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Apple signs deal with OpenAI for iOS, still wants Google as an 'option'
- whimsicalism 2y agoI doubt Google and Apple have the relationship of trust such that they could actually sell Apple an API that would be used to power a core iOS service.
- SOLAR_FIELDS 2y agoThe article rightfully points out that Apple had Google Maps for several years on the device before launching their own maps service. I suspect that it will be treated more like search and not have the deep integrations with core API’s that their own eventual Ai offering will have. And of course when they do launch their own AI offering integration with the core API’s will probably be one of the big differentiators
- thejazzman 2y agoThat was before Steve declared war on Android. Not sure it matters anymore, though.
- whimsicalism 2y agoI presume this is about a contract around something deeper than simply having another app, otherwise they could just build the app - no contract involved. I think that Google & Apple's trust relationship has broken down post-Google Maps.
- talldayo 2y ago> I think that Google & Apple's trust relationship has broken down post-Google Maps. I think Apple's "trust" can be bought by a big enough customer, and Apple's continued interaction with Google's privacy-destroying search engine seems to demonstrate that nicely.
- detourdog 2y agoI think it will be like middle-ware one choices their model by radio button. Apple may have a default model that they manage but a user could switch to various models based on whim.
- paxys 2y agoYou mean like search?
- throwaway5959 2y agoIf the models are running on-device, once the model files are delivered then it really doesn't matter what Google would do.
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- scubadude 2y agoI guess unfortunately Apple has no choice but to include bullshit AI in it's products and services or look like they have been left behind.
- Auracle 2y agoI don’t think Siri but as an LLM would be “bullshit.” It’d be an absolutely immense upgrade.
- dagmx 2y agoHallucinations would be terrible for brand appeal beyond being limited. Nobody has solved that problem yet. Just take a look at Google’s latest search results giving actively harmful information.
- threatofrain 2y agoI suspect that current ML tech is good enough to constitute a big discrete step forward in terms of how much value Siri is providing as a digital assistant that's also in charge of your home. If that's the case, there's more harm in being reputed as the company that is one serious step behind in a space that isn't yet settled vs facing the same level of gaffs that Google and Microsoft are putting out. Just look at Microsoft right now. They're experiencing all the heat that OpenAI brings, including unforced errors like Sky. Reputationally speaking, are they better or worse off having made such an early push for LLM product integration?
- dagmx 2y agoI would argue that Microsoft do not have the same brand that Apple does. So they’re much more free to pursue OpenAI partnerships regardless of how well it works. I don’t mean brand as in purely recognition, but what it means to people. Apple are held to a higher standard because of the specific identity they’ve cultivated. (Arguing the specifics of whether that’s deserved or not will be its own essay so I’m leaving that out) You see this all the time on HN or Reddit, where any negative subject about Apple gains significantly more traction than other companies. Meanwhile Microsoft has an identify that is more “meh”. Users expect Microsoft products to not have the polish, to have ads and be weird/quirky. Microsoft did Windows phone and the zune, Apple did the iPhone and the iPod. Does that mean one companies products are better or worse? Maybe? Maybe not. But it does mean that the brand appeal of every company has different characteristics that need to be accounted for. Siri giving bad answers is much worse perceptually than Cortana/Bing giving the same answers. It also means Microsoft is more free to experiment and do things that are half baked because their brand identity allows for that. Often that leads to really interesting use cases ahead of its time. I’d also add that Apple being “behind the curve” perceptually has rarely been an issue. The brand is that they enter late and redefine the segment. Again, not always deserved, but that’s the association. They often ride out trends that way.
- ksec 2y agoIt is very typical Apple that wants to play Google against OpenAI to their full advantage. All while buying themselves time to work on their own. I just wish Microsoft could get their act together on their OS and release a Surface Phone
- ARandomerDude 2y agoAh yes, just what we’ve all been craving: even more Microsoft.
- matwood 2y agoYeah, interesting world where people are wanting MS to make a phone...again.
- peebeebee 2y agoThe Lumia phones were great. The first iterations of the OS tried to integrate 3rd party services deeply into the OS. (News, Social, Mail, Calendar aggregations) But the service-providers did not like that because: no advertising possibilities. Then they had to shift towards apps, but at that time they were way too late. If ARM matures, I could see a new Windows Phone.
- ruraljuror 2y agoAt first I laughed with your astute comment, then remembered Apple and its customers will now be paying (transitively) Microsoft to put this feature on phones. I still agree with the point, but Microsoft has done such an amazing job of evolving and staying relevant.
