go to properties, Location, and choose Restore Default. If this fails, use Move. (5) Manually move any remaining files from c:\users\username\OneDrive (6) Open registry, manually edit the keys shown in the link (7) Delete leftover OneDrive folder (8) Reboot for completion! [3] https://techcommunity.microsoft.com/t5/onedrive/how-to-disable-onedrive-and-stop-it-from-coming-up-when-i-use/m-p/3948642 https://techcommunity.microsoft.com/t5/onedrive/how-to-disab... [6] https://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/forum/all/how-do-i-change-the-default-saving-location-of/04986f5c-c542-4ea9-bfd9-b8a238e76e2f https://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/forum/all/how-do...
jart 2y ago
It's not possible to reverse. Once you send information to an online service, you should assume it'll become public domain in only a matter of years. Digital information is permanent. Hacks happen. Crypto will be broken. Culture will change. Governments will most likely even pass laws requiring it. That's why tech wants this so bad they're willing to do what I thought only cyber criminals would do ten years ago.
- causal 2y ago
  Yeah you have to wonder how much data is just being stored for the sake of future tech making decryption trivial
ptdorf 2y ago
Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me.
yard2010 2y ago
Hahaha I love reading this because this is basically me. You try to do you. But Windows has other plans. When you get down to the bottom of it, although you don't even have time for that, it's always the same experience. You feel like someone shat upon your head intentionally. To the point I just became indifferent to all of this. I don't expect any good from it anyway and just click yes to all everytime. If it decide it should backup my computer without asking me - so be it. It is what it is. Remember the thread from the other day in which someone asked how many video encoders Facebook should release before we forgive them for all the crap throughout the years?
donmcronald 2y ago
Wait until step 2, which I experienced recently: > You're low on disk space. Storage Sense is freeing up space on your PC to help it run its best. Synced files that haven't been used recently will become cloud-only. All of my family and friends get tricked by tactics like this. None of my family wants to use OneDrive or the cloud storage from Google / Apple for photos, etc., but their data always ends up synced to these nasty services. How is it not considered predatory? Fine them a gazillion dollars and make the CEOs smash rocks with a children's hammer for the rest of their lives. Edit: And how is that a "backup"? They're moving my files to their servers eventually. That's not a backup. That's theft.
- theandrewbailey 2y ago
  One day, you try to login, and there's a message: "You've violated our terms of service and we've cancelled your account." You did nothing, and now it's all gone!
  - yard2010 2y ago
    I had this weird feeling but with my google account. It's a digital lifetime that can be just deleted (ofc, not hard delete but I still won't be able to access it) in an instant. Luckily, google gives you the option to get all your data. So I asked for a download using Google Takeout, and as you might guess it's well hidden and makes it really hard to use - the backups can take days to be ready and I couldn't download the 150gb result in the first 5 tries, so I had to start all over (that's just random plain evil, as I didn't download 10mb even in those poor tries). But once I got it I felt safer. At least I would be able to access my mail in such an event. Also, it's a really sobering experience. I went through the rabbi hole of checking every file and folder there. I wondered, what youtube video did I watch on 7.8.2014 at 3am? This left me feeling empty realizing they kept every fart I did in the last 20 years. I know it's like this and everybody does that, but skimming through the data made it real. Like you know texting and driving is dangerous but when you see someone loses his life to this shit.. It's different.
- _DeadFred_ 2y ago
  You have to report it to the FTC. The FTC only works when people give them reports to initiate investigations. https://reportfraud.ftc.gov/ https://reportfraud.ftc.gov/
wishfish 2y ago
I just discovered the OneDrive path last night. Bought a gaming laptop a couple of months ago. Only use it for gaming. No Office use or anything like that. Uninstalled OneDrive within the first hour of using it. Didn't notice paths for Documents et al were altered until last night when I was trying to fix a minor problem. Despite never agreeing to OneDrive and uninstalling it very shortly after the machine was turned on, all my paths to the preset folders are now \name\OneDrive\. Found ways to change it. Have no idea if I should. It's currently working and afaik OneDrive isn't slurping any data from it. There's no data to slurp other than savegames anyways. But it still left a bad taste. I think my laptop is well supported by the major distros. I already know my favorite games work on Linux thanks to my Steam Deck. Having a strong urge to just abandon Windows for good.
2muchcoffeeman 2y ago
I got everything off windows and only use it for games. It’s easily the worst OS experience out there. I wake up all the time and find my windows laptop stuck at the boot screen because I’m not using the on-brand power supply. My lid is shut, but windows ignores that, and it installs updates anyway. And then it asks you every time to sign in/up for MS bullshit. And the decline button is becoming harder to find.
atribecalledqst 2y ago
I realized too late that apparently the only way to get rid of the OneDrive directory structure is to manage the settings from within OneDrive itself! I'd already uninstalled it and removed, by hand, most of its folders. Now if I try to reinstall OneDrive, it doesn't open when I try to launch it! I think it just gets trashed by all the changes I've made. I guess I have to live with the OneDrive\Pictures and OneDrive\Documents folder forever, because they keep coming back when I delete them. (I am somewhat loathe to reinstall Windows because just getting it installed on this laptop was a huge PITA in the first place, and it was extremely annoying getting all the ads & crap uninstalled) e; actually wait, I may have been able to finish the job with the registry hack given here https://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/forum/all/how-do-i-move-the-location-of-the-pictures-folder/07de948f-7a8a-44d7-b0fb-d214b04b003d https://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/forum/all/how-do... Bless you Rodrigo. Bless you ee; this is another example of a phenomenon I see a LOT, which is that just complaining about something into the void is often a critical step to solving a problem.
monkeydreams 2y ago
I worked it out when the (actively) working on broke compilation after returning from my lunch break. If MS can't get OneDrive to work well with Visual Studio then what hope is there for true third-party products?
raxxorraxor 2y ago
This is one of the reasons why some people do not want to create an online account in the first place. I would recommend to only use Windows with a local account and without secure boot.

