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Same story in Australia, 16 year old boy killed himself, different two men in Lagos https://www.bbc.com/news/world-australia-68720247 https://www.bbc.com/news/

Same story in Australia, 16 year old boy killed himself, different two men in Lagos https://www.bbc.com/news/world-australia-68720247 https://www.bbc.com/news/world-australia-68720247 I'm not real confident this is solvable with law enforcement in a world where the police press release is - "located in a slum in Nigeria with a population of 25 million people"

colechristensen 3y ago
Sure it is. If a country can’t find and enforce a law or extradite someone for doing such a thing, order the carrier of the extortion messages to block the entire country or charge the message carrier itself, especially if minors are involved. Like if Facebook is being a safe haven for Nigerian extortionists, either they block Nigeria or Australia blocks Facebook.
- thrownaway561 3y ago
  if they do that they will just use VPNs. you can't stop this no matter what, you just have to educate people and hope they don't fall victim.
  - djaouen 3y ago
    Sanction VPNs that allow this behavior. Force them to use botnets, which means they have to interact with other criminals. :)
  - colechristensen 3y ago
    Then blackhole the VPNs when they're involved in crime and make them share legal financial responsibility for the crimes they enable. Eventually you keep walking down this line until you write laws that local ISPs are required to globally blackhole countries which otherwise evade law enforcement.
    - orwin 3y ago
      I can make a VPN for like 3 euro on AWS (thinking about it, I can probably do it with their free tier offer). I could probably do the same for a bit more work and study on most PaaS.
      - hsbauauvhabzb 3y ago
        Block aws ranges then, Facebook is for residential users. Residential VPNs exist, but they cost money and increase the barrier for entry, while also being a choke point for abuse.
  - bikemore 3y ago
    "Don't bother enforcing laws because people try to break them" is an express ticket to a Mad Max world. It's also not a particularly interesting or practical solution, and honestly comes off as a little disingenuous.
  - BlackFly 3y ago
    I'm going to go out on a limb and suggest that a teenager that is willing to invest time into setting up a VPN so that they can talk to Nigerians probably isn't the sort of teenager to have this kind of problem. We let people fly to countries without extradition orders. VPNs can be seen just like that: crossing the digital border. But for a company operating in a nation, it makes sense to impose regulation.
    - Mordisquitos 3y ago
      I'm going out on a different limb and suggest that a scammer that is unable to invest time into setting up a VPN so that they can talk to teenagers outside of Nigeria probably isn't the sort of scammer that causes this kind of problem.
- thfuran 3y ago
  What you're describing is the end of the internet.
  - colechristensen 3y ago
    It's really not. Facebook making money off of illegal activity conveniently hidden behind national borders is not the cornerstone of the Internet.
    - thfuran 3y ago
      You think that argument stops at Facebook? Why won't it apply to the VPNs people use to get around the geofencing on Facebook, to all the other social media platforms, to all messaging services, and so on? Now you've blocked huge swaths of services and fragmented all the platforms.
      - ben_w 3y ago
        I think, if The Hitchhikers Guide to the Galaxy was remade today, the quote would be: "…an utterly insignificant little blue green planet whose ape-descended life forms are so amazingly primitive that they still think social media is a pretty neat idea."
    - Ekaros 3y ago
      So then ban Facebook. Problem solved. Start advocating this in congress now.
  - CJefferson 3y ago
    Honestly, maybe it’s time to consider that. Saying “oh well, let’s give up on laws because the internet is worldwide and unlimited” doesn’t feel like a good choice to me.
    - thfuran 3y ago
      Shutting down all the roads because criminals use them doesn't really make sense. Does the internet equivalent?
- jjmarr 3y ago
  Even assuming this is technically feasible (a premise others don't believe), it is ethically wrong to cut off an entire country from the Internet because a small portion of the population are committing crimes. Imagine a large American city getting cut off from Facebook because there are many people selling shoplifted items on FB Marketplace and your underfunded govt doesn't have the financial ability to crack down on them. The average person would lose all contact with friends and family because some people are using a service to commit crimes.
  - ben_w 3y ago
    There's a right to life, there's no right to social media. I think it's fine to cut off FB entirely in response… but then, I also think FB monetised what was previously free, collecting rent on being social, and as such everyone will be better off if it gets blocked in their area. Including the advertisers. Sales can't exceed global income, so at this point the extra ad slots being forced everywhere only serve to make the advertisers part of a Nash game to spend ever more to fight each other for the same potential reward.
  - delfinom 3y ago
    It's not wrong, it's politics. Said country affected can sign an extradition treaty to restore access.
  - mikrotikker 3y ago
    They can use other communication services

colechristensen 3y ago

Sure it is. If a country can’t find and enforce a law or extradite someone for doing such a thing, order the carrier of the extortion messages to block the entire country or charge the message carrier itself, especially if minors are involved. Like if Facebook is being a safe haven for Nigerian extortionists, either they block Nigeria or Australia blocks Facebook.