- nolongerthere 2y ago> I just wish Microsoft could get their act together on their OS and release a Surface Phone MS has given up on mobile as a OS or device category. In fact I’d argue MS has given up on the entire OS sector, as a revenue stream Windows is increasingly less relevant to their bottom line. They only see windows as a way to bring other applications (read: advertising) to their users but not as a means unto itself. Ask yourself, what new OS features has ms released since windows 10 that is more than UI changes, or applications that aren’t really a core part of the OS? Adding dark mode or tabs to notepad are not real features that anyone needs. The truth is that the OS has gotten so complicated and it’s nearly impossible to find competent talent that is excited about OS design and development so it’s barely possible to just keep the OS up to date with the latest hardware, there’s simply no time or effort available for new development.
- ChrisArchitect 2y agoRelated from weeks ago: Apple finalizing deal with OpenAI to bring ChatGPT features to iOS 18 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40325876 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40325876 Apple Will Revamp Siri to Catch Up to Its Chatbot Competitors https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40322104 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40322104
- hulitu 2y ago[flagged]
- theolivenbaum 2y agoLet me guess, Apple is having to pay OpenAI for this, and they want Google to pay them for it instead
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- nadsaeae 2y agoWhat does this mean for Apple’s product positioning on privacy?
- aurareturn 2y agoProbably OpenAI giving the whole direct model(s) to Apple like how you could download LLAMA3 locally. It'd be up to Apple to build the infrastructure to run it at scale for their billions of devices.
- m463 2y agoIt seems to be to use the data without asking, but rubber stamp it by saying data is anonymized in the privacy policy.
- lrvick 2y agoThey just simply keep repeating that they care about privacy and people will continue to believe it as long as the product UX is good.
- cqqxo4zV46cp 2y agoHow hasn’t Apple lived up to your expectations? Please stop flooding this thread with these empty comments.
- dc_ist 2y agoIt’ll be interesting to see how Apple markets this at WWDC. Will they explicitly say that OpenAI is powering this functionality?
- detourdog 2y agoIt might be a radio button feature. Click the model you want to use.
- dzhiurgis 2y agoIs there going to be an option to use other model with same level integration or is it as anti-competitive as usual?
- cqqxo4zV46cp 2y agoNot allowing for whatever customisation any particular nerd wants is not ‘anti-competitive’. Have you ever actually written software for public consumption? If some HN user told me that me not allowing them to swap out a dependency is anti-competitive I’d be quite within my rights to call them psychotic.
- dzhiurgis 2y agoWhat dependency? Please tell me the technical reasons why it can't be replaced with any other assistant. EU has been chasing Siri, among other "inseparatable" features, for years.
- talldayo 2y ago> Not allowing for whatever customisation any particular nerd wants is not ‘anti-competitive’. This is plainly wrong. It's not inherently anticompetitive to set limits, it is anticompetitive to break those limits to promote your own product. It's quite literally one of the only formative moments of the internet, where Microsoft was rightfully sued (and nearly broken-up) for artificially blocking Netscape's market access. Today, Apple is headed down pretty much the exact same road. I've heard apologetics insist that Tim Cook is an angel for years now, but both me and the regulatory bodies remain unconvinced. The long fall begins now, if you're an Apple customer it would be wise to plan accordingly. > I’d be quite within my rights to call them psychotic. You'd look like an idiot doing so, but sure you're well "within your right" to look that way. If you call someone else psychotic for paying attention to monopoly practices and wanting to make change that doesn't impact you whatsoever, then it's probably you experiencing psychosis.
- nmeagent 2y agoThere had better be an option to disable any and all LLM tendrils in iOS or I'm going to probably end up throwing my iPhone into a lake. Call me a luddite or neo-amish or whatever, but IMO the entire feature set is cursed and I want nothing to do with it.
- m463 2y agoYou want a local LLM. honestly, I hope regulation allows sideloading and alternative apps sometime soon. We need to firewall our devices from the accelerating pace of data snarfing.
- lrvick 2y agoNo amount of regulation will ever get a corporate owned device to act in your best interests. It is a very very slow game of legal Whack A Mole and Apple has enough money to buy the best lawyers and politicians.
- cqqxo4zV46cp 2y agoThis is a pretty strongly worded lecture when you’re talking about something that hasn’t even happened yet.
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- eviks 2y agoNo, I want a way to remove any LLM. Though this is as likely add your regulation hope
- doublerabbit 2y agoIt's why my iPhone is jailbroken so I can install a firewall. However I now stuck on 14 with no app support or upgrade to 17 and loose jailbreak and firewall. I missed the iOS 15 signing window.
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- mensetmanusman 2y agoMe:”siri, how many Beatle’s songs are there?” Siri:”here are the titles of 5 songs I found”