by suby 2y ago

tyleo 2y ago

This is almost my exact experience too.

sorry_outta_gas 2y ago
It's annoying but it's a smart move, once they get you to hit that low 5gb onedrive limit it's a easy path to get you on a office365 sub for the extra storage.

A4ET8a8uTh0 2y ago

<< It's hard to convey without coming off as unhinged. I almost wonder if this is by design. I genuinely had people look at me funny when I described relatively minor issues that eventually made me jump from Windows ( in my case I think it was dropping detailed descriptions from updates in Windows 7 ). I kept explaining that even the issues are not the actual issue. The issue is that I am unable to administer my machine as I see fit. I am not anti-tech, I tell people, but the tech has to work for me...

gear54rus 2y ago

Did you login with ms account? if so, why? I don't think it can upload if you aren't logged in.

lolinder 2y ago
> if so, why? Have you tried installing Windows 11 without signing in to a Microsoft account? It's very difficult to do and the instructions online keep having to change as Microsoft makes it more and more difficult. What I'm finding now [0] involves using a hotkey to open command prompt at a certain part of the installation process and running a command to disable the internet before you proceed. [0] https://www.tomshardware.com/how-to/install-windows-11-without-microsoft-account https://www.tomshardware.com/how-to/install-windows-11-witho...
- gear54rus 2y ago
  I guess mine just came pre-installed without that. But my point still stands, just don't interact with the crap and you're still somewhat safer.
  - lolinder 2y ago
    > just don't interact with the crap and you're still somewhat safer You're not wrong, but your initial comment made it sound like it was just a matter of not stepping in a single pile of dog poo. What Microsoft presents users with instead is an entire sewer with a great big EXIT sign pointing straight through the sewage. If you're in the know you can mutter a secret incantation and a ladder will drop down, allowing you to climb up onto a rickety catwalk with lots of warning signs telling you that you're going the wrong way. If you're brave enough to ignore the warning signs then eventually you'll get to the other side without touching the crap. Needless to say, most people follow the path that Microsoft designed for them and end up interacting with at least some of the crap.
  - gleenn 2y ago
    You are definitely right but I still feel like this is Stockholm syndrome, if they keep dark-patterning people more and more into logging in, it doesn't really make this a substantial improvement, they'll update they're way into tracking you and uploading your personal files somehow.