thrownaway561 3y ago
if they do that they will just use VPNs. you can't stop this no matter what, you just have to educate people and hope they don't fall victim.
- djaouen 3y ago
  Sanction VPNs that allow this behavior. Force them to use botnets, which means they have to interact with other criminals. :)
- colechristensen 3y ago
  Then blackhole the VPNs when they're involved in crime and make them share legal financial responsibility for the crimes they enable. Eventually you keep walking down this line until you write laws that local ISPs are required to globally blackhole countries which otherwise evade law enforcement.
  - orwin 3y ago
    I can make a VPN for like 3 euro on AWS (thinking about it, I can probably do it with their free tier offer). I could probably do the same for a bit more work and study on most PaaS.
    - hsbauauvhabzb 3y ago
      Block aws ranges then, Facebook is for residential users. Residential VPNs exist, but they cost money and increase the barrier for entry, while also being a choke point for abuse.
- bikemore 3y ago
  "Don't bother enforcing laws because people try to break them" is an express ticket to a Mad Max world. It's also not a particularly interesting or practical solution, and honestly comes off as a little disingenuous.
- BlackFly 3y ago
  I'm going to go out on a limb and suggest that a teenager that is willing to invest time into setting up a VPN so that they can talk to Nigerians probably isn't the sort of teenager to have this kind of problem. We let people fly to countries without extradition orders. VPNs can be seen just like that: crossing the digital border. But for a company operating in a nation, it makes sense to impose regulation.
  - Mordisquitos 3y ago
    I'm going out on a different limb and suggest that a scammer that is unable to invest time into setting up a VPN so that they can talk to teenagers outside of Nigeria probably isn't the sort of scammer that causes this kind of problem.
thfuran 3y ago
What you're describing is the end of the internet.
- colechristensen 3y ago
  It's really not. Facebook making money off of illegal activity conveniently hidden behind national borders is not the cornerstone of the Internet.
  - thfuran 3y ago
    You think that argument stops at Facebook? Why won't it apply to the VPNs people use to get around the geofencing on Facebook, to all the other social media platforms, to all messaging services, and so on? Now you've blocked huge swaths of services and fragmented all the platforms.
    - ben_w 3y ago
      I think, if The Hitchhikers Guide to the Galaxy was remade today, the quote would be: "…an utterly insignificant little blue green planet whose ape-descended life forms are so amazingly primitive that they still think social media is a pretty neat idea."
  - Ekaros 3y ago
    So then ban Facebook. Problem solved. Start advocating this in congress now.
- CJefferson 3y ago
  Honestly, maybe it’s time to consider that. Saying “oh well, let’s give up on laws because the internet is worldwide and unlimited” doesn’t feel like a good choice to me.
  - thfuran 3y ago
    Shutting down all the roads because criminals use them doesn't really make sense. Does the internet equivalent?
jjmarr 3y ago
Even assuming this is technically feasible (a premise others don't believe), it is ethically wrong to cut off an entire country from the Internet because a small portion of the population are committing crimes. Imagine a large American city getting cut off from Facebook because there are many people selling shoplifted items on FB Marketplace and your underfunded govt doesn't have the financial ability to crack down on them. The average person would lose all contact with friends and family because some people are using a service to commit crimes.
- ben_w 3y ago
  There's a right to life, there's no right to social media. I think it's fine to cut off FB entirely in response… but then, I also think FB monetised what was previously free, collecting rent on being social, and as such everyone will be better off if it gets blocked in their area. Including the advertisers. Sales can't exceed global income, so at this point the extra ad slots being forced everywhere only serve to make the advertisers part of a Nash game to spend ever more to fight each other for the same potential reward.
- delfinom 3y ago
  It's not wrong, it's politics. Said country affected can sign an extradition treaty to restore access.
- mikrotikker 3y ago
  They can use other communication services