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> I want to do more. Launch projects, earn more money, live more experiences. The only thing you need is to stop this idea that living a richer life means earn

> I want to do more. Launch projects, earn more money, live more experiences. The only thing you need is to stop this idea that living a richer life means earning/spending a lot of money / reaources. There's so much personal development you can do without participating in the materialistic rat race.

amarcheschi 3y ago
As a young cs students where even the uni professors tell us there's more about it than just money, what would you say is something regarding personal development to do?
- orthoxerox 3y ago
  Get a hobby that you can do outdoors with other people. Hiking, hunting, paddling, sailing, bouldering, volunteering, playing sports, LARPing, reenacting... Embed yourself into the local community, become a pillar of it. Start a family and support your children, don't try to mould them into what you wish you could have been.
  - sentfromrevolut 3y ago
    [flagged]
    - 392 3y ago
      No distractions like friends? No awareness that Max has headlines like "forged by his father's beatings and humiliation?" You should probably seek a less results driven focus on life, perhaps with a therapist, unless just trolling in which case carry on. But regardless, there's an article called "Why we stopped making Einsteins" that you may find interesting.
      - sentfromrevolut 3y ago
        I'm not trolling. I have been against having children in the past, doing the whole beta bucks provider role thing for a family, basically just other people living off me , well that seemed ridiculous to me. However when I reframed the situation as being able to respawn myself and achieve my dreams through my kid it makes it very interesting. Many other men have done this. Some may disagree but it's not illegal to do it. I had a quick look at "Why we stopped making Einsteins". Some good ideas there thanks.
    - shrimp_emoji 3y ago
      That only works if you get lucky. It's all nature, no nurture. If the dice spit out a kid who hates football, that plan is a massive, painful waste of time.
      - sentfromrevolut 3y ago
        A lot of footballers are only in the game for the money. I will manipulate the kid into being extremely materialistic and build his entire ego and self image around the football.
- elros 3y ago
  Learning things for fun and not just for profit. Physical development, learning a new sport. Spiritual development, meditating, observing. Engaging in arts, creating, exploring. Helping the less fortunate, volunteering, teaching. Traveling, learning about different cultures, different languages. Cooking. Spending time in nature, watching animals, birds, mushrooms, sunsets. Photography. These are just some examples, the list is endless :-) Personally I’ve grown a lot from gardening and weightlifting. Having children made me more human.
- hereonout2 3y ago
  During my late 20s I realised I was very good at my programming job but not much use at anything else. It was quite a disappointing realisation. I started to do less and eventually no programming outside of office hours and instead invest my spare time in different hobbies and experiences. I found gaining these new skills really helped build my confidence. 15 years later I'm not just a programmer, I'm a also a motorcyclist, experienced carpenter, been a member of certain meet up groups for over a decade, travelled to a few exotic locations, flown upside down in a plane, the list goes on. None of these things are exceptional but doing this extra stuff has given me enough dimensions that I kind of feel comfortable with the way I've done the last 15 years. This along with starting a relationship and building a family is enough for me now. Sure, I could have done more but compared to the corporate quagmire of my 20s things are very different.
  - sebastiansm 3y ago
    Programmers and wood. Best friends forever.
    - hereonout2 3y ago
      Indeed, it's almost a cliche. I believe it satisfies some sort of primeval urge magnified by sitting in front of a screen for decades.
  - dotnet00 3y ago
    I can relate to this pretty strongly, although on a slightly earlier timeline. Went through a similar period of focusing entirely on coding in my teens and early 20s, always occupied by personal projects when not studying etc. Realized how much of myself I had cut off for that (and how little value it'd hold on its own) and started diversifying what I did in downtime, and now I seldom code outside of work. I haven't outright dropped coding for personal projects, rather just that the singular task of coding doesn't define my down time. Instead I've picked up tinkering with electronics, building and playing with 3d printers, learning languages and drawing. I feel like as a result I've become closer to my idea of the kind of person I'd find interesting and attractive, someone who has a variety of aspects to themselves rather than just being defined by being a 'rockstar' at their job. Initially I had worried that this would cause me to fall behind professionally, but so far that hasn't really been an issue, I still typically end up having tinkered with some new technology well before it becomes relevant professionally.
xvilka 3y ago
I would disagree. If you think only about yourself - yes, it's not about the money. But if you want make life of your children, grandchildren, etc better, the only answer is money, building generational wealth.
- soufron 3y ago
  Absolutely not. Children and grandchildren are their own persons. The world is full of people who got rich through heritage and who live miserable lives - even when being materially fulfilled. I would add that this state of mind denotes a characteristic control anguish. When you're dead, you're dead. You need to let go.
  - xvilka 3y ago
    Of course it doesn't guarantee the success, but it helps a lot.
    - ricardobeat 3y ago
      Depends on the definition of “success”. If it’s about raising good people, with decent values and a drive to make the world better, a fat inheritance is probably not a good predictor.
    - idiotsecant 3y ago
      Very nearly without exception children who come from backgrounds of generational wealth are terrible people, in my experience.
- vasco 3y ago
  You can work a whole life for generation wealth only to have your kid spend it all in one month as soon as you die. Or to waste away not doing anything while receiving monthly from a trust fund. Everyone decides what their life to be about, but I'd reflect on leaving too much of your life's meaning to "kick in" only when you're dead. If your whole purpose is to "set your family up forever", a lot of that is out of your control. Whereas if your purpose is to hang out have fun and support each other's goals, usually you can do that right away
dakiol 3y ago
> There's so much personal development you can do without participating in the materialistic rat race. That takes money, although in a different form: time. I can only enjoy those experiences if I have time for them (and I’m not talking about enjoying them after working 8h during the day, because I end up exhausted and cannot enjoy anything at all). So, in order to enjoy things I need to work less, which means less money. That’s the price. It’s always money
- goodpoint 3y ago
  > That takes money, although in a different form: time > That’s the price. It’s always money Tell that to unemployed people. To children. To retired people. To people with serious sickness. Time is not money.
  - dartos 3y ago
    It isn’t, but it has similar uses. With more money you have more time. not needing to wait in line at a check cashing or payday loan office, not needing to wait in the ER because you can’t afford primary care, not needing to get your car fixed every year because you can afford one with fewer miles. There’s a lot of hidden time costs if you’re not well off.
    - magicpin 3y ago
      Hell just the time sink of using a laundromat with defective machines vs filling up your own machine and moving over loads when it’s convenient for you
      - dartos 3y ago
        Wow yes exactly this. Didn’t even think about laundromats
    - goodpoint 3y ago
      > There’s a lot of hidden time costs if you’re not well off. Of course and that's my point.
felipefar 3y ago
> The only thing you need is to stop this idea that living a richer life means earning/spending a lot of money / reaources. There's so much personal development you can do without participating in the materialistic rat race. If you launch projects to gain fame, sure it is materialistic. But you can work on projects that help you understand things better, or to build the personality you want to have, both of which are the opposite of materialism. They aren't egoistic as well, because you can then share your solutions with others, which are also going to benefit from it.
- The_Colonel 3y ago
  > But you can work on projects that help you understand things better Sure. Although it seemed OP mentioned this in a different context since it was immediately followed by "earn more money". I think the real distinction whether these projects are outwards oriented or inwards. How do you measure the success? Is it by the adoption numbers or by the things you've learned and the time you enjoyed?
krumpet 3y ago
This is my focus. Though admittedly selfish, I'm spending time learning more songs on the guitar, improving my cooking skills, mastering a new language, etc. Once our children are out of the house, I plan to also become more involved in supporting our community. It took time to understand that my time is better spent supporting our kids' activities and maintaining an organized home than chasing another promotion.