IanKerr 2y ago

I'm imagining this happening to someone on a highly metered connection and blowing through gigs of their limited monthly upload budget before realizing their OS has just gone rogue on them. Treating everyone like they have an unlimited bandwidth budget and greedily using it without permission is just awful behavior.

deleted 2y ago
[deleted]
cyanydeez 2y ago
All to sell daily users on copilot
ethagnawl 2y ago
Proton is an improvement for sure and worth being hopeful about but it takes effort to get/keep games working. I've probably spent 10 hours trying to make Cyberpunk 2077 work with varying levels of success. I finally caved and just started booting into Windows 11 to play -- the only time I ever use it.
ant6n 2y ago
Or somebody tethering abroad to do some quick online task, then needing to pay 500$ in roaming fees.

jchw 2y ago

> It's hard to convey without coming off as unhinged Man. I have felt this way a whole lot lately. I think some people see Linux users and genuinely can't fathom how or why they'd want to go through all of the trouble choosing to use Linux and doing real work on it. A lot of us look back just as puzzled, because when I switched to a Linux desktop for the first time in around 2004, it was definitely a choice, but it hasn't felt like a "choice" for a very long time.

pbhjpbhj 2y ago
Installing a mainstream distro on modern hardware (AMD graphics at least; I haven't tested Intel, Nvidia) is way easier and more relaxed than doing the same for Windows 11. Then installing apps, even with WingetUI it's far easier on Linux than trying to find and install apps on Windows... God help me, I hope Microsoft have learnt how to actually do window management this time to make all their crap worthwhile.
- Choco31415 2y ago
  I just installed Ubuntu on my self built computer with Nvidia GPU. It's working really well!
- slowmovintarget 2y ago
  Their crap is no longer worthwhile. Each move they make is extractive, not additive.
- causal 2y ago
  Unfortunately most users will never install their own OS. Until Linux breaks into consumer OEM Microsoft has nothing to worry about.
chx 2y ago
Yeah I ran Linux as my daily driver 2004-2017 and I regret it. Since then I run Windows 10 + WSL and life is good. Win10 support ends next year and I am at a complete loss at what to do. Linux desktop never worked, never will, the incentives are not there. It's only free if you don't value your time. As I wrote before , your choices are Ubuntu where an OS upgrade shatters your entire system so throughly it takes days to get back to a working system or you can go with Arch where Bluetooth/multifunction device/etc might break every so often. But at least most of the system remains standing. And if you need to connect to some funny enterprise wifi or VPN, the IT department of the client will have Mac and Windows support but Linux? X Windows doesn't get new features, Wayland is not ready, and the package manager landscape is just getting worse https://media.hachyderm.io/media_attachments/files/112/616/917/049/407/017/original/e212f045118a3f11.png https://media.hachyderm.io/media_attachments/files/112/616/9... Windows 11 is hot garbage. No other way to put it. Send help.

davisr 2y ago

Now you understand why Stallman was right. If you don't want to get shafted, the only way is to control 100% of the software running on your machine. One either does that with totally free/libre software, or they don't. No one can or should trust non-free software. Period.

tomrod 2y ago

Perhaps time for me to leave VS Code. I have suitable replacements for everything else MSoft. The plug-ins ecosystem is helpful, but what the heck!

cyanydeez 2y ago
Im surprised its. Not forked yet
- bsuvc 2y ago
  It's not a fork, but there is VSCodium https://github.com/VSCodium/vscodium https://github.com/VSCodium/vscodium
bsuvc 2y ago
If open source is not a requirement, Jetbrains IDEs are very good.

