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Multiple Planes Cross Runway While Another Is Taking Off [video]
- droopyEyelids 3y agoHave the frequency of atc mistakes been increasing or do i just see it more now
- kevin_nisbet 3y agoI have the same question in my mind... seems like there is one of these reported every month or two and it's just asking for a more serious mistake to be made.
- dave78 3y agoI don't know the answer, but there has definitely been a proliferation of YouTube channels that feature every single aviation anomaly. So, I suspect that it's at least somewhat the fact that a lot more attention is being called to these incidents than would have been in the recent past.
- MadnessASAP 3y agoThey are not increasing to the best of my knowledge. Recent events in aviation (Boeing, the accident in Japan) have resulted in more eyes, interest, and reporting of the going ons in aviation however. Which of course results in the casual observer being made aware of happenings that may have otherwise flown (punny) under their radar. For those curious I like to recommend the excellent avherald.com whose owner catalogs flight safety reports from around the world.
- jessriedel 3y agoGiven that the rate of aircraft crashes is falling, and many of the remaining crashes are due mechanical issues like the 373 Max, I am inclined to think it’s a monitoring issue.
- wannacboatmovie 3y agoVideo title is clickbait. Stuff like this happens every day, you just never hear about it. The amount of traffic at these large airports is insane. Professional pilots handled it...professionally. When was the last time you saw someone run a red light on the road? Mine was ... yesterday. The bigger discussion here is why we will continue to see humans in charge of aircraft (vs AI).
- tmaly 3y agoGiven the reporting requirements, how sure are you that these incidents happy every day?
- deleted 3y ago[deleted]
- wannacboatmovie 3y agoWell the last time it happened - and widely enough reported that the Aviation Herald picked up on it - was two days ago. I'm not playing the pedantic Hacker News game. https://avherald.com/h?article=51791758&opt=0 https://avherald.com/h?article=51791758&opt=0
- squigz 3y agoRunway incursions happen with extreme regularity, if perhaps not every day. > Please respond to the strongest plausible interpretation of what someone says, not a weaker one that's easier to criticize. Assume good faith. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
- SoftTalker 3y agoUnauthorized crossing or mistaken clearance to cross an active runway is definitely a big deal. It's a reportable incident, that will be investigated, not something that "happens every day." It's something that could result in the loss of hundreds of lives, not to mention the loss of the aircraft and closure of the airport while they clean up and investigate.
- 3y ago
- apetresc 3y agoI know this isn't causing this particular incident, but what is it with the completely un-understandable speech cadence/articulation of virtually every ATC/pilot I've ever heard? Considering that they're already talking over very lossy radio channels and communicating life-or-death information, you'd think they would all be going out of their way to speak very clearly, enunciate slowly, etc. Instead, these conversations are completely unintelligible, presumably why videos like these require subtitles. It's not because of the jargon, it all makes sense when I see it spelled out. It's just the way they're slurring and mumbling everything. The very first sentence in the video (at ~0:26) when he's saying "Delta 29 Heavy", I cannot for the life of me make out a "nine" in there. It sounds like "twanna heavy". Just picking on this example because it happens to be the very first syllables in the video, but they're all like that. If I gave these audio clips to a completely native English speaker they would probably be able to accurately transcribe about 15% of it. How do more mistakes not happen in ATC? Why does everyone insist in talking this way? I'm asking non-ironically.
- aaronmdjones 3y agoIt sounds a lot better in the tower and cockpit. Much better receiving equipment, much closer proximity. The tower doesn't broadcast at high power because it doesn't need to. These ATC recordings are only available for us to listen to because someone volunteered to record and upload them; that someone probably doesn't live in the airport. That said I still made out Delta 29 Heavy just fine. Maybe it's years of listening to these recordings. Edit: Notice how the plane inbound and 4 miles out sounded a lot better? They were probably a lot closer to the person recording. That's how it should sound.
- squigz 3y ago> It sounds a lot better in the tower and cockpit. Much better receiving equipment, much closer proximity. The tower doesn't broadcast at high power because it doesn't need to. These ATC recordings are only available for us to listen to because someone volunteered to record and upload them; that someone probably doesn't live in the airport. This is the main reason, but it's important to note (as others have) that you simply get used to imperfect radio signals - go listen to the VATSIM community, and even some of those can be relatively difficult for a layman to parse. But you quickly get used to it, and it becomes second-nature to pull out the relevant bits of a callout without much thinking, based on what calls you expect at any given point in the takeoff/landing/flight
- amluto 3y agoI wonder why airports don’t have actual signal lights or the equivalent. Train tracks have them, and there are fairly strict interlocks to prevent multiple conflicting uses of the same track segment at the same time.
- nunodonato 3y agoThey do. Towers can use light flashes to transmit a set of different messages both to ground and incoming planes
- crote 3y agoCost. Some airports already have "stop bar" lights (green to enter runway, red to stop), or "follow-me" lights (follow the trail of green dots to your destination). But these aren't exactly cheap (nothing in aviation is), and installing them requires shutting down runways. They'll probably become more common at larger airports over the next decade or so.
- diebeforei485 3y agoA lot of airports do have stop bar lights at the entrance to runways, and some have even installed "follow the greens" systems. They're not common in the US though. The issue here is we had two separate controllers giving clearances to the same runway at the same time. One told an aircraft to take off while another told multiple aircraft to cross. Might better technology have prevented this incident? Maybe. It would have been obvious that the runway is in use, so the aircraft crossing would likely have asked the controller to confirm instead of trusting the controller.
- deanresin 3y agoIf I was a pilot on one of those planes I would immediately get off the runway because clearly the air controllers are confused/incompetent. They can tow the plane back.
- ydnaclementine 3y agoCan anyone recommend a good primer on ATC jargon? Or maybe a good ATC game that would expose you to some of it?