4 ms·

They were also in talks with Gemini lately: https://9to5google.com/2024/05/10/google-apple-gemini-discussions-report/ https://9to5google.com/2024/05/10/google-a

They were also in talks with Gemini lately: https://9to5google.com/2024/05/10/google-apple-gemini-discussions-report/ https://9to5google.com/2024/05/10/google-apple-gemini-discus... I find it a bit weird that Apple with its massive market share and RnD budget apparently wasn‘t able to get a team and traction (or at least any significant acquisitions or acquihires) on AI with the writing being on the wall since quite some time now. Makes me a bit worried about their privacy angle and that it might disappear.

londons_explore 2y ago
Their privacy angle is 100% the reason they haven't managed to make a decent LLM. To make a decent LLM you need to ignore data protection and throw all available text into a huge model. If your morals don't let you do that, then you can't make your own LLM.
- gumby271 2y ago
  But you can partner with a 3rd party to submit all that text to, and pretend your still privacy conscience? Pretty sure people would rather Apple build a first party server based option than partner with anyone else. When it's Apple violating privacy people are more chill about it.
  - timr 2y ago
    Or you get the model and host it on your own hardware. The sort of thing an Apple might be able to do.
- dns_snek 2y ago
  > If your morals don't let you do that, then you can't make your own LLM. You're reaching, a lot. Apple is more privacy-friendly than most companies at the moment - no argument there, but they still sell your privacy on the web to Google in exchange for a 36% cut of advertising revenue [1] which amounts to ~$20 billion [2], or a rather petty amount of ~$10/device [3]. These same "morals" also allow them to hand over data on all Chinese citizens to the CCP, among countless other privacy-destroying compromises they have to make in order to profit from the Chinese market [4] [1] https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2023/11/google-witness-accidentally-blurts-out-that-apple-gets-36-cut-of-safari-deal/ https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2023/11/google-witness-a... [2] https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2024-05-01/google-s-payments-to-apple-reached-20-billion-in-2022-cue-says https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2024-05-01/google-s-... (https://archive.is/oPg1C https://archive.is/oPg1C) [3] https://www.theverge.com/2023/2/2/23583501/apple-iphone-ipad-active-2-billion-devices-q1-2023 https://www.theverge.com/2023/2/2/23583501/apple-iphone-ipad... [4] https://www.nytimes.com/2021/05/17/technology/apple-china-censorship-data.html https://www.nytimes.com/2021/05/17/technology/apple-china-ce... (https://archive.is/MQmY7 https://archive.is/MQmY7)
londons_explore 2y ago
Apple is probably big enough that they would be trusted to take the weights and run them on apple hardware under license.
- free_bip 2y ago
  That will 100% lead to the weights getting leaked, I doubt OpenAI would risk that
bastawhiz 2y ago
> its massive market share and RnD budget apparently wasn‘t able to get a team and traction Frankly I don't want Apple to try to be the best at everything, because they generally aren't. I've been bitten by iMovie getting worse, Time Machine doing a terrible job, Apple Maps being less than useful for a long time, iCloud being generally lackluster, and more. I'd much rather they outsource the service to a company that is solely focused on the task. There's no reason they couldn't ensure those services remain private or secure.

londons_explore 2y ago

Their privacy angle is 100% the reason they haven't managed to make a decent LLM. To make a decent LLM you need to ignore data protection and throw all available text into a huge model. If your morals don't let you do that, then you can't make your own LLM.

gumby271 2y ago
But you can partner with a 3rd party to submit all that text to, and pretend your still privacy conscience? Pretty sure people would rather Apple build a first party server based option than partner with anyone else. When it's Apple violating privacy people are more chill about it.
- timr 2y ago
  Or you get the model and host it on your own hardware. The sort of thing an Apple might be able to do.
dns_snek 2y ago
> If your morals don't let you do that, then you can't make your own LLM. You're reaching, a lot. Apple is more privacy-friendly than most companies at the moment - no argument there, but they still sell your privacy on the web to Google in exchange for a 36% cut of advertising revenue [1] which amounts to ~$20 billion [2], or a rather petty amount of ~$10/device [3]. These same "morals" also allow them to hand over data on all Chinese citizens to the CCP, among countless other privacy-destroying compromises they have to make in order to profit from the Chinese market [4] [1] https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2023/11/google-witness-accidentally-blurts-out-that-apple-gets-36-cut-of-safari-deal/ https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2023/11/google-witness-a... [2] https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2024-05-01/google-s-payments-to-apple-reached-20-billion-in-2022-cue-says https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2024-05-01/google-s-... (https://archive.is/oPg1C https://archive.is/oPg1C) [3] https://www.theverge.com/2023/2/2/23583501/apple-iphone-ipad-active-2-billion-devices-q1-2023 https://www.theverge.com/2023/2/2/23583501/apple-iphone-ipad... [4] https://www.nytimes.com/2021/05/17/technology/apple-china-censorship-data.html https://www.nytimes.com/2021/05/17/technology/apple-china-ce... (https://archive.is/MQmY7 https://archive.is/MQmY7)

londons_explore 2y ago

Apple is probably big enough that they would be trusted to take the weights and run them on apple hardware under license.

free_bip 2y ago
That will 100% lead to the weights getting leaked, I doubt OpenAI would risk that

bastawhiz 2y ago

> its massive market share and RnD budget apparently wasn‘t able to get a team and traction Frankly I don't want Apple to try to be the best at everything, because they generally aren't. I've been bitten by iMovie getting worse, Time Machine doing a terrible job, Apple Maps being less than useful for a long time, iCloud being generally lackluster, and more. I'd much rather they outsource the service to a company that is solely focused on the task. There's no reason they couldn't ensure those services remain private or secure.