neither_color 2y ago

I don't like leaving negative or hyperbolic comments on HN, but this was enraging and unacceptable to me. It's hard to convey without coming off as unhinged You're not unhinged, there's been a fundamental change in internet culture and the early 2000s free internet people are considered loony now. Ive been laughed out of Discord groups(it's what the under 30s use these days instead of chats and forums, and is itself problematic) for talking about these things.

dontdoxxme 2y ago
I think it’s better to see it as not a shift in culture but understand that the internet represents all culture now. There are still under 30s that believe in real freedom but everyone is on the internet now, rather than a set of people that were more biased towards freedom (as that was partly what the internet represented).
- Multicomp 2y ago
  Agreed. I've had to start being more selective and going to places like Agora Road and the like just to find that subculture flavor once again. It turns out even the 2000s web 2.0 itself can have an Eternal September, who'd of thought?
bitcharmer 2y ago
I'm with you. They just don't know any better. Discord is a prime example of how complete garbage software can become dominant because modern day users set the bar really low.
thewebguyd 2y ago
This has been a struggle for me as I've gotten older - and I'm not even that old (36) but I've noticed such a big culture shift with the younger generations. I've been accused of holding "far right" views, or at best an overly paranoid nut, for some of my opinions on software and internet freedom, for promoting E2E encryption, and lamenting the loss of public forums to private, hidden from search, discord/Facebook groups, etc. To be honest, it's difficult to sit by and watch the enshittification of everything tech while seeing the younger crowd be totally OK with it, and in a lot of cases even defend it.

II2II 2y ago

> I understand Microsoft has built up good will through efforts like VS Code, but it's all undone because of things like this. Someone in Microsoft should look into who is making these decisions, why these decisions are are being made, and why they are being received so negatively. Then they need to address them. Even though I'm not much of a fan of Microsoft products, I get the impression that they have some excellent developers making excellent products that end up being undermined by business decisions. These are decisions that will probably end up undermining the business itself. We don't live in the 1990's anymore. Microsoft has plenty of competitors who are nibbling away at their edges.

jtriangle 2y ago
Oh, I mean, the "why" is pretty simple. They're going to enable onedrive upload by default, wait until the sync finishes, then change the EULA to allow them to scrape everyone's onedrive for machine learning data that they can then sell. >>Welcome to hell.
- marcosdumay 2y ago
  > change the EULA Have you read the Windows privacy policy any time in the last decade? They don't need to change anything.
  - jtriangle 2y ago
    I can't tell you the last time I read a EULA. Probably back when software still came in a box and they put the EULA in said box, and I was stuck on the toilet without any other reading materials.
    - silverquiet 2y ago
      I assume that every EULA basically says, “we can do whatever we want and there’s nothing you can do about it. Also, fuck you. Also, you’re ugly.”
    - account42 2y ago

chx 2y ago

> Microsoft has built up good will through efforts like VS Code That's the Trojan Horse https://ghuntley.com/fracture/ https://ghuntley.com/fracture/

squarefoot 2y ago
Don't forget WSL. Step 1: "Why do I need to run Linux? I already have it in Windows" Step 2: "Oh, and now this software runs better on WSL or requires WSL to work properly"
- bsuvc 2y ago
  WSL seems like a variation of the Embrace, Extend, Extinguish tactic Microsoft has used in the past. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Embrace,_extend,_and_extinguish https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Embrace,_extend,_and_extingu...
- chx 2y ago
  Win 10 + WSL is currently the only working desktop OS I am aware of. See https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40782058 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40782058
  - PawgerZ 2y ago
    Can you explain what you mean when you say that it's the "only working desktop OS I am aware of"

amluto 2y ago

Maybe write to the FTC? This is a privacy violation. It’s also arguably anticompetitive— they’re auto-enrolling you in an MS product you didn’t want to use, and this comes at the expense of either just local use or of any competing system. IMO this is also something that the US should shut down hard for a very different reason: every time anyone complains about a vendor, usually Chinese, misusing American data, the US is implicitly making a comparison to American vendors, which are supposedly better. But here’s MS being every bit as bad, if not worse. Foreign countries can, and should, stop using MS over this. Things like NDAA look pretty dumb in light of this behavior. The US’s technological dominance is somewhat at risk due to this crap.

