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Idk, you'd think there would come a point when enough people say he's a fraud that it gets through to his base. He's now a convicted felon, representing the pa

Idk, you'd think there would come a point when enough people say he's a fraud that it gets through to his base. He's now a convicted felon, representing the party of "law and order". That shouldn't end well.

newfriend 2y ago
[flagged]
- clipsy 2y ago
  Yes, people with a sliver of a brain do indeed think that.
- spartanatreyu 2y ago
  He signed the checks though.
- voisin 2y ago
  Care to elaborate for those of us who can’t fathom what you are referring to?
mc32 2y ago
Aren’t the charges misdemeanors?
- throwup238 2y ago
  All 34 charges are first degree felonies. Falsifying business records, up to four years per count, with a maximum sentence of 20 if served consecutively.
  - leereeves 2y ago
    They're class E felonies, the lowest class, with the lowest penalty. Jail time is rare. First-degree only refers to "falsifying business records in the first degree", which is otherwise a misdemeanor.
    - deleted 2y ago
      [deleted]
    - throwup238 2y ago
      > Jail time is rare. The number I've heard is 10% of such cases get jail time, but that includes plea deals which are themselves >90% of cases. It's a first time conviction but 34 charges with all the antics he's pulled? Who knows what happens.
  - lamontcg 2y ago
    There's actual sentencing guidelines that can be used to calculate what punishment he's more likely to see. It won't be 20 years.
    - throwup238 2y ago
      Sentencing guidelines are a Federal thing. New York doesn't have any except those laid out in the legal code (the 4/20 maximum I mentioned earlier). I doubt he'll do any actual prison time, but those are the maximums in NY.
- mikece 2y ago
  And past the statute of limitations unless they can be presented as felonies. Stand by for things to get very weird... I just hope they don’t get “kinetic.”
  - asdvlk34gl 2y ago
    [flagged]
ungreased0675 2y ago
Have you had a conversation about the trial with a Trump supporter?
- acdha 2y ago
  I think the more interesting question is how many of the people who aren’t ardent supporters will still vote for him. There are enough Republicans who didn’t like him but still wanted their party to win to shift an election which was already tight. This goes double for anyone who is not a complete diehard on the subject of abortion and might be asking themselves why they’re carrying water for a convicted felon, especially since they already got the tax cuts.
- lamontcg 2y ago
  Trump supporters aren't going to sway the election. They were always going to vote for him and will always vote for him. The election is going to get decided at the margins by the kind of people who can still get swayed one way or the other to vote or not vote for one or the other candidate. Actually convicting him can give a solid reason for someone who would have only very reluctantly voted for him to switch to Biden or just not vote at all. Old school Reagan conservatives who find that voting for an actual convicted felon is something they just won't do. It does create an additional nice red line of illegality, which should still matter to a few folks. It will cause some ethical problems with some Republicans for voting for him, and it really doesn't take much. The 2016 election was decided by a few 10,000s of people in 3-4 different states. Where it can backfire, though, is if the conviction is overturned on appeal.
  - friend_and_foe 2y ago
    I think you're missing a big factor here: both candidates have a track record as president. We haven't had that in a long time, often it's only the incumbent with a record, which we usually associate as in their favor. Part of that record, for both of them, isn't due to anything they did, but the times they ran things are associated with them. And of course part of it they're each responsible for. Despite all the rhetoric, Trump has a pretty good track record to the average american. Wars ending, dollar a gallon gas. In contrast, Biden doesn't look too good. Wars starting, groceries going up weekly. We can say what is who's fault and what is out of their control and whatever, that is just noise to all but decided voters. I think that this case will sway some away, sway some for that don't like what they see as political weaponization of the justice system, and all in all it stays in Trumps favor.
krapp 2y ago
His base thinks he's a victim of a conspiracy by the "deep state" to convict him on fraudulent charges by a kangaroo court. They don't for a second believe he's guilty of anything except being too much of a radical iconoclast for "the man" to handle. >inb4 flags.
voisin 2y ago
A significant number of people who told pollsters they were planning to vote for Trump said they would change their mind if he was convicted in court. The question is whether these voters are in swing states.
rsynnott 2y ago
I mean, I assume his base know he's a fraud. He has never made all that much of a secret of it. They just don't care. Like, approximately no-one, you'd assume, is, at this point, saying: "I'm voting for Trump, the noted honest legitimate businessman... wait, he was convicted of a CRIME? Well then I'm not voting for him." His voters know he's a crook.
- shrimp_emoji 2y ago
  Exactly. He's a protest vote against the establishment. All that just makes him a better protest.