amarcheschi 3y ago

As a young cs students where even the uni professors tell us there's more about it than just money, what would you say is something regarding personal development to do?

orthoxerox 3y ago
Get a hobby that you can do outdoors with other people. Hiking, hunting, paddling, sailing, bouldering, volunteering, playing sports, LARPing, reenacting... Embed yourself into the local community, become a pillar of it. Start a family and support your children, don't try to mould them into what you wish you could have been.
- sentfromrevolut 3y ago
  [flagged]
  - 392 3y ago
    No distractions like friends? No awareness that Max has headlines like "forged by his father's beatings and humiliation?" You should probably seek a less results driven focus on life, perhaps with a therapist, unless just trolling in which case carry on. But regardless, there's an article called "Why we stopped making Einsteins" that you may find interesting.
    - sentfromrevolut 3y ago
      I'm not trolling. I have been against having children in the past, doing the whole beta bucks provider role thing for a family, basically just other people living off me , well that seemed ridiculous to me. However when I reframed the situation as being able to respawn myself and achieve my dreams through my kid it makes it very interesting. Many other men have done this. Some may disagree but it's not illegal to do it. I had a quick look at "Why we stopped making Einsteins". Some good ideas there thanks.
  - shrimp_emoji 3y ago
    That only works if you get lucky. It's all nature, no nurture. If the dice spit out a kid who hates football, that plan is a massive, painful waste of time.
    - sentfromrevolut 3y ago
      A lot of footballers are only in the game for the money. I will manipulate the kid into being extremely materialistic and build his entire ego and self image around the football.
elros 3y ago
Learning things for fun and not just for profit. Physical development, learning a new sport. Spiritual development, meditating, observing. Engaging in arts, creating, exploring. Helping the less fortunate, volunteering, teaching. Traveling, learning about different cultures, different languages. Cooking. Spending time in nature, watching animals, birds, mushrooms, sunsets. Photography. These are just some examples, the list is endless :-) Personally I’ve grown a lot from gardening and weightlifting. Having children made me more human.
hereonout2 3y ago
During my late 20s I realised I was very good at my programming job but not much use at anything else. It was quite a disappointing realisation. I started to do less and eventually no programming outside of office hours and instead invest my spare time in different hobbies and experiences. I found gaining these new skills really helped build my confidence. 15 years later I'm not just a programmer, I'm a also a motorcyclist, experienced carpenter, been a member of certain meet up groups for over a decade, travelled to a few exotic locations, flown upside down in a plane, the list goes on. None of these things are exceptional but doing this extra stuff has given me enough dimensions that I kind of feel comfortable with the way I've done the last 15 years. This along with starting a relationship and building a family is enough for me now. Sure, I could have done more but compared to the corporate quagmire of my 20s things are very different.
- sebastiansm 3y ago
  Programmers and wood. Best friends forever.
  - hereonout2 3y ago
    Indeed, it's almost a cliche. I believe it satisfies some sort of primeval urge magnified by sitting in front of a screen for decades.
- dotnet00 3y ago
  I can relate to this pretty strongly, although on a slightly earlier timeline. Went through a similar period of focusing entirely on coding in my teens and early 20s, always occupied by personal projects when not studying etc. Realized how much of myself I had cut off for that (and how little value it'd hold on its own) and started diversifying what I did in downtime, and now I seldom code outside of work. I haven't outright dropped coding for personal projects, rather just that the singular task of coding doesn't define my down time. Instead I've picked up tinkering with electronics, building and playing with 3d printers, learning languages and drawing. I feel like as a result I've become closer to my idea of the kind of person I'd find interesting and attractive, someone who has a variety of aspects to themselves rather than just being defined by being a 'rockstar' at their job. Initially I had worried that this would cause me to fall behind professionally, but so far that hasn't really been an issue, I still typically end up having tinkered with some new technology well before it becomes relevant professionally.