cyanydeez 2y ago
Its probably worse. Theyre doing tbis to get people using copilot.
- hparadiz 2y ago
  I've tried copilot and the code it generates is far worse than the free version ChatGPT. The idea that they want people to pay for it is frankly absurd.
- Loxicon 2y ago
  Honest question, how is this related to CoPilot?
ethagnawl 2y ago
I'm sure anyone using Windows implicitly agreed to this "feature" via EULA but it sounds to me like data theft and something state attorneys general might want to start looking into. It stinks whichever way you approach it.
- ranger_danger 2y ago
  EULA's are quite often unenforceable though, and it didn't save them from the IE browser monopoly in the EU.

Marvy_a 2y ago

I had this happen about a year ago. OneDrive changed the default path for the Documents folder to the one you mentioned above, but I only noticed it when I wasn't able to find some files in the Documents folder. It turned out that some files were being saved to the default path C:\Users\username\Documents. So I tried to move the Documents folder from the directory made by OneDrive back to the default one, but it gave me an error. Then I tried to fix it in the registry, but there were quite a lot of different entries for the default path, and I wasn't able to figure out which one I should change or remove. In the end, I had to reinstall Windows. Now each time I install Windows on any PC, the first thing I do is remove OneDrive. Unfortunately, this problem somehow happened again on my current Windows installation. Maybe I forgot to remove OneDrive this time, or it was automatically reinstalled during some update.

Technetium 2y ago
This problem CONSTANTLY haunts me and my customers. (1) Uninstall OneDrive (2) Reboot (3) Apply policy to block OneDrive reinstallation (linked below) (4) Attempt to change your folders with Explorer: right-click the library folder, then go to properties, Location, and choose Restore Default. If this fails, use Move. (5) Manually move any remaining files from c:\users\username\OneDrive (6) Open registry, manually edit the keys shown in the link (7) Delete leftover OneDrive folder (8) Reboot for completion! [3] https://techcommunity.microsoft.com/t5/onedrive/how-to-disable-onedrive-and-stop-it-from-coming-up-when-i-use/m-p/3948642 https://techcommunity.microsoft.com/t5/onedrive/how-to-disab... [6] https://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/forum/all/how-do-i-change-the-default-saving-location-of/04986f5c-c542-4ea9-bfd9-b8a238e76e2f https://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/forum/all/how-do...

jart 2y ago

It's not possible to reverse. Once you send information to an online service, you should assume it'll become public domain in only a matter of years. Digital information is permanent. Hacks happen. Crypto will be broken. Culture will change. Governments will most likely even pass laws requiring it. That's why tech wants this so bad they're willing to do what I thought only cyber criminals would do ten years ago.

causal 2y ago
Yeah you have to wonder how much data is just being stored for the sake of future tech making decryption trivial

ptdorf 2y ago

Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me.

yard2010 2y ago

Hahaha I love reading this because this is basically me. You try to do you. But Windows has other plans. When you get down to the bottom of it, although you don't even have time for that, it's always the same experience. You feel like someone shat upon your head intentionally. To the point I just became indifferent to all of this. I don't expect any good from it anyway and just click yes to all everytime. If it decide it should backup my computer without asking me - so be it. It is what it is. Remember the thread from the other day in which someone asked how many video encoders Facebook should release before we forgive them for all the crap throughout the years?

donmcronald 2y ago

Wait until step 2, which I experienced recently: > You're low on disk space. Storage Sense is freeing up space on your PC to help it run its best. Synced files that haven't been used recently will become cloud-only. All of my family and friends get tricked by tactics like this. None of my family wants to use OneDrive or the cloud storage from Google / Apple for photos, etc., but their data always ends up synced to these nasty services. How is it not considered predatory? Fine them a gazillion dollars and make the CEOs smash rocks with a children's hammer for the rest of their lives. Edit: And how is that a "backup"? They're moving my files to their servers eventually. That's not a backup. That's theft.