newfriend 2y ago

[flagged]

clipsy 2y ago
Yes, people with a sliver of a brain do indeed think that.
spartanatreyu 2y ago
He signed the checks though.
voisin 2y ago
Care to elaborate for those of us who can’t fathom what you are referring to?

mc32 2y ago

Aren’t the charges misdemeanors?

throwup238 2y ago
All 34 charges are first degree felonies. Falsifying business records, up to four years per count, with a maximum sentence of 20 if served consecutively.
- leereeves 2y ago
  They're class E felonies, the lowest class, with the lowest penalty. Jail time is rare. First-degree only refers to "falsifying business records in the first degree", which is otherwise a misdemeanor.
  - deleted 2y ago
    [deleted]
  - throwup238 2y ago
    > Jail time is rare. The number I've heard is 10% of such cases get jail time, but that includes plea deals which are themselves >90% of cases. It's a first time conviction but 34 charges with all the antics he's pulled? Who knows what happens.
- lamontcg 2y ago
  There's actual sentencing guidelines that can be used to calculate what punishment he's more likely to see. It won't be 20 years.
  - throwup238 2y ago
    Sentencing guidelines are a Federal thing. New York doesn't have any except those laid out in the legal code (the 4/20 maximum I mentioned earlier). I doubt he'll do any actual prison time, but those are the maximums in NY.
mikece 2y ago
And past the statute of limitations unless they can be presented as felonies. Stand by for things to get very weird... I just hope they don’t get “kinetic.”
- asdvlk34gl 2y ago
  [flagged]

ungreased0675 2y ago

Have you had a conversation about the trial with a Trump supporter?

acdha 2y ago
I think the more interesting question is how many of the people who aren’t ardent supporters will still vote for him. There are enough Republicans who didn’t like him but still wanted their party to win to shift an election which was already tight. This goes double for anyone who is not a complete diehard on the subject of abortion and might be asking themselves why they’re carrying water for a convicted felon, especially since they already got the tax cuts.
lamontcg 2y ago
Trump supporters aren't going to sway the election. They were always going to vote for him and will always vote for him. The election is going to get decided at the margins by the kind of people who can still get swayed one way or the other to vote or not vote for one or the other candidate. Actually convicting him can give a solid reason for someone who would have only very reluctantly voted for him to switch to Biden or just not vote at all. Old school Reagan conservatives who find that voting for an actual convicted felon is something they just won't do. It does create an additional nice red line of illegality, which should still matter to a few folks. It will cause some ethical problems with some Republicans for voting for him, and it really doesn't take much. The 2016 election was decided by a few 10,000s of people in 3-4 different states. Where it can backfire, though, is if the conviction is overturned on appeal.
- friend_and_foe 2y ago
  I think you're missing a big factor here: both candidates have a track record as president. We haven't had that in a long time, often it's only the incumbent with a record, which we usually associate as in their favor. Part of that record, for both of them, isn't due to anything they did, but the times they ran things are associated with them. And of course part of it they're each responsible for. Despite all the rhetoric, Trump has a pretty good track record to the average american. Wars ending, dollar a gallon gas. In contrast, Biden doesn't look too good. Wars starting, groceries going up weekly. We can say what is who's fault and what is out of their control and whatever, that is just noise to all but decided voters. I think that this case will sway some away, sway some for that don't like what they see as political weaponization of the justice system, and all in all it stays in Trumps favor.

krapp 2y ago

His base thinks he's a victim of a conspiracy by the "deep state" to convict him on fraudulent charges by a kangaroo court. They don't for a second believe he's guilty of anything except being too much of a radical iconoclast for "the man" to handle. >inb4 flags.

voisin 2y ago

A significant number of people who told pollsters they were planning to vote for Trump said they would change their mind if he was convicted in court. The question is whether these voters are in swing states.

rsynnott 2y ago

I mean, I assume his base know he's a fraud. He has never made all that much of a secret of it. They just don't care. Like, approximately no-one, you'd assume, is, at this point, saying: "I'm voting for Trump, the noted honest legitimate businessman... wait, he was convicted of a CRIME? Well then I'm not voting for him." His voters know he's a crook.

shrimp_emoji 2y ago
Exactly. He's a protest vote against the establishment. All that just makes him a better protest.