xvilka 3y ago

I would disagree. If you think only about yourself - yes, it's not about the money. But if you want make life of your children, grandchildren, etc better, the only answer is money, building generational wealth.

soufron 3y ago
Absolutely not. Children and grandchildren are their own persons. The world is full of people who got rich through heritage and who live miserable lives - even when being materially fulfilled. I would add that this state of mind denotes a characteristic control anguish. When you're dead, you're dead. You need to let go.
- xvilka 3y ago
  Of course it doesn't guarantee the success, but it helps a lot.
  - ricardobeat 3y ago
    Depends on the definition of “success”. If it’s about raising good people, with decent values and a drive to make the world better, a fat inheritance is probably not a good predictor.
  - idiotsecant 3y ago
    Very nearly without exception children who come from backgrounds of generational wealth are terrible people, in my experience.
vasco 3y ago
You can work a whole life for generation wealth only to have your kid spend it all in one month as soon as you die. Or to waste away not doing anything while receiving monthly from a trust fund. Everyone decides what their life to be about, but I'd reflect on leaving too much of your life's meaning to "kick in" only when you're dead. If your whole purpose is to "set your family up forever", a lot of that is out of your control. Whereas if your purpose is to hang out have fun and support each other's goals, usually you can do that right away

dakiol 3y ago

> There's so much personal development you can do without participating in the materialistic rat race. That takes money, although in a different form: time. I can only enjoy those experiences if I have time for them (and I’m not talking about enjoying them after working 8h during the day, because I end up exhausted and cannot enjoy anything at all). So, in order to enjoy things I need to work less, which means less money. That’s the price. It’s always money

goodpoint 3y ago
> That takes money, although in a different form: time > That’s the price. It’s always money Tell that to unemployed people. To children. To retired people. To people with serious sickness. Time is not money.
- dartos 3y ago
  It isn’t, but it has similar uses. With more money you have more time. not needing to wait in line at a check cashing or payday loan office, not needing to wait in the ER because you can’t afford primary care, not needing to get your car fixed every year because you can afford one with fewer miles. There’s a lot of hidden time costs if you’re not well off.
  - magicpin 3y ago
    Hell just the time sink of using a laundromat with defective machines vs filling up your own machine and moving over loads when it’s convenient for you
    - dartos 3y ago
      Wow yes exactly this. Didn’t even think about laundromats
  - goodpoint 3y ago
    > There’s a lot of hidden time costs if you’re not well off. Of course and that's my point.

felipefar 3y ago

> The only thing you need is to stop this idea that living a richer life means earning/spending a lot of money / reaources. There's so much personal development you can do without participating in the materialistic rat race. If you launch projects to gain fame, sure it is materialistic. But you can work on projects that help you understand things better, or to build the personality you want to have, both of which are the opposite of materialism. They aren't egoistic as well, because you can then share your solutions with others, which are also going to benefit from it.

The_Colonel 3y ago
> But you can work on projects that help you understand things better Sure. Although it seemed OP mentioned this in a different context since it was immediately followed by "earn more money". I think the real distinction whether these projects are outwards oriented or inwards. How do you measure the success? Is it by the adoption numbers or by the things you've learned and the time you enjoyed?

krumpet 3y ago

This is my focus. Though admittedly selfish, I'm spending time learning more songs on the guitar, improving my cooking skills, mastering a new language, etc. Once our children are out of the house, I plan to also become more involved in supporting our community. It took time to understand that my time is better spent supporting our kids' activities and maintaining an organized home than chasing another promotion.