theandrewbailey 2y ago
One day, you try to login, and there's a message: "You've violated our terms of service and we've cancelled your account." You did nothing, and now it's all gone!
- yard2010 2y ago
  I had this weird feeling but with my google account. It's a digital lifetime that can be just deleted (ofc, not hard delete but I still won't be able to access it) in an instant. Luckily, google gives you the option to get all your data. So I asked for a download using Google Takeout, and as you might guess it's well hidden and makes it really hard to use - the backups can take days to be ready and I couldn't download the 150gb result in the first 5 tries, so I had to start all over (that's just random plain evil, as I didn't download 10mb even in those poor tries). But once I got it I felt safer. At least I would be able to access my mail in such an event. Also, it's a really sobering experience. I went through the rabbi hole of checking every file and folder there. I wondered, what youtube video did I watch on 7.8.2014 at 3am? This left me feeling empty realizing they kept every fart I did in the last 20 years. I know it's like this and everybody does that, but skimming through the data made it real. Like you know texting and driving is dangerous but when you see someone loses his life to this shit.. It's different.
_DeadFred_ 2y ago
You have to report it to the FTC. The FTC only works when people give them reports to initiate investigations. https://reportfraud.ftc.gov/ https://reportfraud.ftc.gov/

wishfish 2y ago

I just discovered the OneDrive path last night. Bought a gaming laptop a couple of months ago. Only use it for gaming. No Office use or anything like that. Uninstalled OneDrive within the first hour of using it. Didn't notice paths for Documents et al were altered until last night when I was trying to fix a minor problem. Despite never agreeing to OneDrive and uninstalling it very shortly after the machine was turned on, all my paths to the preset folders are now \name\OneDrive\. Found ways to change it. Have no idea if I should. It's currently working and afaik OneDrive isn't slurping any data from it. There's no data to slurp other than savegames anyways. But it still left a bad taste. I think my laptop is well supported by the major distros. I already know my favorite games work on Linux thanks to my Steam Deck. Having a strong urge to just abandon Windows for good.

2muchcoffeeman 2y ago

I got everything off windows and only use it for games. It’s easily the worst OS experience out there. I wake up all the time and find my windows laptop stuck at the boot screen because I’m not using the on-brand power supply. My lid is shut, but windows ignores that, and it installs updates anyway. And then it asks you every time to sign in/up for MS bullshit. And the decline button is becoming harder to find.

atribecalledqst 2y ago

I realized too late that apparently the only way to get rid of the OneDrive directory structure is to manage the settings from within OneDrive itself! I'd already uninstalled it and removed, by hand, most of its folders. Now if I try to reinstall OneDrive, it doesn't open when I try to launch it! I think it just gets trashed by all the changes I've made. I guess I have to live with the OneDrive\Pictures and OneDrive\Documents folder forever, because they keep coming back when I delete them. (I am somewhat loathe to reinstall Windows because just getting it installed on this laptop was a huge PITA in the first place, and it was extremely annoying getting all the ads & crap uninstalled) e; actually wait, I may have been able to finish the job with the registry hack given here https://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/forum/all/how-do-i-move-the-location-of-the-pictures-folder/07de948f-7a8a-44d7-b0fb-d214b04b003d https://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/forum/all/how-do... Bless you Rodrigo. Bless you ee; this is another example of a phenomenon I see a LOT, which is that just complaining about something into the void is often a critical step to solving a problem.

monkeydreams 2y ago

I worked it out when the (actively) working on broke compilation after returning from my lunch break. If MS can't get OneDrive to work well with Visual Studio then what hope is there for true third-party products?

raxxorraxor 2y ago

This is one of the reasons why some people do not want to create an online account in the first place. I would recommend to only use Windows with a local account and without secure boot.