4 ms·

I highly doubt they'd be criminal indictments. Boeing is USA's baby, can't have them losing against European Airbus, or God forbid, Chinese Comac. Reminds me o

I highly doubt they'd be criminal indictments. Boeing is USA's baby, can't have them losing against European Airbus, or God forbid, Chinese Comac. Reminds me of when FAA didn't ground the Boeing, despite the fatal crashes because of that association. Instead, it was Chinese aviation authority that did, which forced every other airline to follow suit. Most likely a fine, round up a few line workers to take the heat, a manager or two, then call it a day.

ars 2y ago
I agree with your premise but your first sentence contradicts your last one. I think there will be criminal indictments, but the punishment will be monetary and will not damage the company long term. It would be really hard to put anyone in jail anyway, there's too much diluted responsibility.
amelius 2y ago
Because the EU never started a (criminal) lawsuit against a US company?
- ai_what 2y ago
  In this hypothetical situation, would the US would be extraditing American Boeing executives to Europe? I think you're overestimating Europe here.
  - niemandhier 2y ago
    We have a mutual extradition treaty, and since the us frequently desires the extradition of high profile cases it’s not impossible that his could happen. The biggest problem would be the absence of an European criminal law pertaining to companies. https://eur-lex.europa.eu/EN/legal-content/summary/agreement-with-the-united-states-on-extradition.html https://eur-lex.europa.eu/EN/legal-content/summary/agreement...
BlackFly 2y ago
If they need a head on a pike to get the rest of the world to trust them enough again to keep competing with Airbus then maybe they will find that rule of law still makes sense.
- JKCalhoun 2y ago
  So if members of the C-suite seeing jail time is what is best for the company going forward — surely they will line up and fall on the sword.
  - ceejayoz 2y ago
    The Cult of Shareholder Value, oddly, stops just prior to that point.
dragonwriter 2y ago
> I highly doubt they'd be criminal indictments. This is a reference to an existing criminal indictment, for which Boeing entered into a deferred prosecution agreement in which they paid $2.5 billion in penalties and compensation and accepted various behavioral commitments, which DoJ is now saying they have breached, allowing prosecution to be recommenced. So, no, your prediction is wrong, it is a criminal indictment.
- sidewndr46 2y ago
  It is kind of amazing that a corporation can get a deferred prosecution agreement based on a monetary penalty. If I had killed someone, would I be allowed to buy my freedom?
  - kevin_thibedeau 2y ago
    If that someone was a law abiding bicyclist or pedestrian you can expect only a wrist slap.
  - it_citizen 2y ago
    You can do the next best thing. Get a very expensive defense team. There are too many instances of people who bought their freedom that way.
  - 0x445442 2y ago
    I’m going to make a wild guess that those convicted of murder is disproportionately inversely correlated with net worth, so in a sense, yes you can.
  - aeonik 2y ago
    You can get plea bargains, and judges absolutely have discretion to put individuals on probation in lieu of criminal prosecution, if there is reason. But those have their own separate issues, of course.
  - ceejayoz 2y ago
    > If I had killed someone, would I be allowed to buy my freedom? You mean like https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dream_Team_(law) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dream_Team_(law) ?
Havoc 2y ago
Plus major defence contractor. Doesn’t matter how many they kill with their negligence it’ll just be a slap on wrist

ars 2y ago

I agree with your premise but your first sentence contradicts your last one. I think there will be criminal indictments, but the punishment will be monetary and will not damage the company long term. It would be really hard to put anyone in jail anyway, there's too much diluted responsibility.

amelius 2y ago

Because the EU never started a (criminal) lawsuit against a US company?

ai_what 2y ago
In this hypothetical situation, would the US would be extraditing American Boeing executives to Europe? I think you're overestimating Europe here.
- niemandhier 2y ago
  We have a mutual extradition treaty, and since the us frequently desires the extradition of high profile cases it’s not impossible that his could happen. The biggest problem would be the absence of an European criminal law pertaining to companies. https://eur-lex.europa.eu/EN/legal-content/summary/agreement-with-the-united-states-on-extradition.html https://eur-lex.europa.eu/EN/legal-content/summary/agreement...

BlackFly 2y ago

If they need a head on a pike to get the rest of the world to trust them enough again to keep competing with Airbus then maybe they will find that rule of law still makes sense.

JKCalhoun 2y ago
So if members of the C-suite seeing jail time is what is best for the company going forward — surely they will line up and fall on the sword.
- ceejayoz 2y ago
  The Cult of Shareholder Value, oddly, stops just prior to that point.

dragonwriter 2y ago

> I highly doubt they'd be criminal indictments. This is a reference to an existing criminal indictment, for which Boeing entered into a deferred prosecution agreement in which they paid $2.5 billion in penalties and compensation and accepted various behavioral commitments, which DoJ is now saying they have breached, allowing prosecution to be recommenced. So, no, your prediction is wrong, it is a criminal indictment.

sidewndr46 2y ago
It is kind of amazing that a corporation can get a deferred prosecution agreement based on a monetary penalty. If I had killed someone, would I be allowed to buy my freedom?
- kevin_thibedeau 2y ago
  If that someone was a law abiding bicyclist or pedestrian you can expect only a wrist slap.
- it_citizen 2y ago
  You can do the next best thing. Get a very expensive defense team. There are too many instances of people who bought their freedom that way.
- 0x445442 2y ago
  I’m going to make a wild guess that those convicted of murder is disproportionately inversely correlated with net worth, so in a sense, yes you can.
- aeonik 2y ago
  You can get plea bargains, and judges absolutely have discretion to put individuals on probation in lieu of criminal prosecution, if there is reason. But those have their own separate issues, of course.
- ceejayoz 2y ago
  > If I had killed someone, would I be allowed to buy my freedom? You mean like https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dream_Team_(law) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dream_Team_(law) ?

Havoc 2y ago

Plus major defence contractor. Doesn’t matter how many they kill with their negligence it’ll just be a slap on wrist